Harry Redknapp: The Aftermath

[elltrev]

I agree with both of your posts billyiddo and braineclipse. And I do think the first line of the Harry quote was a silly thing to say.

In fairness to Harry, I think he's just tinkled off at the extent of the negativity given that we are still 4th. And judging by some of the fans on this forum (of course not all of them, some criticism and negativity is fair and understandable) - I can understand where he's coming from.

 

[Pirate55]

Can we not all agree that:

a) Man United and City have better first XIs than us, and better squads.
b) Our first XI and squad is comparable to Arsenal's and Chelsea's.
c) Harry deserves credit for building this first XI and squad, without spending much money.
d) Given a) and b), we should be finishing between 3rd and 5th this season. Anything above that would have been an incredible (and virtually impossible) achievement, and anything below that will be a poor underachievement.
e) Given that we added Friedel, Parker and Adebayor this season, and don't have the Champions League to contend with, we should improve on last season's points total (62). [Currently on 59 with 5 games to go]

Cant agree with this. Harry has bought Crouch, Defoe, Pallacios, Woodgate, Gallas, Piennar, Parker, Friedel, Saha, Corluka, Kaboul. Either slow, old, useless or all three.

Moyes hasnt nearly as much budget, but has bought or brought through, Lescott, Howard, Baines, Rooney, Coleman, Newell (?), Gibson, Fellainni, Jelavic, Piennar, Arteta

Not saying who is the better manager but who has the better buying record? who has left their club with a better legacy if both were judged by their transfers?

 

[billyiddo]

Over all as a squad we do not have one that 'should' be doing better. We have one that should be exactly where it is. And that's a fantastic acheivement considering the players included in this squad were not top 4 quality when they signed. BAE, Kaboul, Walker, Bale, Modric even arguably Lennon have all improved to top 4 standard under Harry. The signings he has made, Friedel, Gallas, Parker, and Adebayor have been vital in keeping us there. It is his doing that we are where we are.

Put it this way, if we finished 6th after finishing 9th the season before, nobody would be saying 'What the hell! They have Assou-Ekotto at left back, Kaboul at centre back! They have Walker at right back! They have Bale! They should be much higher!!' because those players had never performed to a consistent top 4 level before. They became who they were under Harry. They are only considered top 4 standard because he has improved all of them to such an extent that people look upon them as one of the best sides in the country.

We don't have the finances or as deep a squad as the Manchester's though, and that's why injuries take their toll on us more than them.

young players with potential in getting better with age shocker !

being serious though i have little doubt these players would have become the players they are now had they been elsewhere - Harry deserves some credit, but lets not kid ourselves in to thinking he took a bunch of no hopers and turned them in to world builders, every player you mention was a player signed for the fact they had serious potential

 

[mick cooper]

Sorry mate but that is rubbish, the players are what they are and they are good enough to compete for the top.

what an incredibly simplistic viewpoint.

Have you never played in a team and wondered, how the feck did we just lose that? There is far more to making a team perform than just having a gaggle of talented individuals. Who foresaw bentleys total collapse of form? Who foresaw the astonishing change in form of Bale, or any number of other players under harry?

yet when the team is assaulted by media crap that their guide and mentor might be leaving, people sit around and a) blame harry and b) refuse to accept the psychological effect of him going might have on the team.

Spoiled - some Spurs fans have only seen the years from Jol onwards and expect that everything will just get better. For poor sods like me who have had to watch some spectacular brick (since 67) what we have at the moment is stuff that dreams are made of.

It doesn't stop me being tinkled off that we have had this slump in form and results, but I'm not a spoiled little brat who has been bought up on caviar and champagne, I've had to live off water and crusts, so where we are at the moment is not so hard to take.

Some of the posters in this thread need to get their heads up and see the wider view, because it beats the tinkle out of being a Blackburn or Leeds fan, both of whom have seen a championship much more recently than we have.

Some seriously spineless moaning minnies on here.

Stiff upper lip, heads up

by tomorrow night, we'll have our first FA cup final in 20 years to look forward to.

 

[Modric THFC]

Can we not all agree that:

a) Man United and City have better first XIs than us, and better squads.
b) Our first XI and squad is comparable to Arsenal's and Chelsea's.
c) Harry deserves credit for building this first XI and squad, without spending much money.
d) Given a) and b), we should be finishing between 3rd and 5th this season. Anything above that would have been an incredible (and virtually impossible) achievement, and anything below that will be a poor underachievement.
e) Given that we added Friedel, Parker and Adebayor this season, and don't have the Champions League to contend with, we should improve on last season's points total (62). [Currently on 59 with 5 games to go]

Without spending money my arse. We've spend at least 98m extra on wages since he took over.

 

[chancer]

Cant agree with this. Harry has bought Crouch, Defoe, Pallacios, Woodgate, Gallas, Piennar, Parker, Friedel, Saha, Corluka, Kaboul. Either slow, old, useless or all three.

Moyes hasnt nearly as much budget, but has bought or brought through, Lescott, Howard, Baines, Rooney, Coleman, Newell (?), Gibson, Fellainni, Jelavic, Piennar, Arteta

Sorry, that's a farcical analysis.

First, because several of those Spurs players you name have done an excellent job. Crouch was integral to our CL season, Friedal, Kaboul and Parker are 1st team regs and for some our best three players of the season. Defoe is hardly a bad player, Woodgate was magnificent when playing, Gallas has been incredibly helpful the last season or two, Corluka is loved by some on this board. Pienaar won't cost us much and Harry moved him quick when it didn't work. Even Palacios did a job for a while. "Slow, old, useless or all three." Come on ffs!

Second, you can't pick Everton's best 8 players of the last 10 years and present that as proof of anything. Rooney was not likely anything to do with Moyes - it would be youth set up and Rooney's awesome talent. Coleman, Fellainni and Howard are solid, but not much more. Ordinary. Gibson has only just arrived and, in my opinion, likely not that good. Arteta is solid but overrated in my view. Baines and Lescott are good. And who do you mean by "Newell"...Mike Newell???

Sorry, overall, ridiculous.

 

[Pirate55]

Sorry, that's a farcical analysis.

First, because several of those Spurs players you name have done an excellent job. Crouch was integral to our CL season, Friedal, Kaboul and Parker are 1st team regs and for some our best three players of the season. Defoe is hardly a bad player, Woodgate was magnificent when playing, Gallas has been incredibly helpful the last season or two, Corluka is loved by some on this board. Pienaar won't cost us much and Harry moved him quick when it didn't work. Even Palacios did a job for a while. "Slow, old, useless or all three." Come on ffs!

Second, you can't pick Everton's best 8 players of the last 10 years and present that as proof of anything. Rooney was not likely anything to do with Moyes - it would be youth set up and Rooney's awesome talent. Coleman, Fellainni and Howard are solid, but not much more. Ordinary. Gibson has only just arrived and, in my opinion, likely not that good. Arteta is solid but overrated in my view. Baines and Lescott are good. And who do you mean by "Newell"...Mike Newell???

Sorry, overall, ridiculous.

So you reckon Harry's buying policy has been astute and left us with a long term legacy? How many of his buys will be around in two years time?

 

[linnet_spur]

Just a little nit pick, but Harry didn't buy corluka

 

[Pirate55]

Just a little nit pick, but Harry didn't buy corluka

Who exactly has he bought that will be around in two years though? Maybe Kaboul. Any others?

 

[chancer]

So you reckon Harry's buying policy has been astute and left us with a long term legacy? How many of his buys will be around in two years time?

Eh, your original point was that Moyes was demonstrably better at bringing in or bringing on players than Harry. You have now moved the goalposts and are talking about long term legacy. That's a different argument.

But if you want to talk about who could be around in 2 years, you could say from the current first team (and this is just the first team!):

- Walker
- BAE
- Kaboul
- Dawson
- Caulker

- Sandro
- Bale
- Modric
- vdV

- Adabayor

That's almost a full team! Amongst them, 2 or 3 truly world class players in Bale and Modric and, depending on your view, vdV, 3 awesome young talents in Kaboul, Caulker and Sandro, and 3 significantly above-average top class mature players in BAE, Dawson, and Ade.

I would hardly say you are proving your point that we have a rotten legacy.

 

[parklane1]

what an incredibly simplistic viewpoint.

Have you never played in a team and wondered, how the feck did we just lose that? There is far more to making a team perform than just having a gaggle of talented individuals. Who foresaw bentleys total collapse of form? Who foresaw the astonishing change in form of Bale, or any number of other players under harry?

yet when the team is assaulted by media crap that their guide and mentor might be leaving, people sit around and a) blame harry and b) refuse to accept the psychological effect of him going might have on the team.

Spoiled - some Spurs fans have only seen the years from July onwards and expect that everything will just get better. For poor sods like me who have had to watch some spectacular brick (since 67) what we have at the moment is stuff that dreams are made of.

It doesn't stop me being tinkled off that we have had this slump in form and results, but I'm not a spoiled little brat who has been bought up on caviar and champagne, I've had to live off water and crusts, so where we are at the moment is not so hard to take.

Some of the posters in this thread need to get their heads up and see the wider view, because it beats the tinkle out of being a Blackburn or Leeds fan, both of whom have seen a championship much more recently than we have.

Some seriously spineless moaning minnies on here.

Stiff upper lip, heads up

by tomorrow night, we'll have our first FA cup final in 20 years to look forward to.

Of course i have and it does need more then talented players, it needs a manager who can compete tactically with the top teams and this is where Redknapp falls down.

I am a poor sod like you (since 63)and have watched the brick like you have, my point is that we are NOT punching above our weight and those that say we are are wrong (imo) at the beginning of the season i expected us to make the top four which is where we are, so in know way will i say we are punching above our weight or in a false position. However after spending a bloody fortune travelling around watching Spurs every year i object to Redknapp having a dig saying i am unrealistic.

As for seeing the wider view i believe i am, we are on the verge of being able to ( for the first time in many years) really challenge for the top, i do not need a manager who is telling me that we can not compete, and is unable to accept that we are a big club and we are so close.

 

[Pirate55]

Eh, your original point was that Moyes was demonstrably better at bringing in or bringing on players than Harry. You have now moved the goalposts and are talking about long term legacy. That's a different argument.

But if you want to talk about who could be around in 2 years, you could say from the current first team (and this is just the first team!):

- Walker
- BAE
- Kaboul
- Dawson
- Caulker

- Sandro
- Bale
- Modric
- vdV

- Adabayor

That's almost a full team! Amongst them, 2 or 3 truly world class players in Bale and Modric and, depending on your view, vdV, 3 awesome young talents in Kaboul, Caulker and Sandro, and 3 significantly above-average top class mature players in BAE, Dawson, and Ade.

I would hardly say you are proving your point that we have a rotten legacy.

Those bolded were NOT Harry's buys. Adebayor is only on loan. Harry admitted at the time of the Sandro buy that he didnt know much about him. Kaulker is unproven. Walker has his critics here but I quite like him.

Again the question is of HARRY's buys, who will be here in two years time?

 

[chancer]

Sorry, no, this is silly. You're counting Rooney as a Moyes success, but won't grant Adabayour or vdV as Harry successes. It's a loaded and silly argument that'll just go round in circles. I don't have the energy for it in all honesty.

 

[Pirate55]

Sorry, no, this is silly. You're counting Rooney as a Moyes success, but won't grant Adabayour or vdV as Harry successes. It's a loaded and silly argument that'll just go round in circles. I don't have the energy for it in all honesty.

Just because you have patently failed to answer my simple question as to which of Harry's buys will be here in two years, does not mean "the argument will go round in circles". BTW in case you didnt notice, Ade is on loan and VDV was bought by Levy.

 

[Modric THFC]

Just because you have patently failed to answer my simple question as to which of Harry's buys will be here in two years, does not mean "the argument will go round in circles". BTW in case you didnt notice, Ade is on loan and VDV was bought by Levy.

If you wanna use that logic they were all bought by Levy.

 

[chancer]

Just because you have patently failed to answer my simple question as to which of Harry's buys will be here in two years, does not mean "the argument will go round in circles". BTW in case you didnt notice, Ade is on loan and VDV was bought by Levy.

No, you've got the wrong person for this kind of aggressive debate. Simply not interested mate.

 

[Pirate55]

If you wanna use that logic they were all bought by Levy.

The point is that he WASNT a Rednapp buy. Levy presented it to him as a gift.

 

[Pirate55]

No, you've got the wrong person for this kind of aggressive debate. Simply not interested mate.

Funny that, you seemed to engage and then backed off in the face of the facts presented

 

[Modric THFC]

The point is that he WASNT a Rednapp buy. Levy presented it to him as a gift.

Oh ffs. Do we have to clear this up for the millionth time. We went in him week before the deal. Real pulled out. Then on the final day Real phone LEvy up ask do we still want him. Levy phoned Redknapp and asked did he still want him. Redknapp jumped at it.

 

[Pirate55]

Oh ffs. Do we have to clear this up for the millionth time. We went in him week before the deal. Real pulled out. Then on the final day Real phone LEvy up ask do we still want him. Levy phoned Redknapp and asked did he still want him. Redknapp jumped at it.

Exactly. You made my point for me. He WASNT a Rednapp inspired buy. Therefore Rednapp cant take the credit for his aquisition.