Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

[monkeybarry]

Strikes are a good thing. They are workers flexing their muscles again. It's the public sector saying Amazon warehouse is now paying more than nurses and university lecturer salaries, so pay us more or we'll withdraw our labour. It's a positive that those sectors feel empowered enough to do that.

Every office now knows there's two tiers - there's the 'workers' that are in and the free child/dog care 'contractors' that aren't. Career progression divergence is now clearly starting to reflect those choices.

In a poorly run and poorly managed business perhaps.
Any half decent business also knows there are the "workers" that produce the goods irrespective of where they are....... and that's the majority.
Lazy people existed before homeworking. Any management structure with even basic management knowledge will use WFH as both a carrot and a stick: do your job, all good, work from home or wherever you need. Don't and we'll need to look at if it's better for you to be office based for a while.

 

[Gutter Boy]

In a poorly run and poorly managed business perhaps.
Any half decent business also knows there are the "workers" that produce the goods irrespective of where they are....... and that's the majority.
Lazy people existed before homeworking. Any management structure with even basic management knowledge will use WFH as both a carrot and a stick: do your job, all good, work from home or wherever you need. Don't and we'll need to look at if it's better for you to be office based for a while.

Maybe in lower level process-based jobs. But anything where people start becoming involved, if you're not visible, you become second tier

 

[monkeybarry]

Maybe in lower level process-based jobs. But anything where people start becoming involved, if you're not visible, you become second tier

Quite the opposite. The people in those jobs want and need the flexibility to operate and collaborate in a variety of ways. Visibility isn't the same as physicality - you can, and should be, visible irrespective of how and where you are working.

Without micro management it's the lower end/more process driven that are easier to scive off in and more likely to experience sciving off.

 

[Bullet]

Maybe in lower level process-based jobs. But anything where people start becoming involved, if you're not visible, you become second tier

Each of your recent posts in this thread is rubbish. I don't have a dislike or disagree button, but please note I disagree with each of your posts.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Each of your recent posts in this thread is rubbish. I don't have a dislike or disagree button, but please note I disagree with each of your posts.

The anarcho-syndicalism or the anti-techno-chauvinism?

 

[Mikey10]

Think I missed this on the side of the bus.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-says-senior-economist?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

 

[Gutter Boy]

Think I missed this on the side of the bus.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-says-senior-economist?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Sounds like a Trussite neo-lib whose GHod is growth, fuelled by large scale population expansion

 

[DTA]

Sounds like a Trussite neo-lib whose GHod is growth, fuelled by large scale population expansion

no he sounds like someone who hasn’t got his head up is Arsè and knows what he is talking about.

“It’s reduced the economy’s potential output significantly, eroded business investment,” he said, adding: “If we hadn’t had Brexit, we probably wouldn’t be talking about an austerity budget this week.”

“The need for tax rises, spending cuts wouldn’t be there, if Brexit hadn’t reduced the economy’s potential output so much.”

Brexiteers have damaged their country as a whole, made the lives of the poorest more difficult, are at least partly responsible for austerity Mk2 and much more… and I’m not even exaggerating.

 

[Gutter Boy]

“It’s reduced the economy’s potential output significantly, eroded business investment,” he said, adding: “If we hadn’t had Brexit, we probably wouldn’t be talking about an austerity budget this week.”

“The need for tax rises, spending cuts wouldn’t be there, if Brexit hadn’t reduced the economy’s potential output so much.”

So the plan of a million or two million extra economic migrant working tax payers, with no corresponding investment in housing/health care/schools/roads etc. The same old neo-lib ponzi scheme that operated 2004-2020. Structurally reforming to get away from that unsustainability is a good thing

 

[DTA]

So the plan of a million or two million extra economic migrant working tax payers, with no corresponding investment in housing/health care/schools/roads etc. The same old neo-lib ponzi scheme that operated 2004-2020. Structurally reforming to get away from that unsustainability is a good thing

Extra tax payers are a good thing, who said that there shouldn’t be investment in health/housing/schools/roads etc. In the Blair years there was investment- I mean Blair is a Cuunt for Iraq. But his government was both business friendly and invested in public services.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Extra tax payers are a good thing, who said that there shouldn’t be investment in health/housing/schools/roads etc. In the Blair years there was investment- I mean Blair is a Cuunt for Iraq. But his government was both business friendly and invested in public services.

That's what neo-liberals do - both the blue and the pink type. Get as much in (to siphon off), while investing as little as they can possibly get away with.

There's also little public attitude for building a new Greater Manchester every decade to sustain the needs of a population-expansion driven growth programme.

 

[LutonSpurs]

The problem with your argument @Gutter Boy is that your interesting and, admittedly, fascinating economic ideas - would need competent folk in charge. We have just c*nts

 

[Rorschach]

The idea of reducing growth to something that is within the boundaries the planet can support while still maintaining life essentials is the safe space we need to head for if we want civilisation not to utterly collapse in this generation. However, what is happening in the UK is not this but rather a government dangerously flirting with systemic collapse while distracting the masses with culture war nonsense.

The immigrants that come over and work for paltry wages and live in poor conditions are not the problem. These people are only fulfilling a need. The problem is that these jobs are underpaid and undervalued, to begin with. The pandemic highlighted what was truly essential work and what were flimflam jobs. We chose not to learn this lesson.

 

[Gutter Boy]

The idea of reducing growth to something that is within the boundaries the planet can support while still maintaining life essentials is the safe space we need to head for if we want civilisation not to utterly collapse in this generation. However, what is happening in the UK is not this but rather a government dangerously flirting with systemic collapse while distracting the masses with culture war nonsense.

The immigrants that come over and work for paltry wages and live in poor conditions are not the problem. These people are only fulfilling a need. The problem is that these jobs are underpaid and undervalued, to begin with. The pandemic highlighted what was truly essential work and what was flimflam jobs. We chose not to learn this lesson.

There will be a GE in less than two years where we can start to change course. Start giving decent pay to the public sector and shifting away from being a finance sector dominated economy.

Breaking and disrupting some of the norms of Reagonomics, which have been dominating this country for more than 40 years, is just the first step. I know for the right giving power to the workers by enabling demand for labour to nudge ahead of supply wasn't intended. But for lexiters its was always the plan/goal. It's the same with breaking complex supply chains to facilitate localism.

 

[Rorschach]

There will be a GE in less than two years where we can start to change course. Start giving decent pay to the public sector and shifting away from being a finance sector dominated economy.

Breaking and disrupting some of the norms of Reagonomics, which have been dominating this country for more than 40 years, is just the first step. I know for the right giving power to the workers by enabling demand for labour to nudge ahead of supply wasn't intended. But for lexiters its was always the plan/goal. It's the same with breaking complex supply chains to facilitate localism.

Will there be much of a public sector or budget to pay them left in 2 years at this rate? The NHS certainly looks at huge risk. To me the more I hear him, the more I feel Starmer will also disappoint. He's a decent man but lacking imagination for the moment the UK finds itself in.
The death of neoliberalism is well underway but it is nothing to do with the brexit you voted for. This was not a 'goal' of brexit nor a byproduct of it, but maybe those who voted for brexit are rewriting its purpose with this excuse to salve their conscience for the unfolding harm it has caused.
Substitute isolationism for localism and you are closer to the real reason.

 

[Diamond Lights]

Brexit. Such banter. The elephant in the room but the room is getting smaller and the elephant gets bigger.

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

The problem with your argument @Gutter Boy is that your interesting and, admittedly, fascinating economic ideas - would need competent folk in charge. We have just c*nts

Nailed it.

 

[spurspinter1]

The idea of reducing growth to something that is within the boundaries the planet can support while still maintaining life essentials is the safe space we need to head for if we want civilisation not to utterly collapse in this generation. However, what is happening in the UK is not this but rather a government dangerously flirting with systemic collapse while distracting the masses with culture war nonsense.

The immigrants that come over and work for paltry wages and live in poor conditions are not the problem. These people are only fulfilling a need. The problem is that these jobs are underpaid and undervalued, to begin with. The pandemic highlighted what was truly essential work and what was flimflam jobs. We chose not to learn this lesson.

Sounds like tofu eating do-gooder nonsense to me

Ensuring the wellbeing of people AND the planet? But what about the GDP!? Won't someone think of the GDP!?!?!?!?!?!?

 

[Rorschach]

Sounds like tofu eating do-gooder nonsense to me

Ensuring the wellbeing of people AND the planet? But what about the GDP!? Won't someone think of the GDP!?!?!?!?!?!?

It's all I eat.

edit: that reminds me of this cartoon.

 

[DTA]

The problem with your argument @Gutter Boy is that your interesting and, admittedly, fascinating economic ideas - would need competent folk in charge. We have just c*nts

Your comment surprises me. @Gutter Boy is in Lala land. His left wing libertarian musings are incoherent.

worse he is simply deflecting from the fact that his beloved Brexit has seriously damaged the country.

That goes for every other Brexiteer as well, you have all damaged the country you live in and it’s people’s lives will be made harder because of your actions.