***OMT TOTTENHAM HOTSPUR vs Liverpool***

[Bedfordspurs]

Thanks. I think that's the closest I'm going to get to an answer to my question - it's philosophy first, points second, no matter what.
Which is great if it works out.
Disastrous if it doesn't.

But all top managers drive that approach
It’s why they are successful and get these opportunities
But you need the tools of a certain quality and key… quantity to do that
Our squad is good enough imo when all are fit. But that’s never gonna happen hence the issue
The to have so many missing across the same areas is mad
4 lefts wingers out at the same time
3 Cbs out at the same time
Bonkers

 

[Bishop]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1871142774013034605

Good analysis of we are having to try to play at the moment with a make shift defence

I see you making excuses...again. our defence was noo good when everyone was fit either. Remember when you were blaming Romero for all of our ills. It's the system, it puts too much pressure on the defenders to always make the correct decision which is an impossible ask. Play against a team as good as Liverpool and they'll score 6. Yes we had a makeshift backline but bro, don't lie to yourself even if we had Romero and VDV in optimum condition Liverpool would still expose us time after time. It's the nature of how we try to defend.

 

[monkeybarry]

But all top managers drive that approach
It’s why they are successful and get these opportunities
But you need the tools of a certain quality and key… quantity to do that
Our squad is good enough imo when all are fit. But that’s never gonna happen hence the issue
The to have so many missing across the same areas is mad
4 lefts wingers out at the same time
3 Cbs out at the same time
Bonkers

They don't, not at all.
They have a core set of principles and styles (plural) and use these as the basis to set up their team; they also make tweaks and changes appropriate to the situation they are currently in and during the game.

A perfect illustration - I'm going to use Ferguson, because he is the best of all time. The European game against someone really good (Bayern I think), where to told Park that his role was literally to do nothing more than mark their danger man (was it Ballack?). Be his shadow.
That kind of anti football wasn't his week in week out philosophy - but it was needed for the circumstances of that one game, to get the result.

Can you imagine Ange even contemplating that? I can't.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I see you making excuses...again. our defence was noo good when everyone was fit either. Remember when you were blaming Romero for all of our ills. It's the system, it puts too much pressure on the defenders to always make the correct decision which is an impossible ask. Play against a team as good as Liverpool and they'll score 6. Yes we had a makeshift backline but bro, don't lie to yourself even if we had Romero and VDV in optimum condition Liverpool would still expose us time after time. It's the nature of how we try to defend.

Romero was failing in a fully fit side and directly accountable .. he literally handed off players and walked away several time and also decided to mark no one on many occasions. But he passes the ball better than anyone which is key in Ange ball as we know
I don’t think we would have suffered as much with a fully fit defence though
If you don’t think the injuries are affecting us then crack on
I think it’s a huge issue and something I haven’t seen since Gerry Francis era
We have make shift defence currently that consists of 2 knackered and possibly injured full backs
1 CB who is 22
A CM playing out of position
And a FB covering both sides that the previous and current manager didn’t play for 3 seasons
Oh… and an aging keeper who can’t play thsi football

 

[Bedfordspurs]

They don't, not at all.
They have a core set of principles and styles (plural) and use these as the basis to set up their team; they also make tweaks and changes appropriate to the situation they are currently in and during the game.

A perfect illustration - I'm going to use Ferguson, because he is the best of all time. The European game against someone really good (Bayern I think), where to told Park that his role was literally to do nothing more than mark their danger man (was it Ballack?). Be his shadow.
That kind of anti football wasn't his week in week out philosophy - but it was needed for the circumstances of that one game, to get the result.

Can you imagine Ange even contemplating that? I can't.

That was a match specific thing with many options in his squad
Did Defoe do that in his first 3 seasons at United? No. Because he didn’t have the players or the games to do it in
Pep lost a CL final because he did change… daftly and Chelsea won. The next CL final he didn’t change and they won

 

[Bishop]

Romero was failing in a fully fit side and directly accountable .. he literally handed off players and walked away several time and also decided to mark no one on many occasions. But he passes the ball better than anyone which is key in Ange ball as we know
I don’t think we would have suffered as much with a fully fit defence though
If you don’t think the injuries are affecting us then crack on
I think it’s a huge issue and something I haven’t seen since Gerry Francis era
We have make shift defence currently that consists of 2 knackered and possibly injured full backs
1 CB who is 22
A CM playing out of position
And a FB covering both sides that the previous and current manager didn’t play for 3 seasons
Oh… and an aging keeper who can’t play thsi football

Fit defence unfit defence we concede silly goals and always give away golden opportunities. It doesn't who is playing, Romero, VDV, Dragusin they are all guilty of this so is the players or the system we are trying to play?

The injuries are hampering us sure, but we were brick defensively before the injuries. We are brick defensively with the injuries. It doesn't make any difference.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Fit defence unfit defence we concede silly goals and always give away golden opportunities. It doesn't who is playing, Romero, VDV, Dragusin they are all guilty of this so is the players or the system we are trying to play?

The injuries are hampering us sure, but we were brick defensively before the injuries. We are brick defensively with the injuries. It doesn't make any difference.

We really weren’t brick
We had a very decent record
The issue was single goal margins

 

[monkeybarry]

That was a match specific thing with many options in his squad
Did Defoe do that in his first 3 seasons at United? No. Because he didn’t have the players or the games to do it in
Pep lost a CL final because he did change… daftly and Chelsea won. The next CL final he didn’t change and they won

Exactly. That's my point. Make changes for individual games and in game until we get out of the other side of the injury crisis, then go back to your perfect principles that will wipe every other team off the face of the earth.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Exactly. That's my point. Make changes for individual games and in game until we get out of the other side of the injury crisis, then go back to your perfect principles that will wipe every other team off the face of the earth.

I haven’t seen a coach do that this early in their tenure

 

[Mosquito_Coasting]

To concede 6 at home is painful let’s be honest although scoring 3 would typically be enough to win. Great support today. I am worried for the semi I must admit.

We only score three because we concede six. All our attackers numbers aren't actually that accurate as in a normal (and successful) team they probably wouldn't be this high.

 

[Baleforce]

They don't, not at all.
They have a core set of principles and styles (plural) and use these as the basis to set up their team; they also make tweaks and changes appropriate to the situation they are currently in and during the game.

A perfect illustration - I'm going to use Ferguson, because he is the best of all time. The European game against someone really good (Bayern I think), where to told Park that his role was literally to do nothing more than mark their danger man (was it Ballack?). Be his shadow.
That kind of anti football wasn't his week in week out philosophy - but it was needed for the circumstances of that one game, to get the result.

Can you imagine Ange even contemplating that? I can't.

Sir Alex was amazing, he used at least 4 different base systems in his time at United, and won with all of them.

He’d also change things drastically in games if it wasn’t working.

 

[Jurgen the German]

We really weren’t brick
We had a very decent record
The issue was single goal margins

Bedford you clearly are a student of the game and know a lot about football, but are you really of the opinion that the system isn’t contributing the sheer volume of shots, chances and goals we concede? I don’t think anyone has denied we have had rotten luck with injuries (how much of that is luck and how much of it is down to Ange’s style and methods is very much up for debate mind) but there’s only so much that injuries account for. As bishop said, we didn’t ever look solid regardless of who is in our back line, we don’t have a sound shape nor do we have solid foundations. It’s all last ditch stuff and we never look in control. Now a top class DM instead of Bissouma would probably help but it would still paper over the cracks of Ange’s system. We were conceding 3’s and 4’s last season even with a fully fit back line. That’s before you even mention how poorly we deal with set pieces which are a perfectly legitimate way to score goals.

 

[Mikey10]

‘We have to learn’: Kulusevski on Ange-ball and what next for Spurs

Swede knows after 6-3 defeat there are moments for team to be more solid, more savvy, to consider the broader context

www.theguardian.com

‘In the end, it’s about whether Spurs’s approach is sustainable. “No, maybe not,” Kulusevski said. “But you have to improve. You have to find ways. Maybe we should have let them have the ball more, but that’s not how we play. We went out, we gave everything, it didn’t work. Maybe we learn for the next time.”

Poor bloke sounds as confused as some of the rest of us.

 

[SpurMeUp]

We really weren’t brick
We had a very decent record
The issue was single goal margins

Its just simple facts. But the whingers try to erode the truth.

 

[SpurMeUp]

‘We have to learn’: Kulusevski on Ange-ball and what next for Spurs

Swede knows after 6-3 defeat there are moments for team to be more solid, more savvy, to consider the broader context

www.theguardian.com

‘In the end, it’s about whether Spurs’s approach is sustainable. “No, maybe not,” Kulusevski said. “But you have to improve. You have to find ways. Maybe we should have let them have the ball more, but that’s not how we play. We went out, we gave everything, it didn’t work. Maybe we learn for the next time.”

Poor bloke sounds as confused as some of the rest of us.

He's playing the best football of his career. Poor bloke facing the negativity from the media, that he has to answer, and from his own fans.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Its just simple facts. But the whingers try to erode the truth.

It’s more than that
But when our stats were good we still had people saying we were bad
That’s what I don’t get
I even saw people going on about eriksen having some shots midweek that we’re blocked by way of saying United were better… that’s really odd too, to me

 

[Bedfordspurs]

‘We have to learn’: Kulusevski on Ange-ball and what next for Spurs

Swede knows after 6-3 defeat there are moments for team to be more solid, more savvy, to consider the broader context

www.theguardian.com

‘In the end, it’s about whether Spurs’s approach is sustainable. “No, maybe not,” Kulusevski said. “But you have to improve. You have to find ways. Maybe we should have let them have the ball more, but that’s not how we play. We went out, we gave everything, it didn’t work. Maybe we learn for the next time.”

Poor bloke sounds as confused as some of the rest of us.

Sounds like he is behind the system and knows he is playing in a side that’s developing

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Bedford you clearly are a student of the game and know a lot about football, but are you really of the opinion that the system isn’t contributing the sheer volume of shots, chances and goals we concede? I don’t think anyone has denied we have had rotten luck with injuries (how much of that is luck and how much of it is down to Ange’s style and methods is very much up for debate mind) but there’s only so much that injuries account for. As bishop said, we didn’t ever look solid regardless of who is in our back line, we don’t have a sound shape nor do we have solid foundations. It’s all last ditch stuff and we never look in control. Now a top class DM instead of Bissouma would probably help but it would still paper over the cracks of Ange’s system. We were conceding 3’s and 4’s last season even with a fully fit back line. That’s before you even mention how poorly we deal with set pieces which are a perfectly legitimate way to score goals.

Look at the shots and chances we conceded up to a month ago
We were up on our XgA because we were doing things right (I don’t know what, but the data didn’t lie)
Now we are playing 4 every days with no changes to them to keep anyone fresh
Up top
in defence
Anywhere
So you can’t oaky with the same effort, energy and intensity. I was never the best pakyers but I ran loss which is how I was effective at a lower level… but this is elite level and any small margin in work hurts
Then add in mental fatigue which means visuals doesn’t execute simple passes for example and you may well get punished
I don’t see many issue other than lack of quantity at the right quality