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The case for the defence

glorygloryeze said:
I agree they aren't Robots btw, certainly when they were physically flagging that was proof they weren't. They needed help from the management at that point (they had proven in the first half they weren't slackers, but probably ran out of steam physically before we even get top what i think are intrinsic defensive issues...)
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Intrinsic defensive aptitude includes timing, aggression and positioning. None of which is tactical
 
metalgear said:
Yes i noticed that in the last few games and credited ange for being able to adapt.

That said...the combo of porro, dragusin, Davies and udogie is not doing well at all, despite the lower defensive line.
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The drop in the defensive line may be partly tactical because VdV isn't there. But I think it's mostly tired legs meaning that we can't press as high as much of t time.

Even against City when we did press high we did so with an imo similar defensive line as we did earlier in the season. Similarly in other games. But we're retreating to a somewhat deeper line earlier and more often because our players can't keep it up.

I think the defenders as individuals are doing fine. And as a unit doing fine. But we struggle defensively when the intensity of the team drops.

Edit: Just as an example. The Roma game. If we know one thing about Paredes it's that if he's given time and space on the ball he'll be pinging passes around brilliantly. If we know one thing about our fairly narrow defensive shape it's that when opponents are pinging switch balls and good medium to long range passes around we'll struggle.

The "solution" to that is intensity from the front line and midfield. Be it in a high press or a somewhat deeper organisation. But we just couldn't get enough intensity.
 
braineclipse said:
The drop in the defensive line may be partly tactical because VdV isn't there. But I think it's mostly tired legs meaning that we can't press as high as much of t time.

Even against City when we did press high we did so with an imo similar defensive line as we did earlier in the season. Similarly in other games. But we're retreating to a somewhat deeper line earlier and more often because our players can't keep it up.

I think the defenders as individuals are doing fine. And as a unit doing fine. But we struggle defensively when the intensity of the team drops.

Edit: Just as an example. The Roma game. If we know one thing about Paredes it's that if he's given time and space on the ball he'll be pinging passes around brilliantly. If we know one thing about our fairly narrow defensive shape it's that when opponents are pinging switch balls and good medium to long range passes around we'll struggle.

The "solution" to that is intensity from the front line and midfield. Be it in a high press or a somewhat deeper organisation. But we just couldn't get enough intensity.
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I'm hoping that drop in defence is very deliberate. It shows some smarts from Ange, replacing VDV with Davies. I'm only really recalling one foot race that Davies has found himself in so far in his league starts. It's not as if Udogie would ever be on the cover either, based on the way Ange plays his full-backs.

As you say though, when you drop the defence then you will create the holes elsewhere ahead of it. I remember when Jose allowed Toby to hold the back line almost back on our 18 yard line. Hojbjerg was with him for a lot of the game as well. Everyone was lambasting Tanguy for being lazy but the poor barsteward just couldn't manage the massive gap between midfield and our forwards. He was cream crackered after an hour. He obviously was quite lazy, but even Kulu would have struggled in that system.
 
Muttley said:
I'm hoping that drop in defence is very deliberate. It shows some smarts from Ange, replacing VDV with Davies. I'm only really recalling one foot race that Davies has found himself in so far in his league starts. It's not as if Udogie would ever be on the cover either, based on the way Ange plays his full-backs.

As you say though, when you drop the defence then you will create the holes elsewhere ahead of it. I remember when Jose allowed Toby to hold the back line almost back on our 18 yard line. Hojbjerg was with him for a lot of the game as well. Everyone was lambasting Tanguy for being lazy but the poor barsteward just couldn't manage the massive gap between midfield and our forwards. He was cream crackered after an hour. He obviously was quite lazy, but even Kulu would have struggled in that system.
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It’s starts at the top
The stats of PPDA are all about the press not the high line
Unless I’m wrong
 
Bedfordspurs said:
It’s starts at the top
The stats of PPDA are all about the press not the high line
Unless I’m wrong
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I would think PPDA has a symbiotic relationship with the defensive line though. A high press with a deep defence behind you just leaves more space between for the press to fail. The press just gets passed around and there is no turnover possession. Every time we make a defender hit the ball in the air, we have high percentage of winning back possession. Same as a misplaced pass into a tight space.

The 2 things surely have to be linked.
 
Muttley said:
I would think PPDA has a symbiotic relationship with the defensive line though. A high press with a deep defence behind you just leaves more space between for the press to fail. The press just gets passed around and there is no turnover possession. Every time we make a defender hit the ball in the air, we have high percentage of winning back possession. Same as a misplaced pass into a tight space.

The 2 things surely have to be linked.
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As understand it, it’s about how many passes a team makes before being engaged by a defender… so the press in our terms
I may be wrong though
 
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