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Antonio Conte - officially NOT the coach of THFC

DubSpur said:
I can imagine Conte going through that goal with the team and what went wrong from the corner and one of the players piping up with "Not my fault boss, it's all Diers for his poor clearance"
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Wouldn't be surprised. Entire team had to change gears to defend a corner they did not expect to concede, at all, because Dier did what Dier does. Probably had an impact.
 
DubaiSpur said:
Wouldn't be surprised. Entire team had to change gears to defend a corner they did not expect to concede, at all, because Dier did what Dier does. Probably had an impact.
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Conte would rip them a new one if they did and you know it.
If they're not ready to defend a corner then they shouldn't be on the pitch, situations can change in a second. Excusing poor play from the team cause somebody fudged up before that is a load of crap.
 
DubaiSpur said:
Wouldn't be surprised. Entire team had to change gears to defend a corner they did not expect to concede, at all, because Dier did what Dier does. Probably had an impact.
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Utter gonads
It was a basic corner that we conceded from
Conte will be fudging furious with that
 
DubaiSpur said:
Who would that be? Lenglet had a decent game. Can't be talking about Kulusevski. Doherty, maybe. Perisic good. Hojbjerg generally okay. Biss has only been here a few months.

Obvious failures like Royal are called out pretty regularly, so can't be him. Who's getting away without blame?

More broadly, since Paratici came in, more signings have succeeded than failed - Romero, Kulu, Bentancur, Perisic, with jury still out on Richy, Biss, Forster and Lenglet, and an obvious failure in Royal.
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Sorry but peh was cack, absolutely cack.
One calm finish shouldn't change that judgement, lost his man for first goal and asleep at the back post for the second.
That you can turn a blind eye to that and yet call out dier for a bad clearance in another wise reasonable performance is bizarre.
 
DubaiSpur said:
So, Doc, Hojbjerg, and...Sess? Struggling to think of any others that fit the description.

And of the three, Doc gets plenty of brick, Sess doesn't but is generally acknowledged as a disappointment. So the only one who's getting away with it seems to be Hojbjerg - would that be accurate?



Ah, I see. I thought you were talking about players who were getting away with sub-par performances.

Agreed re: those three, but think Perisic also qualifies - only been a few months, but has already looked head and shoulders over every left-back since Rose, from Reggy to Davies to Sess.
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I'm talking about how the focus is always on the players who have been here too long when it should be that there are too many sub par players regardless of how long they have been in the team. The squad has changed enough since Poch left that it's not a valid argument anymore that Conte (or whoever is in charge) is failing because of the same players.

Our biggest problem currently is a CM 2 that gets over run whoever they are up against and none of the options fir that position were here 4 years ago. Neither was that complete and utter carthorse we've been playing at RWB all season.
 
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glasgowspur said:
Sorry but peh was cack, absolutely cack.
One calm finish shouldn't change that judgement, lost his man for first goal and asleep at the back post for the second.
That you can turn a blind eye to that and yet call out dier for a bad clearance in another wise reasonable performance is bizarre.
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He scored a goal. Dier conceded one (and it is on him, 100%). Dier is the master of being a disaster that costs us games and seasons with massive errors, but playing half-decently outside of it. He's done it for years, and has had people defending him for years because of it - 'outside of his macaronic error that cost us the game, he played okay'. Heard it a hundred times at this point.

Hojbjerg is the master of not looking all that great but scoring when it matters - at least this season.

Not rocket science as to why one gets more leeway than the other. We need players who step up when it counts. Dier doesn't. PEH does.
 
billyiddo said:
I'm talking about how the focus is always on the players who have been here too long when it should be that there are too many sub par players regardless of how long they have been in the team. The squad has changed enough since Poch left that it's not a valid argument anymore that Conte (or whoever is in charge) is failing because of the same players.

Our biggest problem currently is a CM 2 that gets over run whoever they are up against and none of the options fir that position were here 4 years ago. Neither was that complete and utter carthorse we've been playing at RWB all season.
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That carthorse wasn't playing today, but again, I don't think Royal has escaped scrutiny - he certainly shares the blame for how crap we look.

But we were crap before Royal. We were crap before Hojbjerg. We were crap before Doherty.

When it comes to playing as a cohesive unit, we've been crap since late 2018. The only constants in that time have been the consistently woeful Dier, the mostly mediocre Davies, and the usually terrible Sanchez.

And for some reason, they all still play, and underline our terrible drop in quality since Walker-Toby-Jan-Rose. A massive part of the blame rests with them.
 
DubaiSpur said:
If he's furious with that and not with himself for playing the bombscare that is Eric Dier, he's more of a fool than he appears, tbh.
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Hey he knows more than the fans
Players make mistakes but they don’t always cost you goals
But getting the basics right at a corner js fundamental
 
DubaiSpur said:
That carthorse wasn't playing today, but again, I don't think Royal has escaped scrutiny - he certainly shares the blame for how crap we look.

But we were crap before Royal. We were crap before Hojbjerg. We were crap before Doherty.

When it comes to playing as a cohesive unit, we've been crap since late 2018. The only constants in that time have been the consistently woeful Dier, the mostly mediocre Davies, and the usually terrible Sanchez.

And for some reason, they all still play, and underline our terrible drop in quality since Walker-Toby-Jan-Rose. A massive part of the blame rests with them.
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Davies & Sanchez didn't play/start today either yet you're still taking aim at them? Cone on man.

There being players here throughout that period doesn't mean anything other than we have some players not good enough that have been here a while - they aren't the cause of the problem anymore than than the players signed since that haven't been good enough.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Hey he knows more than the fans
Players make mistakes but they don’t always cost you goals
But getting the basics right at a corner js fundamental
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He knows more than me, that's for sure. But 'players make mistakes' is letting Dier off lightly - you are guaranteed shipping a massive chance with him on the field with at least one ridiculous error every game, for years and years now.

He is guaranteed to do it, without fail - some utterly brainless error that leaves you with your head in your hands, and then he plays roughly decently the rest of the game and people let him off for the horror show he delivers in the middle of it.

Defending a corner no one in the stadium expected us to concede is hard. I don't blame the team for not being able to do it as much as I blame Dier for putting his teammates in that position to begin with.
 
DubaiSpur said:
He knows more than me, that's for sure. But 'players make mistakes' is letting Dier off lightly - you are guaranteed shipping a massive chance with him on the field with at least one ridiculous error every game, for years and years now.

He is guaranteed to do it, without fail - some utterly brainless error that leaves you with your head in your hands, and then he plays roughly decently the rest of the game and people let him off for the horror show he delivers in the middle of it.

Defending a corner no one in the stadium expected us to concede is hard. I don't blame the team for not being able to do it as much as I blame Dier for putting his teammates in that position to begin with.
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That corner wasn’t a massive chance
It was a basic corner that was so poorly defended
Doesn’t matter if we expect to concede it… mark your man and you don’t concede
 
billyiddo said:
Davies & Sanchez didn't play/start today either yet you're still taking aim at them? Cone on man.

There being players here throughout that period doesn't mean anything other than we have some players not good enough that have been here a while - they aren't the cause of the problem anymore than than the players signed since that haven't been good enough.
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Not entirely. When they all play, we are guaranteed to struggle. When one of them plays, we are generally guaranteed to struggle at least some of the time in each game.

The reason is three fold. 1) every single team in the league has better defenders than those three, so they are simply outclassed. 2) All of them are sub-par on the ball, so we struggle to build anything while the opponents know they are guaranteed turnovers with a simple press. 3) Two of them are bombscares, so the team know and opponents know we will concede big chances, and there is nervousness on our part and confidence on the part of the opponent.

But, more broadly, I agree that they're not the only reason for why we struggle - they're symptomatic of our acceptance of mediocrity, not the sole reason for it. As I said, we need better quality everywhere to make *any* tactics work.
 
His ability to get us firing in the second half is something to behold and I'm being serious there but I'm equally at a loss to explain how that doesn't ever translate to decent starts to games.

What kinda talks being made at HT not at the start....its odd
 
DubaiSpur said:
He scored a goal. Dier conceded one (and it is on him, 100%). Dier is the master of being a disaster that costs us games and seasons with massive errors, but playing half-decently outside of it. He's done it for years, and has had people defending him for years because of it - 'outside of his macaronic error that cost us the game, he played okay'. Heard it a hundred times at this point.

Hojbjerg is the master of not looking all that great but scoring when it matters - at least this season.

Not rocket science as to why one gets more leeway than the other. We need players who step up when it counts. Dier doesn't. PEH does.
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Peh was the closest player to the two goal scorers, he does his job none of them score.
You don't like dier, thats fine, but don't build a case for that on the a guy who has cost us goal after goal this season by not doing his job.
 
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