Summer transfer thread, AvB window wrap up pg 1527

[jts1882]

I bow to your greater wisdom on this Jimmy but my point was not the future spend on the stadium but the money that has already been spent on the stadium and training ground. This has to have had impact on the transfer budget in recent years, right?

I think that has been funded from debt. We went from negligible debt to £60-70m which could well be explained by the extra £30m on the new training facility (above the £15m share offering), purchase of properties on the Wingate Trading Estate and architects fees.

 

[Bullet]

Guys, as Jimmy implied you can't just look at transfer fees

A player on £100kpw like Bale is on £5mpa

So you can buy someone for £8m and commit to spend £5mpa for 4+2 years = £8m to buy and £30m in wages

Then add in agent fees of £3m and increasing salary over 6 years for another £8m and various bits and bobs and before you know it, an £8m player is actually costing Spurs £50m in real terms.

 

[joey55]

Whatever it is I don't think anyone can fault avb for not doing better than redknapp. This season is a transitional one. Levy probably won't risk anything until the new stadium is done.

I don't think AVB is the issue here either. But there is a very strong argument that Harry would have made sure it wasn't a transition season. I think this pre- season has shown Harry is owed a massive apology by a good number of our fans who complained about his transfers etc. It could have just as easily been a transition season inn 2009/10, but Harry brought in a number of players our fans really didn't fancy. I doubt these were Harry's first choice signing either, but when it became clear he couldn't get the big names, he made sure the squad was balanced. Last season he said he wanted the likes of Mata and Phil Jones. We couldn't get them, but he brought in 3 signings our fans were largely very opposed to and got us into the top 4. So whilst I don't blame AVB per se, Harry has shown a top class manager can operate and be successful under Levy's restrictions. Let's not forget when Modric was out with a broken leg, we still maintained CL form with a front 2 of Crouch/Defoe and a CM pairing of Hudd/Palacios.

I don't think AVB should take the blame if things don't go right as he didn't appoint himself, but this shouldn't be a transition season. The likes of Remy, Dembele and Lass Diara are surely available. Huddlestone is also fit. At the moment we don't look capable of replicating or improving on last season, but there is no reason why we shouldn't be. Transition isn't an excuse and we can't afford a transition season, as our best players will want to leave if we aren't challenging and next season quality players wont want to come if we don't challenge this season.

 

[paxtonwolf]

akqayid ‏@akqayid
A lion has had his heart stirred. Soon we will hear him roar. #scitk

Yeah okay...:yawn:

 

[jts1882]

The fact we don't seem to have that money is the thing I don't get. I would hope we are not hoping to use player trading surpluses to fund infrastructure projects.

Read Jimmyb's post. I think he is right about the shift from low salaries and buying new players to higher salaries and retaining players (plus a larger squad) explains where most of the money has gone.

 

[jts1882]

I don't think AVB is the issue here either. But there is a very strong argument that Harry would have made sure it wasn't a transition season.

How?

The two big problems are signing Adebayor and needing a Modric replacement. In addition, we have players like Bentley on big wages who we can't move on. I doubt 'Arry could have changed things much.

 

[Nutter-Naylor]

I don't think AVB is the issue here either. But there is a very strong argument that Harry would have made sure it wasn't a transition season. I think this pre- season has shown Harry is owed a massive apology by a good number of our fans who complained about his transfers etc. It could have just as easily been a transition season inn 2009/10, but Harry brought in a number of players our fans really didn't fancy. I doubt these were Harry's first choice signing either, but when it became clear he couldn't get the big names, he made sure the squad was balanced. Last season he said he wanted the likes of Mata and Phil Jones. We couldn't get them, but he brought in 3 signings our fans were largely very opposed to and got us into the top 4. So whilst I don't blame AVB per se, Harry has shown a top class manager can operate and be successful under Levy's restrictions. Let's not forget when Modric was out with a broken leg, we still maintained CL form with a front 2 of Crouch/Defoe and a CM pairing of Hudd/Palacios.

I don't think AVB should take the blame if things don't go right as he didn't appoint himself, but this shouldn't be a transition season. The likes of Remy, Dembele and Lass Diara are surely available. Huddlestone is also fit. At the moment we don't look capable of replicating or improving on last season, but there is no reason why we shouldn't be. Transition isn't an excuse and we can't afford a transition season, as our best players will want to leave if we aren't challenging and next season quality players wont want to come if we don't challenge this season.

We haven't kicked a ball yet!

But i might agree with you come 7.30pm.......

 

[DHSF]

Read Jimmyb's post. I think he is right about the shift from low salaries and buying new players to higher salaries and retaining players (plus a larger squad) explains where most of the money has gone.

I dont buy that - like i have always said this summer the one transfer that blows quite alot of the stuff that has been assumed out of the water is the Sig signing.

If we had transfer funds - why Sig? why not save the cash and put towards a striker? as most would agree a higher priority area.

If we had no money for wages then where the fudge has all the savings from the sale and loans of our players last year?

If our shift is from retaining players then er why buy Sig and not keep our current players and buy a striker.

Look either way everything points that we do have the cash and either we are being fudgein lazy in our pursuit of players or we cant offer the wages due to our wage structure.

 

[Rorschach]

I think that has been funded from debt. We went from negligible debt to £60-70m which could well be explained by the extra £30m on the new training facility (above the £15m share offering), purchase of properties on the Wingate Trading Estate and architects fees.

I'm sure I read (on here) that the infrastructure spend was well north of 100mil. 45mil on the training facility and whatever on the land acquisitions so maybe the truth is somewhere in between. Half from loans and rest from current expenditure.


Irrespective of what has happened I would be disappointed if we adopt the Arsenalesque zero net transfer spend approach to fund the stadium. We'll just get dragged back into the pack.

 

[Spursalot]

I don't think AVB is the issue here either. But there is a very strong argument that Harry would have made sure it wasn't a transition season. I think this pre- season has shown Harry is owed a massive apology by a good number of our fans who complained about his transfers etc. It could have just as easily been a transition season inn 2009/10, but Harry brought in a number of players our fans really didn't fancy. I doubt these were Harry's first choice signing either, but when it became clear he couldn't get the big names, he made sure the squad was balanced. Last season he said he wanted the likes of Mata and Phil Jones. We couldn't get them, but he brought in 3 signings our fans were largely very opposed to and got us into the top 4. So whilst I don't blame AVB per se, Harry has shown a top class manager can operate and be successful under Levy's restrictions. Let's not forget when Modric was out with a broken leg, we still maintained CL form with a front 2 of Crouch/Defoe and a CM pairing of Hudd/Palacios.

I don't think AVB should take the blame if things don't go right as he didn't appoint himself, but this shouldn't be a transition season. The likes of Remy, Dembele and Lass Diara are surely available. Huddlestone is also fit. At the moment we don't look capable of replicating or improving on last season, but there is no reason why we shouldn't be. Transition isn't an excuse and we can't afford a transition season, as our best players will want to leave if we aren't challenging and next season quality players wont want to come if we don't challenge this season.

There is always a transitional season when you change managers.

Whether it is successful or not is a different question.


Harry had his chance to make sure this was not a transitional season, he had the chance to get 3rd. He blew it.

 

[DHSF]

How?

The two big problems are signing Adebayor and needing a Modric replacement. In addition, we have players like Bentley on big wages who we can't move on. I doubt 'Arry could have changed things much.

No but harry did give away Bentley on loan.

He also gave away Jenas on loan

That was the whole thing though wasnt it - get rid of players i.e. the deadwood either for transfer fees or for at least the wage savings.

We havent actually done that this window - maybe no one really wants them. I would go as far as saying just give the deadwood away

 

[Spursalot]

We haven't kicked a ball yet!

But i might agree with you come 7.30pm.......

Marathon not a sprint..


Remember how badly the first two games went last season?

 

[joey55]

How?

The two big problems are signing Adebayor and needing a Modric replacement. In addition, we have players like Bentley on big wages who we can't move on. I doubt 'Arry could have changed things much.

By doing the same as he'd done in previous seasons by signing players our fans didn't fancy and weren't his ideal choices. As I pointed out Harry maintained CL form when Modric had a broken leg. We don't have to sign a Moutinho or Sahin. We need fall back options. I can't see how you can doubt Harry would have changed things much as he always delivered. We don't know AVB wont. He might well have some very good plan B's that will come to fruition in the last few days on the window, if we can't get our first choice options. It might be a case of Levy saying such and such a player has become available (like with VDV). But the last few seasons have shown us we can compete. We've already got some fantastic players, we just need a bit more balance. We are short of strikers, but don't tell me we can't bring in players of a higher standard than Keane (2nd time around) and Peter Crouch, as I wont accept that. The same it true of midfield, where we already have just as good CM options as the Hudd/Palacios pairing. Basically there is no excuse for now having a balanced squad with options. They might not be of the highest quality, but we've shown in the past we can still achieve like that.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

No but harry did give away Bentley on loan.

He also gave away Jenas on loan

That was the whole thing though wasnt it - get rid of players i.e. the deadwood either for transfer fees or for at least the wage savings.

We havent actually done that this window - maybe no one really wants them. I would go as far as saying just give the deadwood away

The likes of Bentley are more likely to go as the deadline gets nearer. Clubs will scramble around for targets that they don't get and then will decide to take a punt on someone like Bentley who won't be getting games here.

Just because we haven't done it yet, doesn't mean we still can't.

 

[DHSF]

The likes of Bentley are more likely to go as the deadline gets nearer. Clubs will scramble around for targets that they don't get and then will decide to take a punt on someone like Bentley who won't be getting games here.

Just because we haven't done it yet, doesn't mean we still can't.

I agree we still can

Im hoping he goes back to Blackburn

Bassong goes to somewhere like Norwich

We need them off the wage bill but lets be honest it still wont help buying as two different budgets

 

[jts1882]

By doing the same as he'd done in previous seasons by signing players our fans didn't fancy and weren't his ideal choices. As I pointed out Harry maintained CL form when Modric had a broken leg. We don't have to sign a Moutinho or Sahin. We need fall back options. I can't see how you can doubt Harry would have changed things much as he always delivered. We don't know AVB wont. He might well have some very good plan B's that will come to fruition in the last few days on the window, if we can't get our first choice options. It might be a case of Levy saying such and such a player has become available (like with VDV). But the last few seasons have shown us we can compete. We've already got some fantastic players, we just need a bit more balance. We are short of strikers, but don't tell me we can't bring in players of a higher standard than Keane (2nd time around) and Peter Crouch, as I wont accept that. The same it true of midfield, where we already have just as good CM options as the Hudd/Palacios pairing. Basically there is no excuse for now having a balanced squad with options. They might not be of the highest quality, but we've shown in the past we can still achieve like that.

I wasn't saying that 'Arry couldn't have made necessary changes. I was challenging your assertion that we wouldn't have a transition season with 'Arry and will with AVB. I was saying both face the same problems with Ade, Modric, excess players etc. We don't know what AVB's solutions will be but we can't assume 'Arry would solve them.

You say there is no reason why we can't bring in players of a higher standard than Keane and Crouch, but 'Arry certainly didn't when he was manager so why assume he would now. The fallback options 'Arry signed were all signed late in the window, as you'd expect, so nothing different so far. We are still likely to sign some fallback options before the window closes if the main targets are not obtained. You talk about there being no excuse for not having a balanced squad with options, but it was 'Arry who is responsible for the state of the squad (he was manager for four years) and he sold Palacios (one of the options you mentioned). The problems we face now are exactly the same ones 'Arry would have faced, and 'Arry has some responsibility for them (along with Levy), so it seems odd to blame AVB.

 

[Jordinho]

Guillem Balague @GuillemBalague

Valencia rejected Swansea's offer for Pablo. Player upset but club thinks its too late to let him go
Valencia also rejected an offer for Soldado from Spurs. Now the London club is after Leandro and Fernando Llorente
Modric only wants to go to Madrid. I dont see Levy selling to Chelsea despite the last 40m+ offer. 3-5m more will take player to Madrid
Sahin still debating what to do. Liverpool hopeful but Arsenal have insisted this week on his signature. Madrid expect resolution next week
Athletic want the 36m euros of Llorente's buyout clause. Player happy 2 go 2 Spurs. But if not sold FCB and Madrid will fight 4 him in Jan

 

[NaijaSpurs]

Miguel Pérez Cuesta £2m and a double on his debute for Reading, could be a good bit of business for them.

 

[metalgear]

Things is we are glaringly unbalanced, not sufficiently resourced to start the season. If it is a transitional season we still could have bought a couple of cheap strikers. We failed somewhere, levy most likely with the late and sudden sacking of redknapp. Not that he didn't deserve to go but perhaps should have gone much earlier. Levy = abramovich = too much tinkering methinks.

 

[markysimmo]

Things is we are glaringly unbalanced, not sufficiently resourced to start the season. If it is a transitional season we still could have bought a couple of cheap strikers. We failed somewhere, levy most likely with the late and sudden sacking of redknapp. Not that he didn't deserve to go but perhaps should have gone much earlier. Levy = abramovich = too much tinkering methinks.

He went end of June, thats over 6 weeks ago, plenty of time to have identified and got in targets by now..

Its Levy fudging about as per usual