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The case for the defence

DubSpur said:
That might have something to do with Conte having 10 players defending. There needs to be a balance.
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Yeah, sometimes there was that. If we did that for a while yesterday we might not have collapsed so badly. It is indeed about balance, and we seem to again not be finding it
 
glorygloryeze said:
We can always point to player error...but how long do we keep on puting these down to player error and not coaching? It's not like such errors are a one-off.

Similarly, why is Romero continually doing this and still getting picked?
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I can’t comment on Romero other than Ange thinking he offers us something more elsewhere on the pitch

Regarding the infidel errors I think that’s human nature as well as coaching. It’s why every player makes a mistake but they aren’t always as costly
 
Bedfordspurs said:
I can’t comment on Romero other than Ange thinking he offers us something more elsewhere on the pitch

Regarding the infidel errors I think that’s human nature as well as coaching. It’s why every player makes a mistake but they aren’t always as costly
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Our errors are almost always far more costly; i thin k by the opposition's design. Coaches look at how we set-up and play and look to exploit as appropriate. Its's often the same kind of mistakes in the same parts of the pitch too.
 
glorygloryeze said:
Our errors are almost always far more costly; i thin k by the opposition's design. Coaches look at how we set-up and play and look to exploit as appropriate. Its's often the same kind of mistakes in the same parts of the pitch too.
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It’s not
Your cross reference yesterday with goals we concede on counters… they weren’t yesterday
Or set pieces… we have concede one
We do know Brighton love to cross
I don’t think any team can set up tactically for what udogie did
 
Bedfordspurs said:
It’s not
Your cross reference yesterday with goals we concede on counters… they weren’t yesterday
Or set pieces… we have concede one
We do know Brighton love to cross
I don’t think any team can set up tactically for what udogie did
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I agree Udogie had an absolute mare yesterday. A symptom of having no-one who can rotate with him ad play the same way Ange wants, but we have talked about the summer before..oh well...

The issue i have is that all of our defenders regularly have days like Udogie did yesterday. It was Udogie yesterday, it's Romero most weeks, VDV other times, Porro another week. It's extremely rare that they all look solid at the same time and that to me is a symptom of our tactics and imo a severe lack of defensive strategy and coaching
 
glorygloryeze said:
I agree Udogie had an absolute mare yesterday. A symptom of having no-one who can rotate with him ad play the same way Ange wants, but we have talked about the summer before..oh well...

The issue i have is that all of our defenders regularly have days like Udogie did yesterday. It was Udogie yesterday, it's Romero most weeks, VDV other times, Porro another week. It's extremely rare that they all look solid at the same time and that to me is a symptom of our tactics and imo a severe lack of defensive strategy and coaching
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But how do they keep the clean sheets that they have?
 
glorygloryeze said:
What clean sheets? We've keep two in the league this season against Everton and a ten-man Man Utd, plus a VERY lucky one vs Qarabag who missed a lot of sitters and a penalty

Are you seriously saying our level of clean sheets is high??
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Well our defensive record was second best in the league before yesterday so we must have been doing something right
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Well our defensive record was second best in the league before yesterday so we must have been doing something right
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In terms of overall number of goals conceded yes, in terms of actual clean sheets, not really. And we didn't keep many last season either (as you'll probably know, i'm looking at trends over a long time..)
 
glorygloryeze said:
In terms of overall number of goals conceded yes, in terms of actual clean sheets, not really. And we didn't keep many last season either (as you'll probably know, i'm looking at trends over a long time..)
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Nope we didn’t
But we’re defending Much better this season statistically and factually
Yesterday was like a deck of cards … one player crumbles and they all crumble
Not sure why
We did see it a few times last year but haven’t this year so far
 
glorygloryeze said:
What instructions? Apart from press, or play high and let Micky outrun the attacker, is there any?
The way the defenders stand and their body shape compared to the better teams tell me they don't get that much defensive coaching.
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They are not sent out there with no game plan are they. Furthermore the absence of native defensive aptitude tells you the players are not concentrating.

They aren’t robots they don’t need basic instructions like a computer program.

If they are not going to concentrate any instruction to tell them to do so is a bit of a laugh.
 
johnola said:
They are not sent out there with no game plan are they. Furthermore the absence of native defensive aptitude tells you the players are not concentrating.

They aren’t robots they don’t need basic instructions like a computer program.

If they are not going to concentrate any instruction to tell them to do so is a bit of a laugh.
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This is an excuse that could be given for ANY manager when a team fails. In fact, should we have just kept all our previous managers because "the players aren't robots?"

I agree they aren't Robots btw, certainly when they were physically flagging that was proof they weren't. They needed help from the management at that point (they had proven in the first half they weren't slackers, but probably ran out of steam physically before we even get top what i think are intrinsic defensive issues...)
 
I know i have said it before but a lot of our problems at the back would be solved with a proper DM, Bents has been doing a decent job there but his real strengths lay elsewhere. We do not have a player whose MAIN duty is to sweep up in front of the defense and get involved in our box when needed. It needs a certain mindset to do that job well and sadly we miss that. IMO
 
parklane1 said:
I know i have said it before but a lot of our problems at the back would be solved with a proper DM, Bents has been doing a decent job there but his real strengths lay elsewhere. We do not have a player whose MAIN duty is to sweep up in front of the defense and get involved in our box when needed. It needs a certain mindset to do that job well and sadly we miss that. IMO
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I get your logic
But a proper Dm doesn’t cause the Ndogie fudge ups or Romero switching off
 
parklane1 said:
A proper DM will be giving orders to/in all defensive situations, fudge ups are always going to happen but less so when we have a player who commands that posistion.
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Possibly
But the speed of the when of we’re relying on a dm telling a CB to mark his man again… we have big big issues
 
Bedfordspurs said:
I get your logic
But a proper Dm doesn’t cause the Ndogie fudge ups or Romero switching off
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I think Brighton's winner yesterday was far more attributable to Bentancur's terrible attempt at blocking the cross than Romero switching off. 19 times out of 20 that cross is blocked and goes out for a corner.
 
glorygloryeze said:
Perhaps. You would think he's be ripe for being dropped....however, wuld things change? I'm starting to think not and even if we had prime Nesta and Maldini, our defensive shortcomings will continue.

Personnel-wise this defence is better than what Conte had to work with but yet we are getting much worse out of them.
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Interesting point on Conte, not sure whether I agree or disagree but I will add that I think Dragusin would be a monster in a back three for him, whereas Dragu looks a little out of place when playing for us. Not that he has had enough time on the pitch to really get settled in of course.

Romero and VDV are an increasingly perplexing partnership, many Spurs fans would no doubt have them as the best pairing in the league but the goals conceded with them seem to be racking up. They both provide moments of absolute class which is great to see, but do they actually work as a unit across the course of a 90 minute game? I'm always hesitant to make judgement as it's possibly a lack of shielding in front of them but even still Cuti in particular just doesn't appear to marking strikers in the box who end up scoring. His passing in the 1st half was immense as he was doing some intriguing body shape feints which opened up some passes in to great areas and I wanted to wax lyrical about it at the time, but then the 2nd half performance kind of took the shine off - As well as contributing offensively it's reasonable for one to want their CBs to actually defend well...
 
Finney Is Back said:
I think Brighton's winner yesterday was far more attributable to Bentancur's terrible attempt at blocking the cross than Romero switching off. 19 times out of 20 that cross is blocked and goes out for a corner.
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It was multiple rooster ips
4 players around one man an no one tackling
Romero leaving his man
Who was marking Mitoma if it was missed by wellbeck
Scary
 
We need to stop making it so easy to get around the sides, we defend so narrow and allow players time and space to control the ball and put crosses in.

There is always an easy out ball against us, always a way to get up the pitch.
 
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