AVB & Spurs Tactics and Formations discussion thread

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

No inherited context is being enforced here - you only need half a brain cell to read the thread title

And about two hours to read through 32 pages to see if its still relevant...

 

[africanspurs]

think AVB will continiue with the formation or system we played last year..or similar anyway

only difference is the attacking contribution of the wing players.

I believe that a balance between stretching the field and provide numbers in the box is going to be adpoted


therefore wen we have a full squad

back four of walker verty (really starting to see why people like this guy) kaboul (though i would prefer gallas) and BAE

midfield trio of sandro, modric (if not him then i would prefer thudd), siggy ...at the tip

front three of......lennon (wide right)...VDV (wing forward left)...bale (CF ..drifting into the channels)


fudge the striker situation...THAT team rocks!!!!

 

[jts1882]

VDV (wing forward left).

That won't go down well. That has been his big problem with Holland, not liking to play on the left. He has been quite vocal on preferring the Sneijder role in the centre, accepting the right wing forward and hating the left side.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

think AVB will continiue with the formation or system we played last year..or similar anyway

only difference is the attacking contribution of the wing players.

I believe that a balance between stretching the field and provide numbers in the box is going to be adpoted


therefore wen we have a full squad

back four of walker verty (really starting to see why people like this guy) kaboul (though i would prefer gallas) and BAE

midfield trio of sandro, modric (if not him then i would prefer thudd), siggy ...at the tip

front three of......lennon (wide right)...VDV (wing forward left)...bale (CF ..drifting into the channels)


fudge the striker situation...THAT team rocks!!!!

Ive said since AVB took over that I think Harry left a great foundation from which AVB can build.

I would like to see a very similar set up, just more organised into a system of play that benefits the players involved. More rehearsed movement and creation of space...

 

[africanspurs]

@nayim...agreed. but there are people here that think something miraculous wonderous is going to happen. exceeding anything we have done in the last 4 years. in truth? if we could replicate the pressing of 3 seasons ago...and some of the performances that year...or even replicate the QPR home game last season and the liverpool game home last season we should consider ourselves xtremely fortunate

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

To be honest mate I think organised pressing and a stronger tactical approach ON TOP OF Harrys set up would indeed be wonderous.

We were small margins from something VERY special, IMO.

 

[africanspurs]

i'd be amazed if we managed to press consistently as well as we did in the earlier part of 3 seasons ago when we were dusting teams with the two small men up top in keane and defoe. it didnt keep[ up for the season but for the first like 5 or 6 games it was ever present.

naturally people forget thanks to father time but i remember ...the wonky and PRESSINg from 3 seasons ago brought us a monstrous start to that season.

"strong tactical approach"? grrrrrr....i wont lie, its sweeping vague comments like this that makes me not like AVB, whats this amazing tactical shift that he's going to conjour up that he didnt do at chelsea? i really dont understand what it is thats soo amazing from him tactically..to add "strong" to it just buries me in frustration

but no matter...we will see this grand master plan on saturday...at the very least in paper mache ......doesnt have to be great or even work....i just want to see what he is going to do thats soo different and a significant upgrade on what we were used to when we were breaking records

 

[Armchair Expert]

To be honest mate I think organised pressing and a stronger tactical approach ON TOP OF Harrys set up would indeed be wonderous.

We were small margins from something VERY special, IMO.

I think a stronger tactical approach should be a given. Were seriously lacking in personel though. We've sold some decent squad players who may have been effective in decent formations and turned to Jenas etc. We're still only an injury to Lennon, Bale, BAE away from disaster. There was certainly no radical overhaul of formations in pre-season by the looks of things, but playing a rigid and structured 4411 should bring its own benefits anyway.

I think we're small margins away from disaster. Injuries to say Bale and Defoe in our first game would leave us looking extremely weak and mediocre.

 

[Armchair Expert]

i'd be amazed if we managed to press consistently as well as we did in the earlier part of 3 seasons ago when we were dusting teams with the two small men up top in keane and defoe. it didnt keep[ up for the season but for the first like 5 or 6 games it was ever present.

naturally people forget thanks to father time but i remember ...the wonky and PRESSINg from 3 seasons ago brought us a monstrous start to that season.

"strong tactical approach"? grrrrrr....i wont lie, its sweeping vague comments like this that makes me not like AVB, whats this amazing tactical shift that he's going to conjour up that he didnt do at chelsea? i really dont understand what it is thats soo amazing from him tactically..to add "strong" to it just buries me in frustration

but no matter...we will see this grand master plan on saturday...at the very least in paper mache ......doesnt have to be great or even work....i just want to see what he is going to do thats soo different and a significant upgrade on what we were used to when we were breaking records

I'd imagine people aren't expecting the useless wandering Bale from last season, 442's away to Arsenal and not changing it whilst getting murdered. Hopefully we'll have a plan b when 'go out there and play lads' isnt working. Hopefully we'll see the end of the Dawson hoof/long ball to no-one. I'm certainly hoping that we'll have a basic set of identifiable tactics and discernable formations.

 

[VolSpur]

assuming the crap i read on the itk/transfer thread is valid.... and thats assuming a lot... we're going to see:



looks ok to me.. should be able to score a lot more from set pieces considering you take out 2 midgets and replace them with M'Vila and Ramires. Should have plenty of set-piece ability as well with Sigg, Bale, Ramires, and Kaboul . just not sure we'd be able to break teams down that would park the bus on us

 

[africanspurs]

I'd imagine people aren't expecting the useless wandering Bale from last season, 442's away to Arsenal and not changing it whilst getting murdered. Hopefully we'll have a plan b when 'go out there and play lads' isnt working. Hopefully we'll see the end of the Dawson hoof/long ball to no-one. I'm certainly hoping that we'll have a basic set of identifiable tactics and discernable formations.

if bale doesnt wander away from the left touchline creating space for the fullback to occupy and increasing our numbers in midfield or on the last defensive line, now and again , infact making it part of his weekly routine...then quite frankly i think AVB is dumb,to put it bluntly

yes the 442 away to arsenal......you say this and somehow i remember it more like 442 up until half time..which was 2-2. then we changed it at half time to a 451 and THEN got completely roasted? is that true or not? i could be wrong but i dont think so. plus its good that you picked one of the few games and probably the worst of harry's tenure.

this plan b thing is getting out of control. can you give me an example of a plan B that you yourself would have liked to have seen?

if cant defend dawson hoofing the ball, i can only assume that its some kind of genetic disposition to MOST footballers that play with 6 foot 6 bean poles, of footballers that play in non technical teams or footballers that play in teams with no urgency or movement.

but i trust you in particular to fair, judging by what i have read of yours you try to be. when AVB has a bad game...kick his ass...when kaboul or verty play long balls ..let AVB have it, its the only way to prove that it isnt a biased thing against harry

Actually i doubt we'll be seeing many hoof balls from verty...i really like him...he's a good footballer

 

[milo]

No inherited context is being enforced here - you only need half a brain cell to read the thread title

And you need to watch how you talk to people on this board. This is the second time I have mentioned this to you this week and your last warning.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

"strong tactical approach"? grrrrrr....i wont lie, its sweeping vague comments like this that makes me not like AVB, whats this amazing tactical shift that he's going to conjour up that he didnt do at chelsea? i really dont understand what it is thats soo amazing from him tactically..to add "strong" to it just buries me in frustration

To be honest mate it was vague, and I certainly wasnt talking about tactical masterclasses week after week.

Possibly made the wrong choice of words.

I was thinking more of greater preparation for matches, attention to detail and more of an over riding system of play. Advancements on what Harry did.

 

[africanspurs]

To be honest mate it was vague, and I certainly wasnt talking about tactical masterclasses week after week.

Possibly made the wrong choice of words.

I was thinking more of greater preparation for matches, attention to detail and more of an over riding system of play. Advancements on what Harry did.

ahh, well then i clearly wasnt addressing you mate

its all those guys that think we are going to be playing sweet technical stuff week in week out......... am telling you its driving me round the bend.

i think you and i both know that Harry had quite a bit of limitations on the tactical front.....but screw me blind if that hasnt raised AVB into stardom before anything has happened

saturday is fast approaching though

i will say this...him trying bale as a forward? inspired

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

Wonder where he might have got that idea from, Ive never seen anyone - ever - suggest playing Bale up front. The guy must be a Tactical Genuis! :lol:

I think AVB can do well, but if he does it wont be immediate - its going to take time. I suspect some peoples patience wont last, or high expectations will see them crash early on

 

[Millsy_Yiddo]

ahh, well then i clearly wasnt addressing you mate

its all those guys that think we are going to be playing sweet technical stuff week in week out......... am telling you its driving me round the bend.

i think you and i both know that Harry had quite a bit of limitations on the tactical front.....but screw me blind if that hasnt raised AVB into stardom before anything has happened

saturday is fast approaching though

i will say this...him trying bale as a forward? inspired

I'm glad you mentioned it because its driving me mental too. Although Harry was limited tactically, we played some incredible football under him and it got us to our highest league position in decades (twice).

As much as you have to give AVB a chance to proove himself, you can't big him up as this tactical genius either because like it or lump it, so far he has been a failure in England.

 

[Armchair Expert]

if bale doesnt wander away from the left touchline creating space for the fullback to occupy and increasing our numbers in midfield or on the last defensive line, now and again , infact making it part of his weekly routine...then quite frankly i think AVB is dumb,to put it bluntly

yes the 442 away to arsenal......you say this and somehow i remember it more like 442 up until half time..which was 2-2. then we changed it at half time to a 451 and THEN got completely roasted? is that true or not? i could be wrong but i dont think so. plus its good that you picked one of the few games and probably the worst of harry's tenure.

this plan b thing is getting out of control. can you give me an example of a plan B that you yourself would have liked to have seen?

if cant defend dawson hoofing the ball, i can only assume that its some kind of genetic disposition to MOST footballers that play with 6 foot 6 bean poles, of footballers that play in non technical teams or footballers that play in teams with no urgency or movement.

but i trust you in particular to fair, judging by what i have read of yours you try to be. when AVB has a bad game...kick his ass...when kaboul or verty play long balls ..let AVB have it, its the only way to prove that it isnt a biased thing against harry

Actually i doubt we'll be seeing many hoof balls from verty...i really like him...he's a good footballer

I wasn't biased against Harry, just always felt his limitations got in the way of what could have been a ground breaking season, a season in which we had our strongest side since the premier league began. i've also maintained that a rebuilding job awaited whoever was in charge: be it harry, avb or jose.

I think one point no-one can argue is that tactics should run through not only a team, but also a squad. An injury to a winger ie Lennon, should never have equated to a seismic shift in tactics, attacking focal points, and should alos never have lead to VdV or Modric being shunted to the wing. It was a really bad failing, that one injury to the first 11 resulted in a completly disjointed side and a complete shift of focus from our strengths last season.

To be a pacy fast incisive side one week, then a lumbering, slow build one the next was never acceptable and completly disruptive. I think everyone who talks of AVB's tactical strength is hoping that a tactical philosophy that runs through the squad will be implemented. Thats my hope anyway.

I remember debating with Moonlight about aspirations for the coming season. He and sheikh were maintaining that anything below fourth would be a failure. I said i'd have to wait until the end of the transfer window. Its now apparent we are weaker than we were last season. Hence i wont be judging AVB on the same criteria that i was judging Redknapp last year. I believe AVB has more tactical nouse, and believe he'll be successful long term, but short term, looking at the personel, we are miles away. Scarily the first 11 this looks a couple of injuries away from mid table standard.

 

[elltrev]

I wasn't biased against Harry, just always felt his limitations got in the way of what could have been a ground breaking season, a season in which we had our strongest side since the premier league began. i've also maintained that a rebuilding job awaited whoever was in charge: be it harry, avb or jose.

I think one point no-one can argue is that tactics should run through not only a team, but also a squad. An injury to a winger ie Lennon, should never have equated to a seismic shift in tactics, attacking focal points, and should alos never have lead to VdV or Modric being shunted to the wing. It was a really bad failing, that one injury to the first 11 resulted in a completly disjointed side and a complete shift of focus from our strengths last season.

To be a pacy fast incisive side one week, then a lumbering, slow build one the next was never acceptable and completly disruptive. I think everyone who talks of AVB's tactical strength is hoping that a tactical philosophy that runs through the squad will be implemented. Thats my hope anyway.

I remember debating with Moonlight about aspirations for the coming season. He and sheikh were maintaining that anything below fourth would be a failure. I said i'd have to wait until the end of the transfer window. Its now apparent we are weaker than we were last season. Hence i wont be judging AVB on the same criteria that i was judging Redknapp last year. I believe AVB has more tactical nouse, and believe he'll be successful long term, but short term, looking at the personel, we are miles away. Scarily the first 11 this looks a couple of injuries away from mid table standard.

Good post. I, like others, sometimes feel like comments regarding Harry's tactical flaws and AVB's tactical genius are thrown around too casually without sufficient backup or explanation. But I think your post elucidated and clarified those claims - that it's about having a consistent tactical vision and system.

The key for AVB will be getting the players to buy into that and to carry it out effectively, asap, whilst still allowing our attacking players some of the freedom that resulted in such fantastic and effective football under Harry at times.

 

[Rob]

I wasn't biased against Harry, just always felt his limitations got in the way of what could have been a ground breaking season, a season in which we had our strongest side since the premier league began. i've also maintained that a rebuilding job awaited whoever was in charge: be it harry, avb or jose.

I think one point no-one can argue is that tactics should run through not only a team, but also a squad. An injury to a winger ie Lennon, should never have equated to a seismic shift in tactics, attacking focal points, and should alos never have lead to VdV or Modric being shunted to the wing. It was a really bad failing, that one injury to the first 11 resulted in a completly disjointed side and a complete shift of focus from our strengths last season.

To be a pacy fast incisive side one week, then a lumbering, slow build one the next was never acceptable and completly disruptive. I think everyone who talks of AVB's tactical strength is hoping that a tactical philosophy that runs through the squad will be implemented. Thats my hope anyway.

I remember debating with Moonlight about aspirations for the coming season. He and sheikh were maintaining that anything below fourth would be a failure. I said i'd have to wait until the end of the transfer window. Its now apparent we are weaker than we were last season. Hence i wont be judging AVB on the same criteria that i was judging Redknapp last year. I believe AVB has more tactical nouse, and believe he'll be successful long term, but short term, looking at the personel, we are miles away. Scarily the first 11 this looks a couple of injuries away from mid table standard.

=D>

 

[Rob]

I wasn't biased against Harry, just always felt his limitations got in the way of what could have been a ground breaking season, a season in which we had our strongest side since the premier league began. i've also maintained that a rebuilding job awaited whoever was in charge: be it harry, avb or jose.

I think one point no-one can argue is that tactics should run through not only a team, but also a squad. An injury to a winger ie Lennon, should never have equated to a seismic shift in tactics, attacking focal points, and should alos never have lead to VdV or Modric being shunted to the wing. It was a really bad failing, that one injury to the first 11 resulted in a completly disjointed side and a complete shift of focus from our strengths last season.

To be a pacy fast incisive side one week, then a lumbering, slow build one the next was never acceptable and completly disruptive. I think everyone who talks of AVB's tactical strength is hoping that a tactical philosophy that runs through the squad will be implemented. Thats my hope anyway.

I remember debating with Moonlight about aspirations for the coming season. He and sheikh were maintaining that anything below fourth would be a failure. I said i'd have to wait until the end of the transfer window. Its now apparent we are weaker than we were last season. Hence i wont be judging AVB on the same criteria that i was judging Redknapp last year. I believe AVB has more tactical nouse, and believe he'll be successful long term, but short term, looking at the personel, we are miles away. Scarily the first 11 this looks a couple of injuries away from mid table standard.

=D>