Jan Vertonghen

[Spursalot]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

I agree and think you can add Sandro, Capoue and Lamela to the list of those loitering near the exit come the summer window.

Really? What signs have you seen from any of those three to even suggest such a thing?

 

[paxtonwolf]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Yeah, he seems disinterested far too often. Great talent, but poor poor attitude when he can go out and claim something like that. **** all those egocentric bastards, are we a football team or are we not? If he's not interested in playing for Tottenham, then he can **** right off, wear our jersey with pride and give the 110% needed or go somewhere else. I can't believe this ****.

Just to re-iterate - Verts is a fantastic talent, on a good day one of our absolute best players, but far too often he looks disinterested in playing, lazy and blaming everyone else for everything. Poor attitude on the lad - don't think I've ever seen the lad smile.[/QUOTE]

I remember that picture of some of team celebrating in the corner after Paulinho got the winner at Cardiff, he looked totally p#ssed off, you would have never of thought we had just snatched a win

 

[SteveAWOL]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Those were the days...

@premierleague: After three goals in four #BPL appearances, Spurs' Jan Vertonghen is Barclays Player of the Month for March.

@sadaq_m: Jan Vertonghen and Gareth Bale both made the PFA Team of The Season.

@AddictedtoSpurs: Former Ajax players and now current Tottenham stars @Jan_Vertonghen and @ChrisEriksen8 watching Ajax

 

[WhoopWhoop]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Levys probably over the moon with those comments can now sell him for the big profits he gets a hardon over and claim it was then old 'unhappy player' bowlocks

 

[awesome dawson]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Great player but if his head isn't right for a Spurs level challenge (i.e) aiming for top four but far from guaranteed to get it, then he should do one and go join an oil company like Emirates Marketing Project or PSG.

 

[AVB]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Could be just getting higher wages for his new contract, says he might leave to the media to bump his contract

 

[braineclipse]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

My view on Vertonghen is he's that super bright kid in school that coasts through without having to put any work in but doesnt get the results he should do.

He's top quality and he knows it but thinks he can sleep through games and pull out match saving tackles without concentrating.
He was shown up on thursday for exactly this type of lazyness.

I've no idea how you motivate him as I feel he thinks football is beneath him. That sheepish "what the **** am I doing with my life" look he give the opposition crowd as he nearly tumbled into them trying to keep ball in. That "why the **** am I working with these idiots" reaction he was to Kyle Walker's Halloween prank video.

What's Dawson's excuse? What's Rose's What was Walker's excuse when he had his poor run?

Man with relaxed body language makes mistake - oh, ****s sake, lazy git. Man with pumped up body language lets ball bounce over his head - oh, at least he's trying.

Mistake on Thursday? Which mistakes are you talking about by the way? Did he make more mistakes than Rose and Dawson?

Vertonghen has always looked calm and relaxed on the pitch. Very often that's an advantage.

I agree, think its flavour of the month to say he has given up on us and people are seeing things which aren't there. I actually think he was good on Saturday and was making plenty of sliding tackles and interceptions which aren't the first sign of a disenchanted player.

Spot on. Ekotto got so much stick for his attitude, but he kept doing his job.

 

[braineclipse]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

I absolutely, wholeheartedly agree with this post, particularly the boldface...

Similar question to you Steff...

What's Dawson's excuse?

Whenever Vertonghen makes a mistake it's because of his attitude, but when other players make mistakes it's just because they're not good enough. For whatever reason Vertonghen can't just be having a poor game or be out of form, it has to be an attitude problem?

Related situation: Ekotto's calm and relaxed attitude allowed him to be cool under pressure, he was a player we could actually trust to make proper passes. He even had a decent cross in him at times. We know Rose can strike a ball, but how often do we see him look up in frustration at his own poor cross, perhaps a more Ekotto-esque attitude could have been better. Intensity, aggression, how pumped up a player is, these all fall on a continuum and although there's an advantage to having players all the way at the super intensity side of things there are also many advantages to a more relaxed, calm attitude.

Same with Ade, if he misses a chance it's because he doesn't care. But if Defoe smashes it straight at the goalkeeper with the composure of a teenager with internet access at least his attitude is right. Right...? Or perhaps not, perhaps there's a connection between composure at key times and the overall attitude of a player?

Perhaps if Dawson was a bit cooler he wouldn't have gotten dragged in and cancelled out the offside for the goal against Norwich. Not saying it was all Dawson's fault, Rose and of course Bentaleb have to shoulder a lot of the blame. But had that been Vertonghen cancelling out the offside I'm sure someone would be saying it's because of his ****ty concentration levels and a result of him being lazy and not caring anymore. Yet Dawson is always "trying his hardest", cool as a cucumber plunging into a stir fry.

 

[indianspur]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Vertonghen is not a jolly smiler, he is far more intense..... our best defender, fcuking eck people, lets get off his back

 

[indianspur]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

my guess about Vertonghen is that he is on a low contract compared to others, and that is affecting him, he doesnt feel valued. Levy probably got him on the cheap and hasnt bothered to renegotiate terms.

 

[spurs' magna carter]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

my guess about Vertonghen is that he is on a low contract compared to others, and that is affecting him, he doesnt feel valued. Levy probably got him on the cheap and hasnt bothered to renegotiate terms.

Nope.

Think about about it, we've missed it beyond words as fans, think how much he misses it as a player.

Wouldn't be surprised if him and Hugo want to go because they perceive our ambition as just good intentions poor execution. Also, I can't see the place jumping for joy atm after the thrashings, obvious confidence problems with certain players, the sacking of AVB, Liverpool just unable to stop winning etc.

 

[indianspur]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Nope.

Think about about it, we've missed it beyond words as fans, think how much he misses it as a player.

Wouldn't be surprised if him and Hugo want to go because they perceive our ambition as just good intentions poor execution. Also, I can't see the place jumping for joy atm after the thrashings, obvious confidence problems with certain players, the sacking of AVB, Liverpool just unable to stop winning etc.

yeah, im sure that plays a part, but he did join a club that was not in the CL and has only participated in the CL just once since its inception. So he knew what he was getting himself into.

 

[Yiddo]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

But surely as a player and all the speculation about a big name coming in as manager in the summer, you would want to stay around to see who it is and also give them a season to see how it goes?

 

[indianspur]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

But surely as a player and all the speculation about a big name coming in as manager in the summer, you would want to stay around to see who it is and also give them a season to see how it goes?

after being part of the Ajax family, Vertonghen has probably has some inside info that in fact LVG has got the Spurs job and he is not happy about it at all

 

[braineclipse]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

yeah, im sure that plays a part, but he did join a club that was not in the CL and has only participated in the CL just once since its inception. So he knew what he was getting himself into.

He also knew that several players have used us as a stepping stone and as he says in his interview his ambitions are pretty clear cut.

Hopefully Yiddo is right and whatever happens come the summer will convince Vertonghen to stay another year at least. Has been reported that he has two years left on his contract this summer, but that we have an option to extend. Not sure how accurate this is to be honest, but would give Levy some power to work with.

 

[Spur of the moment]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

What's Dawson's excuse? What's Rose's What was Walker's excuse when he had his poor run?

Man with relaxed body language makes mistake - oh, ****s sake, lazy git. Man with pumped up body language lets ball bounce over his head - oh, at least he's trying.

Mistake on Thursday? Which mistakes are you talking about by the way? Did he make more mistakes than Rose and Dawson?

Vertonghen has always looked calm and relaxed on the pitch. Very often that's an advantage.



Spot on. Ekotto got so much stick for his attitude, but he kept doing his job.

Not too sure about that tbh. Distinctly recall questioning his attitude / commitment at times in several games towards the latter part of last season, notable the home game against Basel when he kept losing his man and/or couldn't be arsed to chase back and had to be substituted after 58 mins.

Some of the comments, including my own, from the the ratings thread for that game:

Spur of the moment
Ekotto 4- he is really ****ing me off nowadays, playing way too arrogantly / nonchalantly for my liking, asking for trouble

Illy
Gallas, Ekotto, Parker were shameful tonight and should never play for Spurs again. That is the worst left back performance I have ever seen.

thfcsteff
Ekotto 4- Playing like someone who knows he's off. I will say he had little help on the left, but his positional play was often naive.

Pirate 55
Ekotto 4 Was never his biggest fan or hater but not matter now because he wont be with us next season, avb rightly or wrongly clearly does not like him.

glorygloryeze
BAE - 4 poor tackling technique; another one of thoe games when his devil-may-care attitude bites him and us

Charlietheyid
Assou ekotto 3 Couldnt pass ball to a team mate and always a yard behind winger

 

[Cotswold]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

I heard Lou Macari being interviewed the other day and he said that he doesn't buy into the idea that players want CL football.
What they want is big money deals and if that includes CL football, then so much the better.
Of course players move to CL teams, but i'd be willing to bet that almost all do so for a wage increase and virtually none of them would take such moves if they resulted in a pay decrease.

 

[braineclipse]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Not too sure about that tbh. Distinctly recall questioning his attitude / commitment at times in several games towards the latter part of last season, notable the home game against Basel when he kept losing his man and/or couldn't be arsed to chase back and had to be substituted after 58 mins.

Some of the comments, including my own, from the the ratings thread for that game:

Spur of the moment
Ekotto 4- he is really ****ing me off nowadays, playing way too arrogantly / nonchalantly for my liking, asking for trouble

Illy
Gallas, Ekotto, Parker were shameful tonight and should never play for Spurs again. That is the worst left back performance I have ever seen.

thfcsteff
Ekotto 4- Playing like someone who knows he's off. I will say he had little help on the left, but his positional play was often naive.

Pirate 55
Ekotto 4 Was never his biggest fan or hater but not matter now because he wont be with us next season, avb rightly or wrongly clearly does not like him.

glorygloryeze
BAE - 4 poor tackling technique; another one of thoe games when his devil-may-care attitude bites him and us

Charlietheyid
Assou ekotto 3 Couldnt pass ball to a team mate and always a yard behind winger

Once again I'm not sure if the conclusion that such performances were a result of his overall attitude are fair attributions, even though they can be very tempting (perhaps simplistic?) explanations.

I highlighted some of the comments there (that you also highlighted) that indicate that these performances may have come as a result of a conflict with AVB, a conflict many more or less predicted considering the perceived differences between them. If there is a conflict between a manager and a player I would expect players with various attitudes to drop in performance as a result of various factors. This has been seen for example at Manu under Ferguson where several players with vastly different attitudes to Ekotto have fallen out with Ferguson and seen their performances drop, although Ferguson pretty swiftly got rid of most of them. A similar description might be fitting for many of our players under Ramos or Sunderland under several of their recent managers.

To reiterate it seems that if a player has a relaxed attitude and body language that will be blamed for just about any drop in form, regardless of other factors. But most players have drops in form, most players are at least to a degree inconsistent. Yet for players with a different approach or body language the same attributions aren't made.

 

[Spur of the moment]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Once again I'm not sure if the conclusion that such performances were a result of his overall attitude are fair attributions, even though they can be very tempting (perhaps simplistic?) explanations.

I highlighted some of the comments there (that you also highlighted) that indicate that these performances may have come as a result of a conflict with AVB, a conflict many more or less predicted considering the perceived differences between them. If there is a conflict between a manager and a player I would expect players with various attitudes to drop in performance as a result of various factors. This has been seen for example at Manu under Ferguson where several players with vastly different attitudes to Ekotto have fallen out with Ferguson and seen their performances drop, although Ferguson pretty swiftly got rid of most of them. A similar description might be fitting for many of our players under Ramos or Sunderland under several of their recent managers.

To reiterate it seems that if a player has a relaxed attitude and body language that will be blamed for just about any drop in form, regardless of other factors. But most players have drops in form, most players are at least to a degree inconsistent. Yet for players with a different approach or body language the same attributions aren't made.

At the end of the day it will always come down to individual judgement. I was a huge admirer of BAE under Harry and frequently lauded his performances to the heavens, even so I agree his somewhat languid approach could at times be confused with indifference. But so marked was the contrast between his attitude, drive and commitment when playing well for Harry and his almost exaggeratedly negative body language and lack of commitment following his return from injury in the latter half of last season that I personally have little doubt it was down to attitude and commitment rather than form.

Sad to note he is also attracting similarly negative comments about his commitment for QPR currently.

 

[Rorschach]

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

At the end of the day it will always come down to individual judgement. I was a huge admirer of BAE under Harry and frequently lauded his performances to the heavens, even so I agree his somewhat languid approach could at times be confused with indifference. But so marked was the contrast between his attitude, drive and commitment when playing well for Harry and his almost exaggeratedly negative body language and lack of commitment following his return from injury in the latter half of last season that I personally have little doubt it was down to attitude and commitment rather than form.

Sad to note he is also attracting similarly negative comments about his commitment for QPR currently.

I have to agree with this.

I've seen Benny play a few times for QPR recently and he has been disappointingly poor. There is a difference between a languid style of play and total lack of commitment, and in these matches at least there is no doubt in my mind. He doesn;t give a fook about QPR. I'm surprised he hasn't been benched actually. I guess he knows that he will be back at Spurs for pre-season and just maybe this might be the catalyst for a change in attitude from him. I'd love to see him back in the mix at Spurs and if he doesn't realise that he has a very good chance to oust the current incumbent then more the fool him.

When I look at Vertoghen I see something a bit different. I see frustration firstly, but also now petulance and maybe even lack of respect for his team mates. I could be totally wrong of course, but those recent press comments about moving to a CL club seem to tie in with what I am witnessing on the pitch. For a player of his ability he should be showing leadership and encouragement to his team mates and not the opposite. I really hope that I'm misreading his attitude.