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Summer transfer thread, AvB window wrap up pg 1527

Which player would you like to see take over from Luka Modric?

  • Total voters
    147
  • Poll closed .
I mean questionable as in whether Naughton still wants to be here, he signed three years ago and has played one league game and probably knows himself that he won't be getting in ahead of Walker anytime soon, plus I think he only has a year left on his contract - unless we have an option to extend.
 
joey55 said:
Talk of massive transition etc is a bit much in my opinion. Harry and AVB are working in the same constraints, so AVB needs to follow Harrys' lead. Many on here criticize Harry, but like we are seeing now under AVB, it's hard to sign quality younger players. Gaps will always be left in the squad and therefore a good short term strategy is the best option. It's far better to sign older, free players like Brad, Saha and Nelson, that pay money for younger players, on long contract if they aren't the one's you really want. For example, if AVB can't get one of his first choice strikers this window, it's better to sign a Saha type for a year and having a go next summer, rather than spending £12 million on a striker that isn't ideal for him.

We finished 8th in Harry's first season and without much money or CL football, he strengthened the squad with some pretty unfancied players that summer and went on to finish 4th. AVB has to do the same. If we can't get the players we wants, he either has to gap fill with short terms older players or give the squad the balance it needs by buying less fancied names that he knows can do a job. Not many likes Crouch, but he did give us a different option and thus gave the squad a well rounded feel. Many thought Kranjcar was up to much, but he gave us something different to our other attacking midfielders.

Just because many of our fans don't appreciate Harry's methods, doesn't mean they weren't in fact the optimum way of working given the constraints placed on a Spurs manager. AVB has to look at what made Harry so successful and many of the reasons for that were things many of our fans hugely criticized him for. It will be tough for a lot of our fans to accept that, but it's probably true. If we don't challenge for a top 4 spot this season and we haven't filled in the gaps in our squad, there is no point blaming Harry or even Levy. Levy doesn't make things easy, but Harry has shown with the right approach (though hated by many fans) we can challenge. From what I've heard when AVB speaks, he seems like a bright guy and I have faith he can do it.

If we can't sign a Leandro type, then he has to be creative in the market. This could mean a short term signing. The same is true of the GK situation. If he can't get the keeper he wants, he should wait until next summer and Brad will be fine for another year. If he can't sign a big name right sided forward, then he shouldn't be afraid to go into the loan market. If a quality player suddenly becomes available at the last minute, he needs to be prepared to accommodate that. These are just the things a Spurs manager under Levy needs to be able to do. At the end of the day we've finished in the top 5, 3 seasons in a row and he'd be a fool not to look at how the previous manager was able to do this, even if it means tinkling off fans.
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I think the difference will be that once the immediate gapping holes are plugged by some decent investment, AVB will be creative with youth signings and development, rather than squeezing an extra year out of glue factory bound players.

In January and beyond I fully expect us to start picking up the next Falcaos from River Plate for £2m (or Leandro 2 years ago) etc.

He fits Levy's vision in this sense.
 
Gutter Boy said:
I think the difference will be that once the immediate gapping holes are plugged by some decent investment, AVB will be creative with youth signings and development, rather than squeezing an extra year out of glue factory bound players.

In January and beyond I fully expect us to start picking up the next Falcaos from River Plate for £2m (or Leandro 2 years ago) etc.

He fits Levy's vision in this sense.
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Do you have confidence that he is going to get decent money to spend? I think it's pretty obvious that the stadium is going to have a significant impact on our transfer spending.
 
Gutter Boy said:
I think the difference will be that once the immediate gapping holes are plugged by some decent investment, AVB will be creative with youth signings and development, rather than squeezing an extra year out of glue factory bound players.

In January and beyond I fully expect us to start picking up the next Falcaos from River Plate for £2m (or Leandro 2 years ago) etc.

He fits Levy's vision in this sense.
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If that's Levy's vision then he needs to get a grip. Look at why Jol got fired. The squad was full of young talented players, but not enough older heads. The history of the game shows that a clubs ethos is developed by the example set by senior players. See Fergusons interview with Sir David Frost. Look at how Arsenal declined after they failed to replace the older players. Look at how we improved as our squad got dramatically older. Levy and anyone else who still buys into this idea that the coach can work miracles need to do some homework and get a reality check. The myth is that Utd's young players became what they were because of Ferguson, but the reality is that they were brought into a squad where the standards were set by Bryan Robson, Mark Hughes, and Steve Bruce. Scott Parker, Brad Friedel and Ryan Nelson might not be the most talented players in the world, but how the behave and the dedication they show on the training ground will be more valuable to our young players than any coach.

At the end of the day, if the players aren't good enough to challenge for the top 4 now, those who are want to leave. They don't want to wait for youngsters to develop. AVB will be the same as Redknapp. He'll develop the players that are good enough and have to look to fill the gaps in the squad with others. He's not going to ignore the how well loaning the likes of Walker, Caulker and Naughton out has been. He'll look to do the same again and certainly wont hold player back by using them to plug holes in the squad.

It's going to be painful for many of you, but AVB really wont change that much and he's certain to recognize that Harry did a brilliant job and look to carry on a similar approach, but tweaking where he thinks he can make a difference. Tottenham managers have to work in a certain way and under certain constraints. Harry's shown the way to be successful working within these constraints and AVB wont be managing in this fantasy style many of our fans seem to think he will. He isn't going to be getting anything more out of the players, young players wont improve any quicker, the tactics wont be better, the fitness wont be better and we aren't suddenly going to start buying top class players that are ready to come in and take us to a higher level. You need to get real about the impact a coach can really have, otherwise the guy has no chance. It's the club and infastructure that hold us back, or rather the clubs and infastructures of our rivals. Money talks and the sooner everyone realizes that the better and we stop living this fantasy every few years thinking that we are just some tactical genius away from challenging for the top.
 
joey55 said:
If that's Levy's vision then he needs to get a grip. Look at why Jol got fired. The squad was full of young talented players, but not enough older heads. The history of the game shows that a clubs ethos is developed by the example set by senior players. See Fergusons interview with Sir David Frost. Look at how Arsenal declined after they failed to replace the older players. Look at how we improved as our squad got dramatically older. Levy and anyone else who still buys into this idea that the coach can work miracles need to do some homework and get a reality check. The myth is that Utd's young players became what they were because of Ferguson, but the reality is that they were brought into a squad where the standards were set by Bryan Robson, Mark Hughes, and Steve Bruce. Scott Parker, Brad Friedel and Ryan Nelson might not be the most talented players in the world, but how the behave and the dedication they show on the training ground will be more valuable to our young players than any coach.

At the end of the day, if the players aren't good enough to challenge for the top 4 now, those who are want to leave. They don't want to wait for youngsters to develop. AVB will be the same as Redknapp. He'll develop the players that are good enough and have to look to fill the gaps in the squad with others. He's not going to ignore the how well loaning the likes of Walker, Caulker and Naughton out has been. He'll look to do the same again and certainly wont hold player back by using them to plug holes in the squad.

It's going to be painful for many of you, but AVB really wont change that much and he's certain to recognize that Harry did a brilliant job and look to carry on a similar approach, but tweaking where he thinks he can make a difference. Tottenham managers have to work in a certain way and under certain constraints. Harry's shown the way to be successful working within these constraints and AVB wont be managing in this fantasy style many of our fans seem to think he will. He isn't going to be getting anything more out of the players, young players wont improve any quicker, the tactics wont be better, the fitness wont be better and we aren't suddenly going to start buying top class players that are ready to come in and take us to a higher level. You need to get real about the impact a coach can really have, otherwise the guy has no chance. It's the club and infastructure that hold us back, or rather the clubs and infastructures of our rivals. Money talks and the sooner everyone realizes that the better and we stop living this fantasy every few years thinking that we are just some tactical genius away from challenging for the top.
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Exactly. You need a mixture of both. No point having a team full of youngsters or older players. Players get old, they need replacing, that's football. Every team has players they struggle to get rid of. Look at Emirates Marketing Project! Arsenal have been trying to get rid of Bendtner for ages.

Our squad is still good enough to finish in the top 6 minimum.
 
Jurgen the German said:
Do you have confidence that he is going to get decent money to spend? I think it's pretty obvious that the stadium is going to have a significant impact on our transfer spending.
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To be honest we can probably use the funds from Modric, Gio, Bassong, Defoe, Bentley etc. to fund signing say Ade, Leandro, Moutinho and a GK. We could probably get everything we need and break even due particularly to the Modric windfall.
 
joey55 said:
If that's Levy's vision then he needs to get a grip. Look at why Jol got fired. The squad was full of young talented players, but not enough older heads. The history of the game shows that a clubs ethos is developed by the example set by senior players. See Fergusons interview with Sir David Frost. Look at how Arsenal declined after they failed to replace the older players. Look at how we improved as our squad got dramatically older. Levy and anyone else who still buys into this idea that the coach can work miracles need to do some homework and get a reality check. The myth is that Utd's young players became what they were because of Ferguson, but the reality is that they were brought into a squad where the standards were set by Bryan Robson, Mark Hughes, and Steve Bruce. Scott Parker, Brad Friedel and Ryan Nelson might not be the most talented players in the world, but how the behave and the dedication they show on the training ground will be more valuable to our young players than any coach.

At the end of the day, if the players aren't good enough to challenge for the top 4 now, those who are want to leave. They don't want to wait for youngsters to develop. AVB will be the same as Redknapp. He'll develop the players that are good enough and have to look to fill the gaps in the squad with others. He's not going to ignore the how well loaning the likes of Walker, Caulker and Naughton out has been. He'll look to do the same again and certainly wont hold player back by using them to plug holes in the squad.

It's going to be painful for many of you, but AVB really wont change that much and he's certain to recognize that Harry did a brilliant job and look to carry on a similar approach, but tweaking where he thinks he can make a difference. Tottenham managers have to work in a certain way and under certain constraints. Harry's shown the way to be successful working within these constraints and AVB wont be managing in this fantasy style many of our fans seem to think he will. He isn't going to be getting anything more out of the players, young players wont improve any quicker, the tactics wont be better, the fitness wont be better and we aren't suddenly going to start buying top class players that are ready to come in and take us to a higher level. You need to get real about the impact a coach can really have, otherwise the guy has no chance. It's the club and infastructure that hold us back, or rather the clubs and infastructures of our rivals. Money talks and the sooner everyone realizes that the better and we stop living this fantasy every few years thinking that we are just some tactical genius away from challenging for the top.
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I think there's a difference between experience and leadership. We've always had experience (Sheringham, Poyet, Naybet, Davids etc), but we've rarely had genuine leadership. IMO Gallas and vdV were the first players in practically decades who brought leadership and a winning mentality to the club, and I do think they have helped it spread.

Ideally some of our players moving into their mid-20s now, the likes of Kaboul, BAE, Lennon etc. will start start showing a growing maturity and seniority, alongside the natural leaders like Rafa and Verts.

You then bring in young players to learn from them.

That's the way to progress as a club - organic growth - not bringing in washed-up journeymen for a final payday as quick fixes.
 
Gutter Boy said:
I think there's a difference between experience and leadership. We've always had experience (Sheringham, Poyet, Naybet, Davids etc), but we've rarely had genuine leadership. IMO Gallas and vdV were the first players in practically decades who brought leadership and a winning mentality to the club, and I do think they have helped it spread.

Ideally some of our players moving into their mid-20s now, the likes of Kaboul, BAE, Lennon etc. will start start showing a growing maturity and seniority, alongside the natural leaders like Rafa and Verts.

You then bring in young players to learn from them.

That's the way to progress as a club - organic growth - not bringing in washed-up journeymen for a final payday as quick fixes.
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But unless you've not been watching Spurs over the last couple of years you'll know that's wrong. If younger quality players are available and have the attributes the manager wants, then obviously they are who we go for. But, as is very often the case, we can't get them, there is nothing wrong and a hell of a lot right about the quick fix. So many of your views seem to be forged without any basis of what really happens in football. We've just had the second most successful season in our Prem history and we did it with only paying one transfer fee. Harry has said we tried to sign Mata and Phil Jones. We tried to sign Tevez. We were sloe to Diarra but ultimately couldn't afford him. So instead of buying alternatives that weren't the managers first choice, we looked to plug gaps. That's the way to progress, whether you like it or not. Arsenal do it, Utd do it and there is no reason we shouldn't do it. If AVB can't get the players he wants, he'll have to do the same and if he doesn't we'll be left behind. There is no point trying to blame the previous management if we fail, as the previous management showed how it should be done. Once we have a new stadium and thus higher revenues, we'll have much more success in attaining the younger players we want. Until then any Spurs manager is going to have to very shrewd.
 
Gutter Boy said:
I think there's a difference between experience and leadership. We've always had experience (Sheringham, Poyet, Naybet, Davids etc), but we've rarely had genuine leadership. IMO Gallas and vdV were the first players in practically decades who brought leadership and a winning mentality to the club, and I do think they have helped it spread.

Ideally some of our players moving into their mid-20s now, the likes of Kaboul, BAE, Lennon etc. will start start showing a growing maturity and seniority, alongside the natural leaders like Rafa and Verts.

You then bring in young players to learn from them.

That's the way to progress as a club - organic growth - not bringing in washed-up journeymen for a final payday as quick fixes.
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That's what we've done. We've brought in Walker, Naughton, Dos Santos and Sandro to name a few. Our youth system isn't very good, and that's putting it lightly!
 
a spur from swansea said:
you could say us doing our business late is getting value,well we lost both our games in august last year,yes it was against city and utd,who knows we could have got a point or two if the modric business had been sorted sooner,and parker and ade had played,and how many points were we behind the goons at the end......yes one point,so is that getting value ,losing 20 million plus because of this towing and frowing.
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We didn't fail to finish above the goons because of those two games. I think games such as QPR away, Villa away and Wolves at home cost us far, far more...not to mention that absolute debacle at the deathstar itself. As a further note of discussion, there are other clubs outside the carbon circle (and even within it!) who are also stalling on their business...I get the impression that the Modric and Van Persie situations are holding up a whole wheel of potential activity all round...
 
thfcsteff said:
We didn't fail to finish above the goons because of those two games. I think games such as QPR away, Villa away and Wolves at home cost us far, far more...not to mention that absolute debacle at the deathstar itself. As a further note of discussion, there are other clubs outside the carbon circle (and even within it!) who are also stalling on their business...I get the impression that the Modric and Van Persie situations are holding up a whole wheel of potential activity all round...
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Every game counts towards the final standings. We operate in the same way when it comes to the January window, we wait till the last day more often than not to conclude our business.
 
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