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Son Heung-Min

Son may be past his best but that's not his fault. Let's be real here he has been out of our league for many years and could easily have kicked up a fuss to go to a more successful club. What he must think when he heara ridiculous stuff from so called 'fans' like that?

If he wasn't already regretting not leaving at his peak to join a team who actually win things he might be now.
 
Sad to say it looks like he has got past his best and has struggles in most games this season, he also looks knackered most of the time as well. IF we are going to play him then maybe as a sub late on or if he starts games should be taken off.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
They literally stride out of defence with the ball when he plays because he doesn’t engage them meaning they can oaky higher up
And when we attack they create a nice easy line because…. He doesn’t engage the CBs
My best mate is an Everton fan and he asked me if son had been this scared of the big men all season
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All career. A natural coward in the physical elements of the game. He's 6 foot and quite thick set as well.
 
billyiddo said:
The video may be pointed at Son but I don't think that's where the chants were directed
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Was my first thought. Same chant as the Tamworth fans were aiming at Ange behind the dugout. I think generally away fans are more forgiving in my experience, especially toward Son
 
I've been saying since last season that for me he's lost that physical edge and really can only play striker. With that in mind I don't think we've used him intelligently this season, flogging him game after game playing a LWF role that he's no longer capable of playing.

What we should have done is kept him as the rotational backup striker option. The guy we bring on when we need a goal, or the guy when Solanke isn't working and we want to try something different. Instead we've flogged him playing a role he can't anymore and now when we actually do need to use him as a striker he's shagged out.

I accept that the idea was probably for Odobert to get a lot of games this season but I don't think if that would have happened and the problem is as soon as he's injured our crappy options are Son and flipping Werner. This is why Werner coming back was such a waste of a squad place and why I was so vehemently against it. He can not be relied to even offer reasonable competition.
 
Bishop said:
I've been saying since last season that for me he's lost that physical edge and really can only play striker. With that in mind I don't think we've used him intelligently this season, flogging him game after game playing a LWF role that he's no longer capable of playing.

What we should have done is kept him as the rotational backup striker option. The guy we bring on when we need a goal, or the guy when Solanke isn't working and we want to try something different. Instead we've flogged him playing a role he can't anymore and now when we actually do need to use him as a striker he's shagged out.

I accept that the idea was probably for Odobert to get a lot of games this season but I don't think if that would have happened and the problem is as soon as he's injured our crappy options are Son and flipping Werner. This is why Werner coming back was such a waste of a squad place and why I was so vehemently against it. He can not be relied to even offer reasonable competition.
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The challenge I have with your response is that it is naturally constrained by you only working within Ange's parameters. It's such a shame to me that we can't even think about a system with Solanke and Sonny working as a pair, still leveraging Dom's considerable defensive capabilities. A system where Sonny can play in an around Dom but also has license to get into wide areas on both sides of the pitch, especially that channel between centre half and full-back.

These conversations unfortunately always come compromised, and a lot come back to the full-back role. Recently, Sonny seemed ultimately more comfortable when Reggie was running the entire left hand side and Madds doing his stuff in the midfield pockets. Best I've seen Sonny for a while.

I guess we know Ange isn't changing this system and we're just going to see Son peter out. As you say, his best chance is to be used sparingly and kept fresh.
 
Muttley said:
The challenge I have with your response is that it is naturally constrained by you only working within Ange's parameters. It's such a shame to me that we can't even think about a system with Solanke and Sonny working as a pair, still leveraging Dom's considerable defensive capabilities. A system where Sonny can play in an around Dom but also has license to get into wide areas on both sides of the pitch, especially that channel between centre half and full-back.

These conversations unfortunately always come compromised, and a lot come back to the full-back role. Recently, Sonny seemed ultimately more comfortable when Reggie was running the entire left hand side and Madds doing his stuff in the midfield pockets. Best I've seen Sonny for a while.

I guess we know Ange isn't changing this system and we're just going to see Son peter out. As you say, his best chance is to be used sparingly and kept fresh.
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Son can't play wide full stop. He hasn't the pace to beat a defender, he doesn't have the skill to beat a defender and now even his shooting is nowhere near what it used to be. He's not good enough to be changing systems and let him float around just so we can fit him in, that's what you do with star players - he's so far off that now, he's simply not the player he was....
 
harr1984 said:
Son can't play wide full stop. He hasn't the pace to beat a defender, he doesn't have the skill to beat a defender and now even his shooting is nowhere near what it used to be. He's not good enough to be changing systems and let him float around just so we can fit him in, that's what you do with star players - he's so far off that now, he's simply not the player he was....
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Perhaps, but I think you're drawing conclusions on a knackered player. I'd like to see a rotated, fresh Son especially from the bench. That finishing is probably just a blip. He can beat players, but I prefer it when he's got into that channel between centre half and full-back. His two-footedness make him quite lethal there.

Can you not imagine a game where our normal tactics aren't working, so we switch to wide full-backs and bring in Son up top with Dom and end up the winners? I can. It's not about changing the system for one player. It's about game management.
 
Muttley said:
Perhaps, but I think you're drawing conclusions on a knackered player. I'd like to see a rotated, fresh Son especially from the bench. That finishing is probably just a blip. He can beat players, but I prefer it when he's got into that channel between centre half and full-back. His two-footedness make him quite lethal there.

Can you not imagine a game where our normal tactics aren't working, so we switch to wide full-backs and bring in Son up top with Dom and end up the winners? I can. It's not about changing the system for one player. It's about game management.
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Tired Son is little better than Werner. Fresh Son is still a very good player.

We did see more overlapping full backs earlier this season, with Son coming inside more imo. But none of that helps or works if it's tired Son on the pitch.
 
Muttley said:
Perhaps, but I think you're drawing conclusions on a knackered player. I'd like to see a rotated, fresh Son especially from the bench. That finishing is probably just a blip. He can beat players, but I prefer it when he's got into that channel between centre half and full-back. His two-footedness make him quite lethal there.

Can you not imagine a game where our normal tactics aren't working, so we switch to wide full-backs and bring in Son up top with Dom and end up the winners? I can. It's not about changing the system for one player. It's about game management.
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No I'm not. Just like Bishop, I'm on record as saying last season he was on the decline, him being tired now only highlights the drop in quality. Playing him centrally makes sense more than wide, but his finishing is getting worse too. If everyone was fit he would do well to get game time even from the bench for me. Moore and Odobert are far more likely to create something out wide than him, and both Solanke and Richi I would have ahead of him up front all day every day. I love the guy, but one of Anges biggest mistakes was making him captain and it's time to accept he's done here.....
 
harr1984 said:
No I'm not. Just like Bishop, I'm on record as saying last season he was on the decline, him being tired now only highlights the drop in quality. Playing him centrally makes sense more than wide, but his finishing is getting worse too. If everyone was fit he would do well to get game time even from the bench for me. Moore and Odobert are far more likely to create something out wide than him, and both Solanke and Richi I would have ahead of him up front all day every day. I love the guy, but one of Anges biggest mistakes was making him captain and it's time to accept he's done here.....
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No issues with him being captain. But had Odobert, Moore and Richarlison been fit most of the season I think Son would/should have played a lot less than he has this season.
 
harr1984 said:
No I'm not. Just like Bishop, I'm on record as saying last season he was on the decline, him being tired now only highlights the drop in quality. Playing him centrally makes sense more than wide, but his finishing is getting worse too. If everyone was fit he would do well to get game time even from the bench for me. Moore and Odobert are far more likely to create something out wide than him, and both Solanke and Richi I would have ahead of him up front all day every day. I love the guy, but one of Anges biggest mistakes was making him captain and it's time to accept he's done here.....
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braineclipse said:
No issues with him being captain. But had Odobert, Moore and Richarlison been fit most of the season I think Son would/should have played a lot less than he has this season.
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I agree about making him captain. Ange apparently looked at the group independently and got to the conclusion that the guy that was operating as the leader was Sonny. Was Ange dealing with his unconscious biases because he knew Sonny from the SK vs Oz encounters over the years. Probably. He would never be my captain at Spurs.

If we had our full compliment this season then our midfield would have been fresher with Biss, Bents, Sarr, Kulu and Madds rotating and Gray / Bergval being eased into the equation. That is very decent. Up top we would have had probably seen the major minutes shared between Solanke, Johnson, Odobert, Richi and Son. I'm not sure we would have seen Moore over-exposed. I do think Sonny would have performed way better in that setup.
 
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