Leeds Spur
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Dempsey doesn't look the player we signed. And Sandro?
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Andre Villas-Boas - Head Coach
- Thread starter Bale
- Start date
Dempsey doesn't look the player we signed. And Sandro?
Sandman
Jermaine Jenas
I would say that normally the guy that plays behind the forward has some ability to hold onto the ball, beat a man and look for a pass. A bit like VDV, funny that. I think its obvious AVB likes players with a bit of pace on them, or at least players that can cover in a tactical system. At the moment he is using Dempsey to disrupt the other teams free man, Dempsey is working hard covering a lot of ground. I dont have a problem with the defensive side of his game. But when he gets the ball he loses it, or makes the wrong option. Siggurdsson was bought for this role, but has struggled so much Dempsey is filling in.
If we sign Willian then the whole complext of the formation changes. But i doubt we get him now he is doing fairly well for Shaktar and they do not need to sell.
Jurgen the German
Willie Hall
He looked up for it in the home game, but the game seem to pass him by when we lost 5-2.
I don't blame AVB for playing 1 striker today as it was obvious that Emirates Marketing Project would dominate the midfield, but I can't figure out why he would drop Defoe after scoring a hat trick. There have been plenty of opportunities to give Defoe a rest, today wasn't the day.
glorygloryeze
Tom Huddlestone
Going up against the champions who play with a midfield 3 with two strikers in a 4-4-2, one of which is not very good in the air, not good at holding the ball and linking up with late runners from midfield, is what I call gung-ho. I stress this more with mention that one of our midfield two, whilst being very cultured has not got the pace or energy to get up and down the field.
Yes that would have been not just gung-ho but suicidal
Jurgen the German
Willie Hall
Dempsey was just desperate to get out of Fulham. He's been a passenger in every game!
We are too negative, especially at home. We try and shut up shop whenever we get a lead, but its not working. We have 1 clean sheet in the league all season. AVB seems like a clever guy, but someone needs to tell him that Spurs and hanging on to leads don't mix.
glorygloryeze
Tom Huddlestone
Tbf, I though Ade showed today that he really is the top dog atm when it comes to away games and playing 1-up. He worked tirelessly and from what i've seen, most of any of what gameplay we had was only really possible because of his hold-up and link play.
Harsh on Defoe, but it was neccesary imo.
Jurgen the German
Willie Hall
Unless we completely collapse, we won't be out of 4th by Jan. I do agree however that we won't sign any big players in January. How long have we been saying we need a top class striker in the next window? Since Berbatov left?
glorygloryeze
Tom Huddlestone
We are indeed too negative at times. I really wonder if deep dpwn the OT result has left a mark on us a little, especially conceding our second so soon after Dempsey made it 3-1.
Perhaps a crisis of cofidence in holding leads all round. I also think we'll get more cohesive in this area when Kaboul and BAE return. If we are still a bit iffy in this regard when these two and some of our other injured players then deeper questions will have to start tbf...
glorygloryeze
Tom Huddlestone
Is it safe to ask....is AVB a portuguese Rafa Benitez?8-[
Baleforce
Les Bennett
if the answer to the following 2 statements are true then yes
1. he's fat
2. he's a waiter
Rossi22
Pedro Mendes
Lloris; Walker, Kaboul, Vertonghen, Ekotto; Sandro, Moutinho, Dembele; Nani, Willian, Hernandez
That's my AVB Porto-esque Spurs team on FM13, that's the kind of shape/style I thought we'd be seeing. Obviously injuries have gotten in the way in some areas but there have been questionable decisions too.
That's my AVB Porto-esque Spurs team on FM13, that's the kind of shape/style I thought we'd be seeing. Obviously injuries have gotten in the way in some areas but there have been questionable decisions too.
SUIYHA
Scott Parker
I have no problem with the way we set up in the first half today. The fact is, we're not going to beat teams like City away from home by overwhelming them for 90 minutes. The best way to get a result would be to contain them, frustrate their players and fans and nick a goal if the opportunity came.
It's the second half that I found unacceptable. For starters, it took AVB until the 78th minute to make his first substitution, and this was enforced. He demonstrated a complete lack of decisiveness in taking so long, by which point, our tactic of sitting back and trying to soak up all the pressure had failed because we were always going to crack eventually if we'd tried it for 90 minutes. But here's where things got fudging bonkers. Walker goes off, you have another right-back on the bench, and instead he brought on Dawson? To play Gallas at RB? I'm sorry but that's just plain fudging stupid - as bad as any of the crap tactical decisions we saw from Pleat or Ramos. Then he took off Adebayor, who's movement, pace and physical presence was causing City problems - again, ridiculous decision considering how many long balls we were hoofing up the pitch. Finally, Lennon came off. I didn't know Lennon was injured at the time, but nevertheless, why bring on a defender in place of him? Why didn't we have any more wingers on the bench? Where were Falque and Townsend? At the very least, he could have brought on Sigurdsson and played either him or Dempsey out wide. A simple lesson for you Andre which you still haven't learned - if you substitute all your best attacking players in the hope of holding on to what you've got, and then the opposition score, YOU HAVE NO ATTACKING PLAYERS TO GET A GOAL BACK! Not fudging rocket science. As soon as City scored the second I knew that was it, we wouldn't even create another chance for the rest of the match.
I want AVB out. It's a calculated, logical viewpoint. fudge giving him time or having patience, why does he deserve either of those things when he's getting things so badly wrong every week? We have dropped points in 6 out of 11 league games this season, and by my count at least five of them have been AVB's fault. Same with the Norwich Carling Cup exit by taking off Carroll and bringing on Vertonghen to take off the pressure and hand them the initiative. I can forgive the odd tactical mistake here and there, every manager makes them. I can even forgive the odd absolutely shocking tactical mistake if it only happens every now and again, like when Harry played King and Zokora in central midfield away to Wigan once, or played a wide open 4-4-2 with too many slow players at the Emirates last season. But what I can't forgive is insane tactical blunders in more matches than not, in fact there's often been multiple mega-blunders in the same game.
The results haven't been as bad as I've seen at Tottenham, but we should have more points on the board than we do. The football on the other hand, is terrible. You probably have to go back as far as Graham to get a time when we were creating fewer opportunities per match. I've watched Tottenham teams managed by Ossie Ardiles, Gerry Francis, Christian Gross, George Graham, Glenn Hoddle, David Pleat, Jacques Santini and Juande Ramos - I know what a bad manager looks like. And AVB is a bad manager. I want him out.
It's the second half that I found unacceptable. For starters, it took AVB until the 78th minute to make his first substitution, and this was enforced. He demonstrated a complete lack of decisiveness in taking so long, by which point, our tactic of sitting back and trying to soak up all the pressure had failed because we were always going to crack eventually if we'd tried it for 90 minutes. But here's where things got fudging bonkers. Walker goes off, you have another right-back on the bench, and instead he brought on Dawson? To play Gallas at RB? I'm sorry but that's just plain fudging stupid - as bad as any of the crap tactical decisions we saw from Pleat or Ramos. Then he took off Adebayor, who's movement, pace and physical presence was causing City problems - again, ridiculous decision considering how many long balls we were hoofing up the pitch. Finally, Lennon came off. I didn't know Lennon was injured at the time, but nevertheless, why bring on a defender in place of him? Why didn't we have any more wingers on the bench? Where were Falque and Townsend? At the very least, he could have brought on Sigurdsson and played either him or Dempsey out wide. A simple lesson for you Andre which you still haven't learned - if you substitute all your best attacking players in the hope of holding on to what you've got, and then the opposition score, YOU HAVE NO ATTACKING PLAYERS TO GET A GOAL BACK! Not fudging rocket science. As soon as City scored the second I knew that was it, we wouldn't even create another chance for the rest of the match.
I want AVB out. It's a calculated, logical viewpoint. fudge giving him time or having patience, why does he deserve either of those things when he's getting things so badly wrong every week? We have dropped points in 6 out of 11 league games this season, and by my count at least five of them have been AVB's fault. Same with the Norwich Carling Cup exit by taking off Carroll and bringing on Vertonghen to take off the pressure and hand them the initiative. I can forgive the odd tactical mistake here and there, every manager makes them. I can even forgive the odd absolutely shocking tactical mistake if it only happens every now and again, like when Harry played King and Zokora in central midfield away to Wigan once, or played a wide open 4-4-2 with too many slow players at the Emirates last season. But what I can't forgive is insane tactical blunders in more matches than not, in fact there's often been multiple mega-blunders in the same game.
The results haven't been as bad as I've seen at Tottenham, but we should have more points on the board than we do. The football on the other hand, is terrible. You probably have to go back as far as Graham to get a time when we were creating fewer opportunities per match. I've watched Tottenham teams managed by Ossie Ardiles, Gerry Francis, Christian Gross, George Graham, Glenn Hoddle, David Pleat, Jacques Santini and Juande Ramos - I know what a bad manager looks like. And AVB is a bad manager. I want him out.
Pirate55
The Last Man Standing 17/18
Can anyone point to anything positive that AVB has brought to the team?
For the life of me, I am struggling to see any improvement anywhere at all. His negative attitude and "have what we hold" tactic of ceding possession is not the way I want my team to play. One up front and two DMs at home has just proved turgid to watch. Losing goals in the last 10 minutes and not scoring any in that time is like having a constant kick in the gut.
Lets "To dare is to do". He talks that way but certainly isnt delivering it at the moment.
I really hope there is some method in the madness, but I cant see it yet.
For the life of me, I am struggling to see any improvement anywhere at all. His negative attitude and "have what we hold" tactic of ceding possession is not the way I want my team to play. One up front and two DMs at home has just proved turgid to watch. Losing goals in the last 10 minutes and not scoring any in that time is like having a constant kick in the gut.
Lets "To dare is to do". He talks that way but certainly isnt delivering it at the moment.
I really hope there is some method in the madness, but I cant see it yet.
NaijaSpurs
Les Ferdinand
I would rather play a midfield 2 if the option of a third central midfielder is playing as badly as Dempsey was today. If Ade is capable of holding the ball up and linking player then it does not matter if Defoe is not good as those things because he is more likely to score a goal than any other player on our books at the moment. Apart from possibly scoring from a set piece we never troubled the keeper and never remotely looked like scoring and I think it is weak argument to suggest 442 is suicidal. Emirates Marketing Project have proven this season that there defence is brittle but we offered nothing
Gung-ho means wholeheartedly enthusiastic and loyal; eager; zealous - now that does not seem a bad thing to me
SUIYHA
Scott Parker
a truly pathetic attitude, no matter how you dress it up
Nope, ignoring all the fault's of somebody holding back the club you love is.
How long are you supposed to wait before you're allowed to have made the decision that somebody is not up to the job? What if they're doing things REALLY badly? When you take a job in the real world, even if you have an outstanding CV and you interview exceptionally well then you still have a probation period. Well if AVB worked for me, and he had a probation period in his contract (I know that doesn't happen in football), I would have decided not to retain his services after what I've seen so far.
Nobody wants him to succeed more than I do. I would love to rub it in the faces of all my Chelsea mates if we were successful under him. But when I've been watching him make the same mistakes week in week out that everybody except him seems to be able to spot, why should I suddenly expect him to come good?
NaijaSpurs
Les Ferdinand
Agreed he worked hard but as I keep saying we did not trouble their keeper apart from set pieces. Because Ade has excellent hold up and link play skills that is more the reason he should play alongside Defoe, the one player player capable of benefiting from those skills.
SUIYHA
Scott Parker
"We want to respond a little bit to Tottenham's philosophy. We want to be brave away from home," the Tottenham manager said.
"We certainly always try to have a go. Our away form gives us something that is very pleasing and we know that we will play in a very confident way away from home.
"We are very confident. Whenever you play the champions in their own ground it's excellent so we obviously go there to win.
"We will play our style of football knowing we have nothing to lose against a team like City.
"It will be difficult but we have our own strengths too and they will be aware of that."
See this is bad. Very bad. Either he lied to the fans, or he cannot get the team to play the attacking style of football that he wants. Either way - it's bad.
"We certainly always try to have a go. Our away form gives us something that is very pleasing and we know that we will play in a very confident way away from home.
"We are very confident. Whenever you play the champions in their own ground it's excellent so we obviously go there to win.
"We will play our style of football knowing we have nothing to lose against a team like City.
"It will be difficult but we have our own strengths too and they will be aware of that."
See this is bad. Very bad. Either he lied to the fans, or he cannot get the team to play the attacking style of football that he wants. Either way - it's bad.
NaijaSpurs
Les Ferdinand
Already? That is sad and pitiful. You want him out after 11 league games and if the next manager does not start well in 11 league games time you would want him out too? Spurs fans never cease to do my head in on here
glorygloryeze
Tom Huddlestone
I would rather play a midfield 2 if the option of a third central midfielder is playing as badly as Dempsey was today. If Ade is capable of holding the ball up and linking player then it does not matter if Defoe is not good as those things because he is more likely to score a goal than any other player on our books at the moment. Apart from possibly scoring from a set piece we never troubled the keeper and never remotely looked like scoring and I think it is weak argument to suggest 442 is suicidal. Emirates Marketing Project have proven this season that there defence is brittle but we offered nothing
Gung-ho means wholeheartedly enthusiastic and loyal; eager; zealous - now that does not seem a bad thing to me
Dempsey was and mostly has been crap; I've said that several times. Perhaps Sigg would have offered more, who knows, he's mostly been crap too. I'll simply ask you this: when was the last time we looked really effective against a top team when we played Ade and Defoe in a 4-4-2? Please don't count Maribor, as they were not exactly great. We offered nothing because our midfield couldn't match theirs realistically in terms of energy and incisiveness. Swapping Defoe for Dempsey wouldn't have changed that issue. Perhaps if Moussa was available we would have had more thrust there.
I think you know what I mean by gung-ho in this regard. I have some criticisms of AVB but in terms of hist starting line-up thbere was not much different he could have done imo: start Sigg instead of Dempsey? Meh, what difference would that have made. Start Defoe instead of Dempsey? Ade probably even more isolated and fustrated. At home? probably. Away? Perhaps possible in many games. Away against City? With our current CM options?:ross: