thfcsteff
Vic Buckingham
Postecoglu will with ease once the treatment table eases up...it is starting to now. If we actually get him another fit forward, it could well still be a fine season. Hang in there!
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Contingency planning : When Ange is sacked, who should replace him?
- Thread starter Daisuk
- Start date
Postecoglu will with ease once the treatment table eases up...it is starting to now. If we actually get him another fit forward, it could well still be a fine season. Hang in there!
braineclipse
Terry Dyson
Let's see how things look when the transfer window closes...
Spence, Sarr, VdV, Romero, Bissouma, Johnson all back or not too far off. Richarlison hopefully getting closer to full fitness with Odobert too hopefully getting closer. Add a good player or two in the transfer market and we may be closing in on a full bench of first team players in the not too distant future.
Muttley
Neil Ruddock
I'm in 2 minds on this one. Whilst I agree that we will stay up with ease, all the injury crisis has done is delay our ability to really assess Ange's credentials. It will be great to see a full 20 man squad again every game, including perhaps a couple of new signings. Will we see this team find consistency then? Will we see Ange's complex tactics work against all the different types of tactics we see coming back at us? Will we just revert to the defence being on the half way line, the full-backs being anywhere but full-back, no number 6 visible on the pitch etc?
For me, Ange still has a lot to do to be putting him in a "job is safe" bucket.
Something that stuck with me was @scaramanga comment a while ago saying how Ange could well end up being a very good manager but needed to be at a lesser club (a West Ham or the like) first before moving to us. I think that was fair comment, very often we sign players who we accept have huge upside but have flaws and inconsistencies and I think the same is the case with Ange - I don't buy the 'He's just a PE teacher' comments at all, but whilst I acknowledge his accomplishments everywhere he has been the Premier League is a very different beast. I think he has to adjust from what he has done previously in every aspect from tactically to fitness to even certain off field aspects. I do think he has adjusted to a degree ( I don't want to debate what as it becomes a tiresome debate) but point is he is still learning and gaining experience, it's a question of whether the fans and board have the patience - so far the general answer is yes but we are getting towards the breaking point for sure I would imagine. I think a little more time, something that is a precious commodity anywhere but especially in the football world and this could still work.
Obviously the injury situation hasn't helped, but hopefully during this ridiculous few months he has also been learning more about the PLs demands and this side of things and better planning for the future. And of course, the tactical side of things need to be looked at for when we do have injuries - I don't have particular concerns when we have a fully fit team, but when we get a few injuries he does need to think about how to adapt better.
My prediction will be he does enough with the return of players to get the start of next season (what that looks like whether it just be a better run of results with the return of players or a trophy I have no idea), but then he has no excuses for next season. Even relatively early on if we look off the pace for Europe I think he would be gone. I know many think he should be gone now or in the summer and I wouldn't argue with that if it happens, but just got a hunch he will be here come the start of next season unless things continue to nosedive even with the upcoming return of players.....
thfcsteff
Vic Buckingham
I would like to see that happen, and agree that the leash would very short if it does, but I have a gut feeling that unless he wins a trophy he is out in the summer.
Mr Gogolak
Espen Baardsen
I think an unfortunate part of his tenure is that he came after two very experienced and elite - whether some like it or not - managers, who brought their own staff with them. If there had been a team of top-notch trainers, it might have eased the transition (assuming he'd listen to them). As it stands, we couldn't retain the wealth of experience people like Mourinho or Conte added, at least in terms of preparation and training. We were left with a manager inexperienced at this level and what looks to me (but I can't claim any expertise myself) like a bunch of relatively young ex-pros, none of which ever played at the highest level.
That kind of knowledge in the backroom staff might have at least prevented what we saw in the first half at Everton.
braineclipse
Terry Dyson
I mostly agree. I want to see what happens. If he can fix the underlying issues of consistency.
thfcsteff
Vic Buckingham
I think this is a really good, interesting perspective (mason not withstanding who of course was a top-level pro, but yoour point stand)...
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
I think it's more that because Mourinho and Conte played a low block, physical fitness wasn't particularly important. IIRC wasn't one of Mason's first remedial changes after Mourinho trying to get us a bit fitter?
So it's more that the squad have gone from low intensity up to Terror Tuesdays. Whereas ideally there's a place in between of controlled high-intensity work.
Muttley
Neil Ruddock
Yeah, the word that always pops into my head is "idealistic" when it comes to explaining how Ange wants to play the game. Does his ideology have more practicality than I give him credit for? Perhaps, but when you see goals like the second on Sunday costing us 2 points, it always gets me thinking.
I do agree with your point about Ange assimilating to the PL environment, but would caution that he's been at it 18 months now. How long do we think that period will take?
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
That is when things really worry me, when I honestly believe I could do better than the incumbent in a job. Like this baffling naive tactical setup and squad management situation; or Liz Truss.
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
You forget to factor in the 2 new injuries every week though. We all know Porro is getting his 8 week hamstring next, with Kulu and Son close behind.
Has it?
- I find it interesting that we went from Jose/Conte, beyond the style changes, I think we wanted a manager who (with input) would be able to work with "club buys", i.e. players aligned to a club vision vs. a specific manager
- What Ange has shown is his system seems to struggle (badly) when he doesn't have exactly what he needs (winger/focus point CF/speedy CB)
That "need the perfect team" plus our inability to win close games is what made up my mind, don't see him being successful here (and maybe he does a Ramos, or hopefully?)
Robspur12
Frederic Kanoute
Steff hate to be contrary again but that sounds like wishful thinking. Ange hasn't shown any ability to do that this season. It's been said a few times that even with fully fit teams he was unable to secure wins at Ipswich and Palace who were on poor runs at the time we played them.
That's carried on through this period when we've lost to Everton and Leicester, the latter were on a 7 match losing streak!
If you can't beat Leicester or at least draw, at home, even with a patched up side, where are the results going to come from? Because he needs 4/5 wins to get us to safety in the league.
It feels like he is done here, and question marks remain as to not only why he was appointed but also why he is still here. if he's not out of the door soon, I expect things to get worse rather than better
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
I think the thing that Ange is really missing is the perfect opposition team. Preferably Falkirk, Ross County or Brisbane BBQers
thfcsteff
Vic Buckingham
As ever you have put your opinion forth really articulately and respectfully my friend.
I will bet you a pound of gourmet coffee beans that we will end up comfortably mid-table at worst this season.
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If there ever was a bet I'd be delighted to lose
thfcsteff
Vic Buckingham
I want COFFEEEEEEE LOL!
Bishop
Frederic Kanoute
Our run of games coming up are awful. Yo get to mid table we actually have to start winning games and against the kind of teams we've failed against this season.
Brentford away
Liverpool away C Cup
Villa away FA Cup
Man United away ok we should beat them, they are dog brick.
Ipswich away
Emirates Marketing Project home
Bournemouth home
Fulham away
Chelsea away
That set of fixtures takes us all the way to April. When we get Southampton again. I don't want to sound fatalistic but in our current form or even the form we've shown all season, where is our next win coming from?
Depending on what you consider mid table this night not apply but we are currently 3 wins away from the top half of the table. So it would take a significant upturn in results and performances and a drop off from the teams above to claw our way back to a mid table position imo.