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The midweek/weekend games thread

whos fatter?

  • grant holt

    Votes: 2 10.5%

  • mark viduka

    Votes: 17 89.5%
  • Total voters
    19
The Moonlit Knight said:
And like Redknapp. Fergie and Wenger wouldn't have put up with Taarabt. Their teams, Fergie's especially, are all about team work and work rate. Taarabt's dream Manager should be Redknapp, who gives his players the freedom to express themselves as long as they work hard.
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But Redknapp hasn't been here from the beginning. Taarabt played under 3 different managers at Spurs, whereas at Arsenal or Man Utd, he would have been under one for the whole time. What kind of got me thinking about it was what Redknapp Jr said about KPB a couple of weeks back. By the time Redknapp came in, he didn't want to be at the club anymore. He was sick of it, needed a change of scenery. One of the best players in training but didn't want to be here. I imagine that was what it was like for Taarabt when Redknapp came as well.

There was a time when Ronaldo and Nani weren't about 'work ethic' either. Ferguson can be quite persuasive!
 
Jurgen the German said:
It has definitely got worse, but as I pointed out before, Rdoney Marsh dived when he played and Linekar "went to ground rather easily" plenty of times for Spurs and England.
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I don't think Lineker was a diver. Lineker cottoned on that if he got fouled and stayed on his feet he may not get the free kick, but Lineker often used to stumble his shots away (whilst being fouled). Marsh was before my time, as was Franny Lee who was another notorious diver IIRC. Dalglish was a dirty little fudger who used to go down easy too.

But the sheer quantity of English players now that dive has risen comparitive to the amount playing massively. People like Hoddle used to get the brick kicked out of them week in, week out, and never dived. The general consensus was that you didn't show weakness, that was the English way. I think the whole English cheating in football mirrors our society as much as anything. BUT I do believe that cheating tossers like Cantona, Kanchelskis etc. definitely played a massive part the development of your Beckham's and Scholes's (who also dived).

It's also down to the Managers. You cheated under Clough or Burkinshaw and you'd get fined. End of. No fudging around, it wasn't the done thing. Now there is absolutely no doubt in my mind whatsoever that the likes Wenger tells his players to cheat if necessary. Culturally on the continent diving is not seen as cheating. It's regarded as gamesmanship, like when players shout howzat for every decision in cricket. They don't see it as anything wrong. So then you have these foreign managers coming over here instilling the same culture in their teams. Foreign players coming over here and doing it in training and in competitive games. Hardly surprising the culture has spread.
 
Jurgen the German said:
I think it's a sanctimonious view that the English media and ex players try to perpetuate, but it's borderline xenophobic in my opinion.
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See my post below. It's not xenophobic. It's because British football never had a culture on it. Cheating was frowned upon. On the continent it was celebrated as another part of the game and perfectly acceptable. That's not my view by the way, that's the view of the man you have in your picture up there.
 
Hootnow said:
But Redknapp hasn't been here from the beginning. Taarabt played under 3 different managers at Spurs, whereas at Arsenal or Man Utd, he would have been under one for the whole time. What kind of got me thinking about it was what Redknapp Jr said about KPB a couple of weeks back. By the time Redknapp came in, he didn't want to be at the club anymore. He was sick of it, needed a change of scenery. One of the best players in training but didn't want to be here. I imagine that was what it was like for Taarabt when Redknapp came as well.

There was a time when Ronaldo and Nani weren't about 'work ethic' either. Ferguson can be quite persuasive!
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Well we'll see. I don't believe that careers can be ruined by clubs or Managers. If Taarabt has it, and wants it, then he'll achieve it. If not, it's all down to him.
 
The Moonlit Knight said:
See my post below. It's not xenophobic. It's because British football never had a culture on it. Cheating was frowned upon. On the continent it was celebrated as another part of the game and perfectly acceptable. That's not my view by the way, that's the view of the man you have in your picture up there.
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What annoys me is that we refuse to condemn English players when they dive. If Rooney was to dive to get England a penalty in the last minute of the European Championship final and we went on to win the tournament, there would be no outrage. But if a Spanish player did the same to us, we'd get the likes of Hansen and Shearer saying how disgusting it is.
 
Highly Amusing.


Rafael finally booked. Though not for a bad tackle, he's booked for falling over. Didn't even ask for a free kick.



Referee is not having a good day.
 
Jurgen the German said:
What annoys me is that we refuse to condemn English players when they dive. If Rooney was to dive to get England a penalty in the last minute of the European Championship final and we went on to win the tournament, there would be no outrage. But if a Spanish player did the same to us, we'd get the likes of Hansen and Shearer saying how disgusting it is.
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Have to agree, Owen against Argentina was hailed as a hero for diving against them in the 98 WC and he has done it several times since.
 
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