OMT * Tottenham Hotspur v Leicester City *

[Kandi1977]

I can't decide what's more disappointing. The fact that we didn't kill the game when we had the opportunity, or that it was totally expected that we didn't.

 

[Robspur12]

A set piece coach often gets mentioned when we concede, but they usually deal with attacking set pieces.

No they work on both offensive and defensive sides of set pieces

 

[DeanoAustin]

Come on mate you wrote him off before he even started, so now every issue is a chance to prove you were right. And I’m not saying you care about being right for the sake of it…just that you’ll find issues because you never gave it a chance.

I had an opinion on his style of play from very early on and expressed it and continue to express it. I’d rather do that than change every week depending on the result and, believe me, I’d give my left nut and first born to be proven wrong.

 

[Mikey10]

The coach we brought in this summer who had previously worked at Hibs works on defending set pieces I read (having done so at Hibs and improving their record in that area over the time he was there) just because we don't have a specialist 'defending set pieces coach' doesn't mean it isn't worked on

If he got Hibs to defend better then we have a miracle worker amongst us.

 

[Nexus1967]

Yep. Arsenal benefitted massively from improving their set piece play.

And Arsenals back 4 are miles better than our back 4. The main thing for me, and I know it is only the first game of the season but Ange has had 3? transfer windows and nothing seems like it has changed since the second half of last season. Tonight for me he was 20 minutes late making subs. If I was seeing a big lift in our play it would be good but how many times are we going to say we should have had at least a 3 goal lead then the other side score on their first chance and then we look lost and are fortunate not to lose. This has been the pattern since the first 10 games of last season. And in reality we were very fortunate in at least 2 of those games to get a result. Its just the same game plan over and over. If it carrys on like it Ange will be lucky to still be here at Christmas

 

[DeanoAustin]

And Arsenals back 4 are miles better than our back 4. The main thing for me, and I know it is only the first game of the season but Ange has had 3? transfer windows and nothing seems like it has changed since the second half of last season. Tonight for me he was 20 minutes late making subs. If I was seeing a big lift in our play it would be good but how many times are we going to say we should have had at least a 3 goal lead then the other side score on their first chance and then we look lost and are fortunate not to lose. This has been the pattern since the first 10 games of last season. And in reality we were very fortunate in at least 2 of those games to get a result. Its just the same game plan over and over. If it carrys on like it Ange will be lucky to still be here at Christmas

Are the Woolwich back 4 much better than ours on an individual basis? Personally, I think we’ve 4 top, top defenders. Porro can be a little weak defensively and Romero can be unpredictable but they’re both excellent. Perhaps Saliba is a cut above them but not sure they have many others who are above our players.

 

[Bishop]

The realization that Son may be on his final stretch and needs to be benched ASAP if he doesn't pull himself together is beginning to sink in. He doesn't even shoot anymore, which is his best trait. He's so unbelievably cautious, and a cautious Son is a harmless Son.

I've been saying this for the last season or so. He's not what he was on the wing, he'll still score a few especially if he just starts shooting rather than trying to hang on to it. But the Son of 2015-2022 is gone.

We didn’t concede today because we were naive… it was one man fudgein* up
Let’s be honest about that
If that doesn’t happen … and it really shouldn’t because it’s basic they wouldn’t get any belief to build anything. It was their first shot FFS

We should have conceded more than 1.

Also remember the many conversations we had where I said having a striker that attacks the box would not stop us getting countered nor would it make Johnson able to beat his man more often?

 

[SubZero]

It’s because the team are still growing into the system. When you gift a goal like that and it’s suddenly 1-1 after you dominated a game, that’s a shock. It’s then a huge challenge to get the players to bounce back and have full confidence in what they’re doing. When the players do that is when we start flying.

And yes, that is very much on the manager to drill into his team. But there’s only one way to do it: with time.

I don't disagree with that, but the worry is that it's a recurring theme. We have players to play like we did in the first half against almost anybody, but we don't. It takes nothing to evaporate all our confidence in a split second. I'm not comparing directly, but what I loved about Poch was that a goal or even 2 down, there was this spirit going that there was a chance. Most of last season felt more like banging the head against a wall. At the same spot.

My take is that it's the manager's job to get the most out of each player, and replace those who are lost. Maybe we need a new captain, maybe we need a tweak to the system. At least it's cheaper to tweak the system than replacing players. I'm more than willing to give Ange time, but I'd like to see that we learn something along the way, not falling into the same trap over and over again. Still, the first 45 were great so there's something to build upon.

 

[billyiddo]

Are the Woolwich back 4 much better than ours on an individual basis? Personally, I think we’ve 4 top, top defenders. Porro can be a little weak defensively and Romero can be unpredictable but they’re both excellent. Perhaps Saliba is a cut above them but not sure they have many others who are above our players.

Arsenal defend better as a team and from a setup POV

 

[90291Spur]

Are the Woolwich back 4 much better than ours on an individual basis? Personally, I think we’ve 4 top, top defenders. Porro can be a little weak defensively and Romero can be unpredictable but they’re both excellent. Perhaps Saliba is a cut above them but not sure they have many others who are above our players.

The Woolwich also have a much tighter midfield meaning their back four seems to be under less pressure than ours.

 

[Mcfee]

Deano is one of the most reasonable, level headed posters in this place.

I suppose it’s not that difficult really.

 

[DeanoAustin]

Arsenal defend better as a team and from a setup POV

That I would agree with.

 

[Mikey10]

that's the point i'm making i suppose. Ange's tactics worked in a lower European league, but in the English top flight where even the "lesser" teams have significant financial/management/playing resources, well i'm not so sure. Vardy will be shown up against most of the defences in this league, yet he nearly won them the game today.

Sorry…massive ‘Woosh’ on my part. Doh!

 

[DeanoAustin]

I don't disagree with that, but the worry is that it's a recurring theme. We have players to play like we did in the first half against almost anybody, but we don't. It takes nothing to evaporate all our confidence in a split second. I'm not comparing directly, but what I loved about Poch was that a goal or even 2 down, there was this spirit going that there was a chance. Most of last season felt more like banging the head against a wall. At the same spot.

My take is that it's the manager's job to get the most out of each player, and replace those who are lost. Maybe we need a new captain, maybe we need a tweak to the system. At least it's cheaper to tweak the system than replacing players. I'm more than willing to give Ange time, but I'd like to see that we learn something along the way, not falling into the same trap over and over again. Still, the first 45 were great so there's something to build upon.

Last season there was a lot of talk of Son being a great captain. And in many ways he is. He seems a top lad and he was all in on the team and not just glory for himself.

But fudge me, we needed someone tonight to really grab us by the scruff of the neck and kill Leicester’s momentum after the goal and they were all like a rabbit in the headlights. You’d expect Romero could do it but he’s been shown incapable of it time and again.

It’s not just brickhousery, Richarlison or Romero give you that but it’s brainless or pure wind up stuff most of the time.

The thing that seemed to stop the momentum tonight was Bentancur’s injury. That’s not good.

 

[DubaiSpur]

I've been saying this for the last season or so. He's not what he was on the wing, he'll still score a few especially if he just starts shooting rather than trying to hang on to it. But the Son of 2015-2022 is gone.

We should have conceded more than 1.

Also remember the many conversations we had where I said having a striker that attacks the box would not stop us getting countered nor would it make Johnson able to beat his man more often?

We're between a rock and a hard place on the left wing.

I can see the logic in what we're trying to do - give Sonny that spot, have Werner on loan backing him up for a year so we can bring Moore through in the longer term (know he usually started on the right in pre-season, but he's made his name so far as a left winger cutting inside).

Problem is, as you say, Sonny just looks washed. Can't beat his man anymore, leaden first touch, and not much by way of press resistance. So we either just bear with that for a season, or try Werner instead.

I think next year we'll probably move Richarlison on and have Son transition to full-time backup for Solanke for his final year (think he has an extension built into his contract). With Werner's loan ending, my hope (if Postecoglou is still around then), is that we get a proper left winger in and make Moore his backup.

But for now, we endure.

 

[SubZero]

Arsenal defend better as a team and from a setup POV

I thought the consensus last season was that Arsenal was pretty questionable at the back. I'd say their strength is willingness to play ball, create and take chances, and don't deflate at the first sign of adversity. And they rarely look complacent. I'm not ashamed to say that bar Ødegård they don't have that much better players than us, but they have a much better team. Add to that, they are a bit "lucky". And they cheat, dive and complain all the time.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Last season there was a lot of talk of Son being a great captain. And in many ways he is. He seems a top lad and he was all in on the team and not just glory for himself.

But fudge me, we needed someone tonight to really grab us by the scruff of the neck and kill Leicester’s momentum after the goal and they were all like a rabbit in the headlights. You’d expect Romero could do it but he’s been shown incapable of it time and again.

It’s not just brickhousery, Richarlison or Romero give you that but it’s brainless or pure wind up stuff most of the time.

The thing that seemed to stop the momentum tonight was Bentancur’s injury. That’s not good.

Yep. There's a big difference between brickhousery, which we have been doing since Poch, and game management, which we have lacked for literal decades.

A player smart enough to understand when to commit and draw fouls, when to hold the game up or to quicken things, when to go long or short, when to quieten the crowd or rouse them - these players have footballing brains.

None of ours do, really. And it shows in the way we dissolve under pressure.

 

[djp82]

Last season there was a lot of talk of Son being a great captain. And in many ways he is. He seems a top lad and he was all in on the team and not just glory for himself.

But fudge me, we needed someone tonight to really grab us by the scruff of the neck and kill Leicester’s momentum after the goal and they were all like a rabbit in the headlights. You’d expect Romero could do it but he’s been shown incapable of it time and again.

It’s not just brickhousery, Richarlison or Romero give you that but it’s brainless or pure wind up stuff most of the time.

The thing that seemed to stop the momentum tonight was Bentancur’s injury. That’s not good.

Spot on , agree with all this. You’d think Romero would be that leader.

Bentancur’s injury done us a favour in that respect. We were all over the place .
Not for him or us moving forward but it slowed them down.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Arsenal defend better as a team and from a setup POV

Saliba is head and shoulders above any of our defenders. Hate saying it but he’s a class act.

 

[DeanoAustin]

Yep. There's a big difference between brickhousery, which we have been doing since Poch, and game management, which we have lacked for literal decades.

A player smart enough to understand when to commit and draw fouls, when to hold the game up or to quicken things, when to go long or short, when to quieten the crowd or rouse them - these players have footballing brains.

None of ours do, really. And it shows in the way we dissolve under pressure.

Kane was the absolute master of helping us kill games under Jose and Conte. Get him the ball and wide and you just knew he’d waste 20-30 seconds and then draw a foul.