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Black Lives Matter

scaramanga said:
I don't believe that's worse than attacking police trying to go about their jobs.

The physical act from Officer Chauvin is worse, but mitigated by the fact that he was trying to stop crime, whereas this is exacerbated by the fact that they attacked police whilst committing crime.
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I won't argue that attacking police outside the realm of self-defence is no good whatsoever; if police are moving forward with tear-gas and beatings to break up peaceful protestors, then I would argue that reaction is possibly a matter of survival without serious injury.

The one comparison I can find between your bordering on ludicrous equivalency, is in how each police dept dealt with their "asset".
A police officer on horseback with a horse who is not able to deal with a break-out situation (and lets face it, no horse should have to deal with being attacked by some tossers) should be removed from the fray immediately. No question. And retired to enjoy the life it deserves. Chauvin should never have been allowed in a uniform, let alone a patrol car as it was clear he couldn't handle most situations.

BTW, Chauvin was not trying to "stop a crime" he was part of a team responding to allegations of a fake $20 being passed.
 
thfcsteff said:
I won't argue that attacking police outside the realm of self-defence is no good whatsoever; if police are moving forward with tear-gas and beatings to break up peaceful protestors, then I would argue that reaction is possibly a matter of survival without serious injury.

The one comparison I can find between your bordering on ludicrous equivalency, is in how each police dept dealt with their "asset".
A police officer on horseback with a horse who is not able to deal with a break-out situation (and lets face it, no horse should have to deal with being attacked by some tossers) should be removed from the fray immediately. No question. And retired to enjoy the life it deserves. Chauvin should never have been allowed in a uniform, let alone a patrol car as it was clear he couldn't handle most situations.
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The police were being attacked no doubt and were pushing forward to disperse a crowd that had on and off caused issues all day.

There is also clips of a group of non riot police being chased and pelted by protesters and cheered as they do.

There were outbreaks of cheers when the horse was upturned and the policeman flat on his back, after the horses were struck by all sorts.

Let’s not be silly here and pretend that a number of the crowds were not there to cause trouble.

If you antagonise the police you will get action, you get no sympathy from me if that includes a clout for your troubles, I’m not having it that aggravating the police for them to react proves a weak point that our police force is brutal or racist.

Seeing a British policeman in a uniform and only seeing a racist because of what went on in America is kinda ironic.
 
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scaramanga said:
I don't believe that's worse than attacking police trying to go about their jobs.

The physical act from Officer Chauvin is worse, but mitigated by the fact that he was trying to stop crime, whereas this is exacerbated by the fact that they attacked police whilst committing crime.
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What about Ahmad Arbrary? Going for a jog, what did he do wrong?

How about Breonna Taylor, shot in her own home because Police got the wrong address? I am sure it was DEFINITELY those black peoples fault. Still, Police can somehow consistently arrest mass murdering terrorists like Dylan Roof without much trouble. Strange eh.
 
Diamond Lights said:
What about Ahmad Arbrary? Going for a jog, what did he do wrong?
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B&E, possibly burglary.

Diamond Lights said:
How about Breonna Taylor, shot in her own home because Police got the wrong address?
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Nothing, I suspect.

Diamond Lights said:
it was DEFINITELY those black peoples fault. Still, Police can somehow consistently arrest mass murdering terrorists like Dylan Roof without much trouble. Strange eh.
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Why are you making this about race?
 
thfcsteff said:
I won't argue that attacking police outside the realm of self-defence is no good whatsoever; if police are moving forward with tear-gas and beatings to break up peaceful protestors, then I would argue that reaction is possibly a matter of survival without serious injury.
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I believe in the freedom to protest. That's not the same as freedom from consequences.

If you're told to disperse and you don't, expect riot tactics.

thfcsteff said:
The one comparison I can find between your bordering on ludicrous equivalency, is in how each police dept dealt with their "asset".
A police officer on horseback with a horse who is not able to deal with a break-out situation (and lets face it, no horse should have to deal with being attacked by some tossers) should be removed from the fray immediately. No question. And retired to enjoy the life it deserves. Chauvin should never have been allowed in a uniform, let alone a patrol car as it was clear he couldn't handle most situations.
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Chauvin was clearly an unqualified thug. That doesn't make him racist and doesn't give good cause for riots.

thfcsteff said:
I
BTW, Chauvin was not trying to "stop a crime" he was part of a team responding to allegations of a fake $20 being passed.
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That's a crime, BTW.
 
Grays_1890 said:
Wasn’t Ahmed shot by joe public?
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BLM isn't about police brutality, it's the systemic and structural racism against black people in life. Like, you know, chasing down someone going for a jog and killing them.

And then a system allowing you to get away with it for like 2 months because, you know, the system works in your favour. Coz you white.
 
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Diamond Lights said:
BLM isn't about police brutality, it's the systemic and structural racism against black people in life. Like, you know, chasing down someone going for a jog and killing them.
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Sorry I misunderstood as it was posted in direct reply about Police.

I don’t dispute racism exists It surely does no one disputes that.

The line being peddled on this page that the U.K. and U.K. police has it as bad as the US is a load of crap though and people can bring up the Slave Trade 200 years ago. People giving a free pass to attack British police for crimes committed elsewhere isn’t the answer.

As a Jew I dont believe the U.K. is institutionally racist due to the Slave Trade than I do that all Germans are anti Semitic die to the holocaust or the wider world is for 2000 years of oppression.

ALM
 
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Danishfurniturelover said:
Always said it were racist but after you said that and i stop and think about it. He is a sadist as well, totally unacceptable to murder anyone but to slowly drain the life from them like that.
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The guy was clearly deranged but has there been anything yet that’s how’s he was racist?
I mean the lad jogger killed was going into a house that was open regulalry but there is from what I’ve seeen clear evidence that they persuede him as he was black, so a racist attack would be right.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
The guy was clearly deranged but has there been anything yet that’s how’s he was racist?
I mean the lad jogger killed was going into a house that was open regulalry but there is from what I’ve seeen clear evidence that they persuede him as he was black, so a racist attack would be right.
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No racist words yet, maybe if the police release the recording of the arrest.

What happened with the Muslim girl shot up north last month.
 
Grays_1890 said:
The police were being attacked no doubt and were pushing forward to disperse a crowd that had on and off caused issues all day.

There is also clips of a group of non riot police being chased and pelted by protesters and cheered as they do.

There were outbreaks of cheers when the horse was upturned and the policeman flat on his back, after the horses were struck by all sorts.

Let’s not be silly here and pretend that a number of the crowds were not there to cause trouble.

If you antagonise the police you will get action, you get no sympathy from me if that includes a clout for your troubles, I’m not having it that aggravating the police for them to react proves a weak point that our police force is brutal or racist.

Seeing a British policeman in a uniform and only seeing a racist because of what went on in America is kinda ironic.
Click to expand...

Don't try to twist my words.

I CLEARLY stated that attacking police outside the realm of self-defence is wrong.
I CLEARLY stated MY belief that IF police do engage in violent tactics to disperse peaceful protestors, then push-back is often a case of survival.

Your assertion that antagonism is deserving of violent response does not hold with me. Do I think it is SMART or DECENT behavior to engage in such? Absolutely not! I don't. I never have done when I have been on marches (yes, me, one of the shoe-scrapings!), indeed, I always go out of my way to engage a police person or two and thank them for their work in helping keep the peace. I will say I have avoided marching at this moment simply because of my own personal desire to adhere to distancing for a little while longer (or at least not go from zero to 60 mph in a second!)...however...IF trained law enforcement officers are met with some mouthy youths going off, their job dictates tat they have to take it without response. If they are attacked unprovoked, then it is an absolute issue. I have great sympathy for the policewoman on horseback, and also the horse obviously.

As for your final sentence again, don't tether that as a response to anything I've said as it is far from what I believe.

In the spirit of clarity and discussion...
 
scaramanga said:
I believe in the freedom to protest. That's not the same as freedom from consequences.

If you're told to disperse and you don't, expect riot tactics.


Chauvin was clearly an unqualified thug. That doesn't make him racist and doesn't give good cause for riots.


That's a crime, BTW.
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Sigh.
Here we are again. No worries, I am here all day.

1) No peaceful demonstration should be "told to disperse". They should be allowed to peacefully protest as long as they want, so long as trouble is not part of their specific actions. If agitation groups are brought in, deal with them! Should I be kicked out of an away end just because there are a few Herberts rucking in the corner? No. Isolate THEM and kick THEM out...as is done. Same rules apply.

2) We have been over Chauvin. I disagree with you. I'd be much more inclined to follow your thoughts if the redacted complaint were made public and revealed as non-racist.

3) He was accused of passing a fake $20. Did he know? Was it? We have no idea. Meanwhile, I have never seen anything close to Chauvin's behavior for the sort of multi-million pension swindling scum- crooks who wear the clobber you like.
 
thfcsteff said:
No peaceful demonstration should be "told to disperse". They should be allowed to peacefully protest as long as they want, so long as trouble is not part of their specific actions.
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These particular 'peaceful demonstrations' occurred in direct contravention of the current health guidelines, so I'm not sure you're on the strongest ground with this point.
 
AuroRaman said:
https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...tter-blm-protest-racist-boycott-a9553701.html
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