Antonio Conte - officially NOT the coach of THFC

[Bedfordspurs]

To me the obvious answer is Kulusevski. When he plays he does more of the link job, freeing some space for Kane to do his thing when dropping deep. Giving us a threat from the right both wide and cutting inside unlike Richarlison. Kulusevski also gets more out of Emerson.

Not sure why Kulusevski didn't start before his injury. Certainly hope he'll be back fit and in the starting lineup soon.

Huge, huge, huge miss
People starting to realise how much so
But similarly some forgetting how important he is

 

[harr1984]

I don't think people are really displeased with us, i think its because they see arsenal doing well.
Swop arsenal and Liverpool league positions, which most would have expected at the start of the season, and no one would be moaning.
When they fall away things will return to normal.

Its got nothing to do with Arsenal being top IMO. We have simply been a terrible watch this season as a whole, our passing when we get into the oppositions half has been awful.
Arsenal were ahead of us in the league for most of last season, but we were playing much better than we are right now. Even when we thrashed Leicester in a game you would think we cruised, we were not very good for long periods and a magical few minutes from Son masked that. Agree Kulu is a massive miss, and strange before the injury he wasn't being selected.

At the end of the day we have got results, meaning there will be nothing more than mutterings of discontent whilst that is the case. But if results begin to turn it will be another Jose situation arising. It is cringeworthy reading posts making out as if we are playing fine and enjoying watching the way we are playing. Can you imagine if Chelsea or Arsenal were playing like this, and posters on here saying they are playing ok? No, everyone on here would be saying its been boring, turgid football - lets not pretend otherwise.....

 

[spurspinter1]

Its got nothing to do with Arsenal being top IMO. We have simply been a terrible watch this season as a whole, our passing when we get into the oppositions half has been awful.
Arsenal were ahead of us in the league for most of last season, but we were playing much better than we are right now. Even when we thrashed Leicester in a game you would think we cruised, we were not very good for long periods and a magical few minutes from Son masked that. Agree Kulu is a massive miss, and strange before the injury he wasn't being selected.

At the end of the day we have got results, meaning there will be nothing more than mutterings of discontent whilst that is the case. But if results begin to turn it will be another Jose situation arising. It is cringeworthy reading posts making out as if we are playing fine and enjoying watching the way we are playing. Can you imagine if Chelsea or Arsenal were playing like this, and posters on here saying they are playing ok? No, everyone on here would be saying its been boring, turgid football - lets not pretend otherwise.....

Seriously though, if you don't appreciate the football we're playing that's fine, but it seems an overreach to start being bothered that other people actually have the audacity to see things differently to you...

I get that it's a difficult one if you absolutely don't enjoy watching Conte's style. Some people (not directed at you) just can't wrap their head around a back 3 or a midfield pairing rather than a trio in there, and as such will always be at a loss with our set up..

 

[harr1984]

View attachment 14595

Seriously though, if you don't appreciate the football we're playing that's fine, but it seems an overreach to start being bothered that other people actually have the audacity to see things differently to you...

I get that it's a difficult one if you absolutely don't enjoy watching Conte's style. Some people (not directed at you) just can't wrap their head around a back 3 or a midfield pairing rather than a trio in there, and as such will always be at a loss with our set up..

I agree, but Im still yet to see something reasonable about how we are playing well beyond the fact we have points on the board. I agree that we have been effective, but I seriously question anyone who thinks we have been playing good football in general - I cant think of even one who half where we have really dominated, just been little 10-15 minutes at best. We were playing the same brand of Conte ball last season with mostly the same players, but we were playing much better than we have been this season.

However, I do like @billyiddo point regarding the front 3 are not firing and yet we are in the top 4, so we are not badly positioned at all....

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

Not sure why Kulusevski didn't start before his injury. Certainly hope he'll be back fit and in the starting lineup soon.

I think it's simply Richie's sub performances were demanding a start and Conte didn't want to (but should have) dropped Sonny.

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

We were playing the same brand of Conte ball last season with mostly the same players, but we were playing much better than we have been this season.

So maybe just wait and see if we run into form again. At least there is evidence it works. And even when it's not 'working' we're third in the table.
We play a very specific way, that requires precision in the middle to last third, that's off at the moment. Usually means ball turnover and we're back to defending. But giving up possession is part of Contes tactics. Becoming a possession side and having a creative 3rd player in CM is not going to happen

 

[Bedfordspurs]

So maybe just wait and see if we run into form again. At least there is evidence it works. And even when it's not 'working' we're third in the table.
We play a very specific way, that requires precision in the middle to last third, that's off at the moment. Usually means ball turnover and we're back to defending. But giving up possession is part of Contes tactics. Becoming a possession side and having a creative 3rd player in CM is not going to happen

But it has to happen as everyone keeps on saying we need it
I mean other teams have one and look at how they are all doing
Just because conte has had success not playing a creative cM doesn’t mean he doesn’t need one
And yep… I am being sarcastic

 

[spurspinter1]

I agree, but Im still yet to see something reasonable about how we are playing well beyond the fact we have points on the board. I agree that we have been effective, but I seriously question anyone who thinks we have been playing good football in general - I cant think of even one who half where we have really dominated, just been little 10-15 minutes at best. We were playing the same brand of Conte ball last season with mostly the same players, but we were playing much better than we have been this season.

However, I do like @billyiddo point regarding the front 3 are not firing and yet we are in the top 4, so we are not badly positioned at all....

It'll always come down to what a person's idea of good football is, and that may differ from one to another but totally understandable that a sizable portion of our fanbase aren't enamored with Conte's approach (even when winning), it's not exactly the club's brand and we are guilty of lurching one way to the other ie Jose - Nuno - Antonio..I do feel bad for fans not enjoying the ride but then again I see certain posters who are almost waiting for bad results so they can really stuck the knife in (again not aimed at you!).

Personally I've grown to really admire and respect the way we control games without necessarily needing to control the ball, but it only works if we can tighten things up on the counter / finish chances, so not like last night..

 

[DeanoAustin]

I agree, but Im still yet to see something reasonable about how we are playing well beyond the fact we have points on the board. I agree that we have been effective, but I seriously question anyone who thinks we have been playing good football in general - I cant think of even one who half where we have really dominated, just been little 10-15 minutes at best. We were playing the same brand of Conte ball last season with mostly the same players, but we were playing much better than we have been this season.

However, I do like @billyiddo point regarding the front 3 are not firing and yet we are in the top 4, so we are not badly positioned at all....

These aren't the same thing.

In terms of playing well, it's not as free flowing as I'd ideally like but defensively, we've been really solid. The shape is good and the discipline is very good. You don't see many goals resulting from error prone players like Dier and Romero who look very, very good in a 3.

 

[harr1984]

It'll always come down to what a person's idea of good football is, and that may differ from one to another but totally understandable that a sizable portion of our fanbase aren't enamored with Conte's approach (even when winning), it's not exactly the club's brand and we are guilty of lurching one way to the other ie Jose - Nuno - Antonio..I do feel bad for fans not enjoying the ride but then again I see certain posters who are almost waiting for bad results so they can really stuck the knife in (again not aimed at you!).

Personally I've grown to really admire and respect the way we control games without necessarily needing to control the ball, but it only works if we can tighten things up on the counter / finish chances, so not like last night..

The bolded bit I agree with, really appreciated it last season but this season I think we have been taking the not 'needing to control the ball' bit a bit too literally I dont mind the style Conte wants to play, or the formation etc I just think we have been pretty poor at playing football this season. But I am very aware that the probabilities of us getting better at it later in the season is high....

 

[metalgear]

View attachment 14595

Seriously though, if you don't appreciate the football we're playing that's fine, but it seems an overreach to start being bothered that other people actually have the audacity to see things differently to you...

I get that it's a difficult one if you absolutely don't enjoy watching Conte's style. Some people (not directed at you) just can't wrap their head around a back 3 or a midfield pairing rather than a trio in there, and as such will always be at a loss with our set up..

Well you yknow, that's also your opinion of someone's opinion....

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[harr1984]

These aren't the same thing.

In terms of playing well, it's not as free flowing as I'd ideally like but defensively, we've been really solid. The shape is good and the discipline is very good. You don't see many goals resulting from error prone players like Dier and Romero who look very, very good in a 3.

Agreed. To be fair, I doubt anyone would have any complaints defensively....

 

[glasgowspur]

Its got nothing to do with Arsenal being top IMO. We have simply been a terrible watch this season as a whole, our passing when we get into the oppositions half has been awful.
Arsenal were ahead of us in the league for most of last season, but we were playing much better than we are right now. Even when we thrashed Leicester in a game you would think we cruised, we were not very good for long periods and a magical few minutes from Son masked that. Agree Kulu is a massive miss, and strange before the injury he wasn't being selected.

At the end of the day we have got results, meaning there will be nothing more than mutterings of discontent whilst that is the case. But if results begin to turn it will be another Jose situation arising. It is cringeworthy reading posts making out as if we are playing fine and enjoying watching the way we are playing. Can you imagine if Chelsea or Arsenal were playing like this, and posters on here saying they are playing ok? No, everyone on here would be saying its been boring, turgid football - lets not pretend otherwise.....

I don't think we are playing well, but i can see progression towards a system and the possibility that we will be more entertaining.
Conte, imho, has done the correct thing and started at the back, we are solid and defend fairly well.
The rest will follow, i hope.

 

[spurspinter1]

Well you yknow, that's also your opinion of someone's opinion....

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But now having had time to reflect on it, has it not evolved in to my opinion on my former opinion of someone else's opinion? Heading in to dangerous meta territory here...

Don't let this brief interlude in to philosophy interfere with your kicking and screaming about being third in the league though

 

[metalgear]

Lol no, I kinda enjoy blowing off steam here.


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[MKSpur]

I think it's simply Richie's sub performances were demanding a start and Conte didn't want to (but should have) dropped Sonny.

Yep, there was an argument about letting Sonny play his way back into form but when Kulu is back it makes sense to me that Richarlison starts, he bullies and works the defence from the left and then we unleash a fresh Son who will have more space to operate in to get his touch / rhythm back.

It is the old adage that some players get rated higher by not playing but I think we saw in at least one game where Kulu came on and changed the game. Arguably he changed our trajectory from when he arrived last season and we have no one like him.

 

[Lilbaz]

Its got nothing to do with Arsenal being top IMO. We have simply been a terrible watch this season as a whole, our passing when we get into the oppositions half has been awful.
Arsenal were ahead of us in the league for most of last season, but we were playing much better than we are right now. Even when we thrashed Leicester in a game you would think we cruised, we were not very good for long periods and a magical few minutes from Son masked that. Agree Kulu is a massive miss, and strange before the injury he wasn't being selected.

At the end of the day we have got results, meaning there will be nothing more than mutterings of discontent whilst that is the case. But if results begin to turn it will be another Jose situation arising. It is cringeworthy reading posts making out as if we are playing fine and enjoying watching the way we are playing. Can you imagine if Chelsea or Arsenal were playing like this, and posters on here saying they are playing ok? No, everyone on here would be saying its been boring, turgid football - lets not pretend otherwise.....

Don't think anyone has suggested we're playing well. Just that it might be players not at it rather than the system. Starting sluggish in the first half and misplaced passes are nothing to do with the system.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Must admit I don’t think we’ve played that badly as a whole this season. We haven’t hit anywhere near top form, but we’ve deserved to win the games we have won. Got a bit lucky against Chelsea and WHU and turned over by the goons but we pretty much always never win at those grounds anyway. It’s encouraging that we are picking up points and not being so heavily reliant on Kane and Son as we were last season. My only frustrations have been why Kulusevski isn’t starting every game and why Royal IS. Fix the issue at RWB and get some creativity at CM and I think we will be just fine in terms of challenging for top 4. I think the title is gonna be beyond us for at least another season. We just don’t have the depth or the talent that City have.

 

[Bishop]

But it has to happen as everyone keeps on saying we need it
I mean other teams have one and look at how they are all doing
Just because conte has had success not playing a creative cM doesn’t mean he doesn’t need one
And yep… I am being sarcastic

Conte has never had success when not playing a creative CM. His previous CMs have all had players more creative than we have now.

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[Lemonade Money]

I've actually enjoyed our last three games*, and I can't wait for us to grow into the season. I think Conte wants us to come good at the end, whether that's in a single match or over the season.
I think the bedwetters must be gauging us against the perfect team that always wins, always entertains, never makes mistakes and no play ever breaks down. In which case they'll never be happy...oh wait.

*up until the red card against the goons.