Eric Dier

[parklane1]

Contrast that to Emirates Marketing Project when Lamela burst forward, he was straight into the back 4. Otamendi (I think) decided to come forwards to tackle, Lamela put it through his legs and Eriksen was in.

Indeed, football is such a simple game in all honesty and always will be. But there is so much flimflam talked about double pivots, black boxes, this system, that system when all it really needs is players put in positions to suit their strengths. Last season we had Bentaleb and Mason playing in CM and neither one of them had a defensive mind set, Dier has and because of that we have CB's who can concentrate on their game and a CM player who gives them cover to allow them to do that.

Simple.

 

[SpursNorway]

Indeed, football is such a simple game in all honesty and always will be. But there is so much hogwash talked about double pivots, black boxes, this system, that system when all it really needs is players put in positions to suit their strengths. Last season we had Bentaleb and Mason playing in CM and neither one of them had a defensive mind set, Dier has and because of that we have CB's who can concentrate on their game and a CM player who gives them cover to allow them to do that.

Simple.

Agreed, parklane. Diers mindset is to protect - and then use the ball going forward if we put the pressure on in their half. Not the other way around. Adding in Toby, we've suddenly got a extremely solid back four-five-six.
For me, this is the key to what we've done so far this season. And long may it continue.

 

[Gazza]

Beast goodnight

 

[bennysleftfoot]

I think what also helps is diers ability to drop in at cb and become a 3 allowing our fbs to bomb on and press further up the pitch. allowing us to win the ball higher and in turn starting our defensive line further up the pitch.
I don't think this would be as effective if you had an out and out cm playing diers role, I don't think they'd have the skillset to drop in at Centre back.

 

[braineclipse]

Indeed, football is such a simple game in all honesty and always will be. But there is so much hogwash talked about double pivots, black boxes, this system, that system when all it really needs is players put in positions to suit their strengths. Last season we had Bentaleb and Mason playing in CM and neither one of them had a defensive mind set, Dier has and because of that we have CB's who can concentrate on their game and a CM player who gives them cover to allow them to do that.

Simple.

We hired that black box man, got a very clear system head coach in place and we've seen a lot of success from it.

Was it football is a very simple game that got Dier playing in midfield in the first place? I thought the football is a very simple game crowd saw him as a defender...

 

[parklane1]

We hired that black box man, got a very clear system head coach in place and we've seen a lot of success from it.

Was it football is a very simple game that got Dier playing in midfield in the first place? I thought the football is a very simple game crowd saw him as a defender...

Unless you work with a player full time there is no way anyone of any crowd can really say what he is best at, Poch has obviously seen that he is capable of playing well as our defensive M/F player. The black box is of use but I doubt very much it made the decision to play Dier there. If anyone truly believes that football is not ( at its heart) a simple game they are over thinking it ( or maybe never played it?)

 

[braineclipse]

Unless you work with a player full time there is no way anyone of any crowd can really say what he is best at, Poch has obviously seen that he is capable of playing well as our defensive M/F player. The black box is of use but I doubt very much it made the decision to play Dier there. If anyone truly believes that football is not ( at its heart) a simple game they are over thinking it ( or maybe never played it?)

Football being at it's heart a simple game does not mean that complex thinking can not lead to better decisions.

Been pointed out repeatedly by people in the game that the complexity of modern football management would surprise the average fan. Particularly I think this is true at the top level where resources are available.

 

[Raziel]

Football being at it's heart a simple game does not mean that complex thinking can not lead to better decisions.

Been pointed out repeatedly by people in the game that the complexity of modern football management would surprise the average fan. Particularly I think this is true at the top level where resources are available.

Being simple conceptually does not mean simple to execute.

To your point, we don't see a lot of the background pieces, running a big club, having to accommodate business needs, etc.

 

[parklane1]

Football being at it's heart a simple game does not mean that complex thinking can not lead to better decisions.

Been pointed out repeatedly by people in the game that the complexity of modern football management would surprise the average fan. Particularly I think this is true at the top level where resources are available.

Never said it did not , once again you seem to be going of on a tangent from the original point I was making.

 

[braineclipse]

Never said it did not , once again you seem to be going of on a tangent from the original point I was making.

But you're calling some of the methods seemingly used to make those decisions hogwash while calling football a simple game. I fail to see how my point is a tangent.

 

[parklane1]

But you're calling some of the methods seemingly used to make those decisions hogwash while calling football a simple game. I fail to see how my point is a tangent.

My main point is that the game is a simple one, you seem unable to grasp that point without diverting away from it. No big deal though.

 

[scaramanga]

My main point is that the game is a simple one, you seem unable to grasp that point without diverting away from it. No big deal though.

Everything is simple if you don't mind not being very good at it. Not sure why football would be singled out over anything else.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

People get paid a lot of money to make simple things difficult, I think they are called Management Consultants.

 

[BucurestiSpur]

This lads been a titanic signing for us.

Is his future DM now or still CB at some point? I ask both from Poch's and Diers point of view if they have mentioned anything, and also curious what your personal opinion is.

Last point, we all know Vertonghen for example has a few tricks up his sleeve, but its Dier and Rose that seem to have a genuine edge to them and both are well up for mixing it if necessary.

Great to see we have that now, without either player even coming close to crossing the line to becoming unlikeable or (yet) being on ref's radar.

 

[imcallingbullsh*t]

I thought Dier was being a bit of a ledley king and was going to experience midfield before ending up back as a CB.
Ill give poch/recruitment some credit here if its deliberate but what we have is

A CB who can come out with the ball is a very good ball player (Dier)
A LCB who plays as a LB for his national team (backup Wimmer)
A RCB who plays as a RB for his national team (backup Dier)

Means both defensively and offensively the CB's can split wide without issue allowing Dier to drop in or come out.
The most impressive thing is Wimmer stepping in, but i think this might be us not having a clear pattern of play, like a swansea of a few years ago. Therefore the incoming player has to follow the structure and style. The issue may be replacing Dier, i rate bentaleb but he is having a real struggle getting going.
Even if he did im not sure he can play CB and thats what we would need to replace Dier, which is basically a ball playing CB rather than a DM Imho.

 

[Raziel]

This lads been a titanic signing for us.

Is his future DM now or still CB at some point? I ask both from Poch's and Diers point of view if they have mentioned anything, and also curious what your personal opinion is.

Last point, we all know Vertonghen for example has a few tricks up his sleeve, but its Dier and Rose that seem to have a genuine edge to them and both are well up for mixing it if necessary.

Great to see we have that now, without either player even coming close to crossing the line to becoming unlikeable or (yet) being on ref's radar.

I think Dier stays a DM, from the point of view of

- While young (so can improve in all aspects), he appears a decent CB, as a DM he's been up there with best in the league
- Good CBs can be found, finding a modern DM is fudging difficult (especially one without a bunch of limitations)
- His aggression in midfield kills a lot of stuff before it becomes dangerous, in CB he would have to tone it down (which is not to our advantage)

On his current form, England would be daft to not consider him as a midfield option in Euros.

 

[parklane1]

People get paid a lot of money to make simple things difficult, I think they are called Management Consultants.

Carrying their " flimflam" bibles under their arms.

 

[alekaras]

People get paid a lot of money to make simple things difficult, I think they are called Management Consultants.

I worked as one and our mantra was to simplify the complex. Of course people didn't like us, because simplifying meant costing people their jobs (the one part I didn't like about the work, which is why I got out after a few short years). Hence all the jokes. In any case...

 

[elltrev]

Football being at it's heart a simple game does not mean that complex thinking can not lead to better decisions.

Been pointed out repeatedly by people in the game that the complexity of modern football management would surprise the average fan. Particularly I think this is true at the top level where resources are available.

Not necessarily saying this isn't true, but why is it that recently-ex players and managers never have anything remotely complex or insightful to say as pundits?!

 

[scaramanga]

Not necessarily saying this isn't true, but why is it that recently-ex players and managers never have anything remotely complex or insightful to say as pundits?!

Firstly, your average tv watching football fan doesn't want complicated - half of them still want wingers and two up front.
Secondly, I suspect if they had a thorough understanding of the complex side of football they'd be putting that to good use on a pitch rather than sitting in a spinny chair in a shirt that hasn't fit for at least 3 stone.