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Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked

It's either the fans or the owners. And Jord seemingly won't let himself be caught blaming the owners, despite them being the same owners that 1) sold Ramos' best players from under him and presented to him Pavlyuchenko + the already contracted Bent as replacements, 2) negotiated with Ramos himself behind Jol's back, ultimately sacking him in the most undignified manner possible, and 3) sold the player AVB built his team around, gave him players he didn't want as second-rate replacements for the ones he did want, and totally back-tracked on whatever promises they made to him when they appointed him in the first place.

No, it's the fans at fault. If they'd all offered an extra 500 pounds a season then we might just have been able to back our managers properly, and what right have they to boo and express their displeasure after paying the second-highest season ticket prices in the league and seeing absolutely no similar backing being provided by the owners? They should just keep paying the money that they do, watch as the team of spineless bargain-buys infuriate the coach on the touchline, watch as the owners f*ck over manager after manager without dropping a single cent of their own in the process, and somehow delude themselves that this is 'the right way' to do things, as opposed to City (whose fans pay on average the lowest prices in the league while supporting a club that makes enormous efforts to build relationships with them and while watching a team of superstars excite them every week) or Chelsea's methods.

The supporters that moan and bitch about everything, then blames Levy for not having any patience when he sacks someone they've wanted out for over a year. Nobody will ever get the time or space they need to sort this club out and it's not because Levy is impatient or too demanding.
 
It's not Levy either

It's the sum of everything. We are where we should be. Unfortunately that's not good enough for some, hence the incredibly kneejerking every time we don't destroy the opposition.

Levy got us the squad that Redknapp was able to get CL with, but a better manager would have more with it. Now we're rebuilding and in a year or two we can hope to reach those heights again. Hopefully Poch can come up with better targets than Redknapp and less expensive ones than AVB.

I imagine thats why he decided against expensive signings in the summer. He wanted to save money and see if he could turn these players into something. I mean it's almost ironic that he spent most on a left back and managed to improve the one we had anyway - if they dont turn out good, Poch will get and replace with players that he knows can do the job. I imagine we'll go for Moreno in January and perhaps Rodriguez. Getting rid of Chiriches and Townsend/Lennon.
 
I imagine thats why he decided against expensive signings in the summer. He wanted to save money and see if he could turn these players into something. I mean it's almost ironic that he spent most on a left back and managed to improve the one we had anyway - if they dont turn out good, Poch will get and replace with players that he knows can do the job. I imagine we'll go for Moreno in January and perhaps Rodriguez. Getting rid of Chiriches and Townsend/Lennon.

We signed players for positions we were short in. Not everyone coming in has to be immediate first choices.
 
Is there seriously an argument about certain 'tactics' not working in the PL, despite our manager showing with much worse players that they can indeed work?

It's clearly, very obviously, about time being needed to not only take a system from the training field into games, but to then start winning with it too. It isn't easy. Individual players are having to adapt their games. First they struggle to adapt, then they get it in training, then they get it in some games but not others, and eventually they get it good. But it takes time.

What I've seen under Poch has shown better football than the entirety of AVB and Sherwood's reigns to be honest, certainly at WHL. But it's tough. I do think our atmosphere is a little to blame. It's not the only thing, but the fans are acting in quite an entitled way. By that I mean the atmosphere is great when we are playing fast paced football and looking fluid. But should we hit a tough patch in the game? The fans don't stick with the team. The atmosphere becomes poisonous. Everyone starts moaning. There's no real support, just howls of derision that it isn't all going to plan as it was a few minutes ago.

What is needed for success I think is a good coach, support, and time. I think we have a good coach. In time his methods will get absorbed by the players willing to take it on board, and dissenters will be sold. But if we don't have support, that process of taking on board new methods will take a lot longer, or could be stopped completely.

We are getting there. We are already playing good football in spurts and are losing points due to errors that likely come from trying to concentrate on what a new system requires as well as having it become second nature so points can be gained. May take a while but it's absolute nonsense to be calling for a manager to go. There's not really a lot he is doing wrong.
 
Er... They rather do if we want to improve.

I see you're from the Redknapp school of coaching. Can't teach players anything new, so resort to a conveyor belt of new signings instead. If someone's out of form, sign a replacement.
 
Is there seriously an argument about certain 'tactics' not working in the PL, despite our manager showing with much worse players that they can indeed work?

It's clearly, very obviously, about time being needed to not only take a system from the training field into games, but to then start winning with it too. It isn't easy. Individual players are having to adapt their games. First they struggle to adapt, then they get it in training, then they get it in some games but not others, and eventually they get it good. But it takes time.

What I've seen under Poch has shown better football than the entirety of AVB and Sherwood's reigns to be honest, certainly at WHL. But it's tough. I do think our atmosphere is a little to blame. It's not the only thing, but the fans are acting in quite an entitled way. By that I mean the atmosphere is great when we are playing fast paced football and looking fluid. But should we hit a tough patch in the game? The fans don't stick with the team. The atmosphere becomes poisonous. Everyone starts moaning. There's no real support, just howls of derision that it isn't all going to plan as it was a few minutes ago.

What is needed for success I think is a good coach, support, and time. I think we have a good coach. In time his methods will get absorbed by the players willing to take it on board, and dissenters will be sold. But if we don't have support, that process of taking on board new methods will take a lot longer, or could be stopped completely.

We are getting there. We are already playing good football in spurts and are losing points due to errors that likely come from trying to concentrate on what a new system requires as well as having it become second nature so points can be gained. May take a while but it's absolute nonsense to be calling for a manager to go. There's not really a lot he is doing wrong.

I'm just dismissing the idea that anything achieved in other leagues counts for absolutely nothing.
 
The supporters that moan and bitch about everything, then blames Levy for not having any patience when he sacks someone they've wanted out for over a year. Nobody will ever get the time or space they need to sort this club out and it's not because Levy is impatient or too demanding.

At one stage Jord, that may have been the case. I hope that by now the fans understand the real reason for their displeasure, instead of settling for blaming the point-man like we previously used to do, which was the most useful 'get out of jail free' card Levy had in his arsenal.

The rot at this club stems from the policies used to run this club. You cannot charge people the insanely high ticket prices we do and then expect them to be satisfied with the fare that we've offered up over the last few years, especially when not a single cent (or paisa, or penny) has come from the glorious owners, possessed as they are with the overriding desire to ultimately make a profit on their investment here without a single financial contribution of any sort from them and without a single risk taken in terms of backing the men appointed by them to run the club.

The fans pay their outrageous ticket prices. They watch as this money is used to sign Stambouli and Fazio (well, players of that evident bargain-buy status) instead of the players the manager expressly states that he wants, and they watch as profits are registered in window after window, financial year after financial year. They then watch the manager struggle to fit these players evidently not perfectly suited to his system into the team. They watch the team struggling to adapt. And then, as is so often the case, they blame the manager and thus allow Levy to gleefully wield the axe citing fan discontent and bring in another potential yes-man who fell for the promises spun during the interviews, promises of investment, backing and ambition. And then the whole cycle starts again.

I've tried to change. Whatever happens at this club, I will not be blaming the manager for it. The sooner the rest of the fanbase wake up and direct their ire to the executive boxes above them, the sooner the miasma and lack of purpose at this club will dissipate, one way or another.
 
At one stage Jord, that may have been the case. I hope that by now the fans understand the real reason for their displeasure, instead of settling for blaming the point-man like we previously used to do, which was the most useful 'get out of jail free' card Levy had in his arsenal.

The rot at this club stems from the policies used to run this club. You cannot charge people the insanely high ticket prices we do and then expect them to be satisfied with the fare that we've offered up over the last few years, especially when not a single cent (or paisa, or penny) has come from the glorious owners, possessed as they are with the overriding desire to ultimately make a profit on their investment here without a single financial contribution of any sort from them and without a single risk taken in terms of backing the men appointed by them to run the club.

The fans pay their outrageous ticket prices. They watch as this money is used to sign Stambouli and Fazio (well, players of that evident bargain-buy status) instead of the players the manager expressly states that he wants, and they watch as profits are registered in window after window, financial year after financial year. They then watch the manager struggle to fit these players evidently not perfectly suited to his system into the team. They watch the team struggling to adapt. And then, as is so often the case, they blame the manager and thus allow Levy to gleefully wield the axe citing fan discontent and bring in another potential yes-man who fell for the promises spun during the interviews, promises of investment, backing and ambition. And then the whole cycle starts again.

I've tried to change. Whatever happens at this club, I will not be blaming the manager for it. The sooner the rest of the fanbase wake up and direct their ire to the executive boxes above them, the sooner the miasma and lack of purpose at this club will dissipate, one way or another.

This is a good point but there are so many Levy apologists out there. The man is teflon for some reason
 
I see you're from the Redknapp school of coaching. Can't teach players anything new, so resort to a conveyor belt of new signings instead. If someone's out of form, sign a replacement.

It is patently obvious to me that if we want to improve then our new signings should be BETTER than those we have already, otherwise we will stay static at best or , as in our case, inevitably go backwards.
 
The problem most definitely lies with a lot of fans...on this site for sure. We had Redknapp who with we played the best football I have seen in my 20 or so years of supporting and I don't need to go into detail about what he achieved in a short time here. But this apparent wheeler dealer was never going to be classy enough to be accepted on here. Then you could even look to Tim Sherwood who had a great record despite taking over in difficult times and inheriting a squad who wasn't his own. But it was decided he wasn't good enough as soon as he'd started and the way what he said to the press was twisted by some on here to suit their agendas was just embarrassing.

Now we have Poch, and he of course is already edging towards the fans' cauldron. I don't know who on earth some people on here think we are but we aren't anywhere near the level some think we have a divine right to be at, and that arrogance thinking we are bigger and better than we actually are is why fans of so many other clubs can't stand us...


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk
 
The problem most definitely lies with a lot of fans...on this site for sure. We had Redknapp who with we played the best football I have seen in my 20 or so years of supporting and I don't need to go into detail about what he achieved in a short time here. But this apparent wheeler dealer was never going to be classy enough to be accepted on here. Then you could even look to Tim Sherwood who had a great record despite taking over in difficult times and inheriting a squad who wasn't his own. But it was decided he wasn't good enough as soon as he'd started and the way what he said to the press was twisted by some on here to suit their agendas was just embarrassing.

Now we have Poch, and he of course is already edging towards the fans' cauldron. I don't know who on earth some people on here think we are but we aren't anywhere near the level some think we have a divine right to be at, and that arrogance thinking we are bigger and better than we actually are is why fans of so many other clubs can't stand us...


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk

At the time I said the grass isnt greener on the other side, two years down the line we are way worse. People are just never happy with progress, they are addicted to change.
 
At the time I said the grass isnt greener on the other side, two years down the line we are way worse. People are just never happy with progress, they are addicted to change.

Indeed. He allegedly took his eye off the ball (according to many on here) with the England job and we finished 4th. What hard times those were!

I see he said the other day he believed he should have gone on to win the title with us with a couple of additions, and he might not of been far off if we had persisted with him...


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk
 
The problem most definitely lies with a lot of fans...on this site for sure. We had Redknapp who with we played the best football I have seen in my 20 or so years of supporting and I don't need to go into detail about what he achieved in a short time here. But this apparent wheeler dealer was never going to be classy enough to be accepted on here. Then you could even look to Tim Sherwood who had a great record despite taking over in difficult times and inheriting a squad who wasn't his own. But it was decided he wasn't good enough as soon as he'd started and the way what he said to the press was twisted by some on here to suit their agendas was just embarrassing.

Now we have Poch, and he of course is already edging towards the fans' cauldron. I don't know who on earth some people on here think we are but we aren't anywhere near the level some think we have a divine right to be at, and that arrogance thinking we are bigger and better than we actually are is why fans of so many other clubs can't stand us...


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk

Because under Rednapp we finished 4th , 5th, 4th. Divine right no, but most fans hoped we just might have kicked on from there not gone backwards so far and so fast.
 
The problem most definitely lies with a lot of fans...on this site for sure. We had Redknapp who with we played the best football I have seen in my 20 or so years of supporting and I don't need to go into detail about what he achieved in a short time here. But this apparent wheeler dealer was never going to be classy enough to be accepted on here. Then you could even look to Tim Sherwood who had a great record despite taking over in difficult times and inheriting a squad who wasn't his own. But it was decided he wasn't good enough as soon as he'd started and the way what he said to the press was twisted by some on here to suit their agendas was just embarrassing.

Now we have Poch, and he of course is already edging towards the fans' cauldron. I don't know who on earth some people on here think we are but we aren't anywhere near the level some think we have a divine right to be at, and that arrogance thinking we are bigger and better than we actually are is why fans of so many other clubs can't stand us...


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk

Our fans who attend games pay the second highest ticket prices in the league. Yet we are unique, in that we also expect them to accept that fact but still pretend that they're happy with the sub-par fare currently being served up.
Stop blaming the fans. If anything, the only mistake they've made (and I've made, to be fair) is falling for the old trick of blaming the manager/DoF every time. It is time to look at the way the club is being run as the real reason for fan discontent (charging outrageous prices but offering next to no accountability to the fans, nor any success on the field to merit such high prices or even any support from the owners to the managers they themselves appoint). Don't question the fans who pay through their noses and then watch Nelsen and Saha come in on a free, or Keane and Berbatov being replaced by Pavlyuchenko and Bent, or the profits being made in every transfer window, or Modric being replaced on deadline day by Dembele because the chairman wouldn't pay enough to secure Moutinho.
 
Because under Rednapp we finished 4th , 5th, 4th. Divine right no, but most fans hoped we just might have kicked on from there not gone backwards so far and so fast.

Yes, under Redknapp - the guy that a hell of a lot never wanted, and were happy to see go. It's like the guy who's looking for this perfect girlfriend that doesn't exist...


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk
 
Indeed. He allegedly took his eye off the ball (according to many on here) with the England job and we finished 4th. What hard times those were!

I see he said the other day he believed he should have gone on to win the title with us with a couple of additions, and he might not of been far off if we had persisted with him...


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk

He got those additions. Nelsen and Saha. If you expected us to add any actually quality players to the squad after that, please revise your estimation of how this club is run.
 
Bit late to be ctying over old putty face..again!
I just want to know how we're going to get out of this fine mess Stanley.. and what support Levy and Lewis are going to give Poch and the Italian Lovejoy!
 
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