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Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

scaramanga said:
I wasn't using that to attempt to argue her point (there's nothing of any substance to argue other than some silly, unfunded desires to increase spending).

I was just giving general advice about not listening to people like her. I thought you were against rich people too dim to pass the 11+ who use family wealth and influence to wedge themselves into the better schools.
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Two more good examples of the fallacy here.

I've no idea what 11+ is, btw.
 
Rorschach said:
Two more good examples of the fallacy here.

I've no idea what 11+ is, btw.
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The 11+ were the entrance exams for grammar schools. They were used to separate the students suited to an academic schooling from those more suited to being prepared for various trades, etc.

Anyone you might even generously describe as intelligent would have passed the 11+ in the 1950s when there were a lot of grammar schools around.

She has both the exam results and the economic opinions of a person who really is quite dim.
 
Rorschach said:
Starmer is a terrible disappointment so far. He is more or less a pre-brexit Tory. I know i am prejudging him but if his actions match his rhetoric his tenure will be such a wasted opportunity.
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Just Tory lite really, Sir Kid Starver trending on twitter this week. Not a great soundbite for him.
 
scaramanga said:
The 11+ were the entrance exams for grammar schools. They were used to separate the students suited to an academic schooling from those more suited to being prepared for various trades, etc.

Anyone you might even generously describe as intelligent would have passed the 11+ in the 1950s when there were a lot of grammar schools around.

She has both the exam results and the economic opinions of a person who really is quite dim.
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So more attacking the person and not the argument. You haven't read the article, have you?
 
Mikey10 said:
https://www.theguardian.com/comment...armer-election-britain?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
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Totally. Why condemn a politician before he’s even got into government and done anything? Totally bonkers the amount of stick Starmer gets. Yes he is quite dull and nondescript but I really could not care less. First and foremost can he make sensible decisions? Can he get the government working and help out the nation? He’s highly qualified and proven Barrister working for human rights. His mum was a nurse and father a tool maker.

I genuinely wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t get elected with the lack of support from so called socialists; and the baying media who are desperate to find some sort dirt on him. That he is dull and squeaky clean just tinkles people off more! I find his lack of personality funny. But it’s what we need after Boris and friends. Sadly he is damned before he’s pass one law. I would not wish the job on the poor sod. There little affection for him and if he gets elected he has to re-energise a post Brexit Britain with less money to spend and a civil service who have become lazy and unmotivated. Since 2016 the nation has stagnated. It will take a decade to patiently get the UK back to where we were around a decade ago. There is a lot to fix and no money to pay for it. Starmer is undoubtedly the best choice now despite the lack of faith in him, which I don’t really understand.
 
SpurMeUp said:
Totally. Why condemn a politician before he’s even got into government and done anything? Totally bonkers the amount of stick Starmer gets. Yes he is quite dull and nondescript but I really could not care less. First and foremost can he make sensible decisions? Can he get the government working and help out the nation? He’s highly qualified and proven Barrister working for human rights. His mum was a nurse and father a tool maker.

I genuinely wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t get elected with the lack of support from so called socialists; and the baying media who are desperate to find some sort on him. That he is dull and squeaky clean just tinkles people off more! I find his lack of personality funny. But it’s what we need after Boris and friends. But he is damned before he’s pass one law. I would not wish the job on the poor sod. There little affection for him and if he gets elected he has to picked a post Brexit Britain with less money to spend and a civil service who have become lazy and unmotivated. Since 2016 the nation has stagnated. It will take a decade to patiently get the UK back to where we were around a decade ago. There is a lot to fix and no money to pay for it. Starmer is undoubtedly the best choice now despite the lack of faith in him, which I don’t really understand.
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You would think if being smart Labour even the hardcore left would worry about getting in power and then push for change rather than allowing the infighting to derail any potential election?
 
SpurMeUp said:
Totally. Why condemn a politician before he’s even got into government and done anything? Totally bonkers the amount of stick Starmer gets. Yes he is quite dull and nondescript but I really could not care less. First and foremost can he make sensible decisions? Can he get the government working and help out the nation? He’s highly qualified and proven Barrister working for human rights. His mum was a nurse and father a tool maker.

I genuinely wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t get elected with the lack of support from so called socialists; and the baying media who are desperate to find some sort dirt on him. That he is dull and squeaky clean just tinkles people off more! I find his lack of personality funny. But it’s what we need after Boris and friends. Sadly he is damned before he’s pass one law. I would not wish the job on the poor sod. There little affection for him and if he gets elected he has to re-energise a post Brexit Britain with less money to spend and a civil service who have become lazy and unmotivated. Since 2016 the nation has stagnated. It will take a decade to patiently get the UK back to where we were around a decade ago. There is a lot to fix and no money to pay for it. Starmer is undoubtedly the best choice now despite the lack of faith in him, which I don’t really understand.
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Or on the flipside when there's so much wrong with the country it should be easy to make gains and policy changes that are simple and fairer. He should be revelling about getting in with such a great opportunity to change things. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect a little more detail in some areas - test will come in the run up to the election where he'll have reveal something.
 
SpurMeUp said:
Totally. Why condemn a politician before he’s even got into government and done anything? Totally bonkers the amount of stick Starmer gets. Yes he is quite dull and nondescript but I really could not care less. First and foremost can he make sensible decisions? Can he get the government working and help out the nation? He’s highly qualified and proven Barrister working for human rights. His mum was a nurse and father a tool maker.

I genuinely wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t get elected with the lack of support from so called socialists; and the baying media who are desperate to find some sort dirt on him. That he is dull and squeaky clean just tinkles people off more! I find his lack of personality funny. But it’s what we need after Boris and friends. Sadly he is damned before he’s pass one law. I would not wish the job on the poor sod. There little affection for him and if he gets elected he has to re-energise a post Brexit Britain with less money to spend and a civil service who have become lazy and unmotivated. Since 2016 the nation has stagnated. It will take a decade to patiently get the UK back to where we were around a decade ago. There is a lot to fix and no money to pay for it. Starmer is undoubtedly the best choice now despite the lack of faith in him, which I don’t really understand.
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Nearly all the criticisms I've seen are to do with rolling back on promises made and nothing to do his personality. Maybe there is some of that but that, but it is a noisy fringe element only. I suspect he'll shed very few votes for this anyway, broken promises or no, as the anti-Tory sentiment is the dominant narrative and correctly so.
 
Love to see anti establishment Farage moaning about being shut out of the establishment. To be fair on this occasion he's been hard done by, don't like to see people shut out because you don't agree with them.
 
P.D. said:
Love to see anti establishment Farage moaning about being shut out of the establishment. To be fair on this occasion he's been hard done by, don't like to see people shut out because you don't agree with them.
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Only thing they did wrong was not offer him a basic NatWest account from what I can see. Given his association with Aaron Banks and other questionable financial flags think they were in the right to be concerned about his reliability, which is within their remit.
 
P.D. said:
Or on the flipside when there's so much wrong with the country it should be easy to make gains and policy changes that are simple and fairer. He should be revelling about getting in with such a great opportunity to change things. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect a little more detail in some areas - test will come in the run up to the election where he'll have reveal something.
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What are these easy wins?
 
SpurMeUp said:
Totally. Why condemn a politician before he’s even got into government and done anything? Totally bonkers the amount of stick Starmer gets. Yes he is quite dull and nondescript but I really could not care less. First and foremost can he make sensible decisions? Can he get the government working and help out the nation? He’s highly qualified and proven Barrister working for human rights. His mum was a nurse and father a tool maker.

I genuinely wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t get elected with the lack of support from so called socialists; and the baying media who are desperate to find some sort dirt on him. That he is dull and squeaky clean just tinkles people off more! I find his lack of personality funny. But it’s what we need after Boris and friends. Sadly he is damned before he’s pass one law. I would not wish the job on the poor sod. There little affection for him and if he gets elected he has to re-energise a post Brexit Britain with less money to spend and a civil service who have become lazy and unmotivated. Since 2016 the nation has stagnated. It will take a decade to patiently get the UK back to where we were around a decade ago. There is a lot to fix and no money to pay for it. Starmer is undoubtedly the best choice now despite the lack of faith in him, which I don’t really understand.
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The uncivil service has always become lazy. The best you can say about it, is that under a labour government they might not try to be quite so disruptive at stopping the elected governments campaign policies.

Agree on Starmer he is head and shoulders above anything the tories can offer.
 
Lost Mango said:
Only thing they did wrong was not offer him a basic NatWest account from what I can see. Given his association with Aaron Banks and other questionable financial flags think they were in the right to be concerned about his reliability, which is within their remit.
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Accept so much of that has been proven wrong in court.

It read like a diatribe from far left zealots who did not like anything to the right. They even included the team 'thatcherite views' millions in this country held or hold those views. It should not be a slur anymore then blairism.

Used to be people would say I might not agree with your views but I would fight to the death to protect your right to hold your views.

It shows how the west in general is going, today it is not letting right wing people hold bank accounts, what will it be tomorrow ?
 
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