Andre Villas-Boas - Head Coach

[mattls]

The thing that worries me about AVB is what does he say to the players at half time, what were his tactics in that second half yesterday? On many occassions this season we've had a lead and then just tried to see out the final half out with no sort of plan, yesterday we could have lost by alot more and it was only a matter of time before City equalised and then went onto winning the game. Comparing the City game to last year at least we had a go and probably should have won, this year was more of a surrender. Under 'arry it was more about go and express yourself to your effective best where as i get the feeling under AVB that he complicates things so the players go out with a mental block. I think we do miss Dembele and Kaboul but we still badly need a quality centre mid who's gonna control things when we're 1 up or just taken a lead so maybe AVB should be judged when we have hopefully bought in someone like Moutinho who we should have bought in the summer as soon as Modric was out the door? From what ive seen as Hoddle put it yesterday 'the jury is out'.

 

[Harry_Perkins]

Que?

Well, this is wrong, for a start. Are there 37 games in a league season? Di Matteo was in charge for 11 league games. And he won 5 of them. So his record over 11 games is nearly identical with AVB over 27. And anyway, the longer term stat is more reliable than the short. Then you have to consider how they rested and rotated players as they concentrated on the CL as the best chance of getting back into it the following year. Plus, the FA Cup as the secondly best chance of silverware. They won both and the league record still matches AVB over 27 games? It doesn't look wonderful for AVB on any front in comparison with RDM, frankly.

Why not?

We have replaced Modric and VdV with inferior players so how can we expect a higher standard of performance from those 2 outlets?

So are we now saying that he doesn't take any credit or not for any signings or the lack of them? I realise there is a massive fly in the ointment that is the chairman but I don't see how the signings were that bad, in all honesty. Compare with the year we lost Defoe, Keane and Berbatov and replaced them with Campbell and Pav? (for the 3/4th of the season anyway!). AVB gets away pretty lightly in that the chairman hasn't actually left him in dire straits, as he has done with other managers. But either way, the major area of concern is tactical and perhaps partly man management.

 

[scaramanga]

The thing that worries me about AVB is what does he say to the players at half time, what was his tactics in that second half yesterday? On many occassions this season we've had a lead and then just tried to see the final half out with no sort of plan, yesterday we could have lost by alot more and it was only a matter of time before City equalised and then went onto winning the game. Comparing the City game to last year at least we had a go and probably should have won, this year was more of a surrender. Under 'arry it was more about go and express yourself where as i get the feeling under AVB that he complicates things so the players go out with a mental block. I think we do miss Dembele and Kaboul but we still badly need a quality centre mid who's gonna control things when we're 1 up or just taken a lead so maybe AVB should be judged when we have hopefully bought in someone like Moutinho who we should have bought in the summer as soon as Modric was out the door? From what ive seen as Hoddle put it yesterday 'the jury is out'.

Which, in the long term, will probably have you finish above those teams worse than you and ahead of those better than you.

Great fun for a while, but will never see us compete with those at the top. Equally we can't keep uncovering a Modric or a Berbatov every few seasons either, so over time the best we can hope for is 4th (more likely 5th) with dips down a little until we uncover the next Modric/Berbatov.

Go and run about a bit is not a tactic. Neither is it an appropriate plan for anyone who thinks in longer terms than the next 5 minutes or about the general success of the club in general.

 

[ArcspacE]

Well, this is wrong, for a start. Are there 37 games in a league season? Di Matteo was in charge for 11 league games. And he won 5 of them. So his record over 11 games is nearly identical with AVB over 27. And anyway, the longer term stat is more reliable than the short. Then you have to consider how they rested and rotated players as they concentrated on the CL as the best chance of getting back into it the following year. Plus, the FA Cup as the secondly best chance of silverware. They won both and the league record still matches AVB over 27 games? It doesn't look wonderful for AVB on any front in comparison with RDM, frankly.

We never know what they could have won with him still around howerver that is not the point here.

You said under AVB they struggled to make 6th which isn't true assuming they were 5th and closer to 4th points-wise than under Di Matteo

So are we now saying that he doesn't take any credit or not for any signings or the lack of them? I realise there is a massive fly in the ointment that is the chairman but I don't see how the signings were that bad, in all honesty. Compare with the year we lost Defoe, Keane and Berbatov and replaced them with Campbell and Pav? (for the 3/4th of the season anyway!). AVB gets away pretty lightly in that the chairman hasn't actually left him in dire straits, as he has done with other managers. But either way, the major area of concern is tactical and perhaps partly man management.

Good or bad - they are below the level of those who departed so expecting similar performances from those players is completely unrealisitc.

 

[NaijaSpurs]

Why not?

We have replaced Modric and VdV with inferior players so how can we expect a higher standard of performance from those 2 outlets?

Indeed, and Dembele who I actually consider superior has been out injured. No coincidence we tend to get better results when Dembele is in the team

 

[Leeds Spur]

Nope, ignoring all the fault's of somebody holding back the club you love is.

How long are you supposed to wait before you're allowed to have made the decision that somebody is not up to the job? What if they're doing things REALLY badly? When you take a job in the real world, even if you have an outstanding CV and you interview exceptionally well then you still have a probation period. Well if AVB worked for me, and he had a probation period in his contract (I know that doesn't happen in football), I would have decided not to retain his services after what I've seen so far.

Nobody wants him to succeed more than I do. I would love to rub it in the faces of all my Chelsea mates if we were successful under him. But when I've been watching him make the same mistakes week in week out that everybody except him seems to be able to spot, why should I suddenly expect him to come good?

And there we have the truth.

More worried about losing face in front of your Chelsea mate, who will NEVER change their opinion of the man, than SUPPORTING the team.

I bet they were still giving him a load of brick when we won 5 on the spin? Yet we have a poor result against Wigan and an expected one against Emirates Marketing Project and you're convinced he's not the man?

That's why you have NOTHING to do with football and he's a title winning manager at 33.

AVB aint going anywhere until the end of 2014 season.

I would bet my life on it.

You didn't want Harry gone and every decision and thing he does is focussed trough that lense.

I manage a team and i've lost count of how many times someone was close to the sack and I had formed an early opinion of them, only for them to come good and my perception to change completely.

We are 11 matches into the season, if you're not mature enough to chill the fudge out and accept he's here and we need to give the man a full season at the minimum then more fool you, you're just setting yourself up for a fall.

 

[Harry_Perkins]

We never know what they could have won with him still around howerver that is not the point here.

You said under AVB they struggled to make 6th which isn't true assuming they were 5th and closer to 4th points-wise than under Di Matteo

This is to assume that his record over those 27 games was somewhat consistent, which was not the case. He picked up 15 points in his last 12 games in charge. On that basis, they were heading for 7th. Not saying it would have happened but they were firmly looking down rather than up.

Good or bad - they are below the level of those who departed so expecting similar performances from those players is completely unrealisitc.

This is a bit of a strawman. I just expected a bit more than midtable results and even worse performances. I don't think that is unrealistic from what he's had available. This is surely self-evident when you look at the 3 clubs directly above us?

 

[Leeds Spur]

Sigh. How long have Arsenal had their manager for, pray tell?

And how many have we gone through in the same time period?

And, in regards to Arsenal's injuries, take out every player you've mentioned and they would still have:

------------------Mannonne--------------------

Sagna------Mertesacker-----Koscielny----Vermaelen

--------------------Coquelin--------------------

------------Cazorla---------Arteta------------

Walcott---------------------------------Podolski

--------------------Giroud--------------------

And that's without counting Wheelchair, Santos, Arshavin and Chamakh on the bench. (Even Oxlade Chamberlain, though apparently he's been injured)

Now, ten + years with a manager's system, and with that quality in the side, they will score against most teams.

Now, we won't use injuries as an excuse. Utterly ridiculous not to, considering Harry's defenders who often put the 'down to bare bones' thing in front of everyone, but let's ignore it.

----------------------------Friedel-------------------------------

Off-form walker---Unreliable Gallas---Caulker---Not an LB Vertonghen

------------------Sandro---------Unfit huddlestone---------------

Lennon--------------------Dempsey?----------------Bale--------

----------------------Unfit Ade/Defoe---------------------------

Against Aguero, Tevez, Dzeko, Silva, Toure and all the rest of them.

A team we lost 5-1 to at home last season. With Modric and Van Der Vaart, two players unavailable to AVB.

And the same team (minus Bale) against chelsea; a side that thrashed us 5-1 at Wembley last season.

While we still had Modric and Van Der Vaart.

And now, upcoming, the same team (possibly with Dembele) against Arsenal.

Last season, they beat us 5-2 at the Emirates, when we had; yup, you guessed it, Modric, a supremely inventive and surprisingly tenacious playmaker, and VDV, a master at finding the right spaces and making the right passes. Players again, unavailable to AVB.

We also lost 3-0 to United at OT last season. Without Modric, but with Van Der Vaart.

With the best team we've had for ages, our masterful manager achieved these spectacular results.
With a team stripped of many of the players who performed well last season, and arguably our weakest since 07-08, what the fudge do you expect of AVB?

He doesn't let players go out and express themselves, he makes a game plan that they have to adhere to. That takes time to implement.

But no, let's just sack him and bring in another poor sod who'll fail instantly before his system can take shape. And we'll sack him too, and the next guy, and the next guy. And then hire Tony Parks because no one else will take the job.

Ridiculous tactical errors, my arse. 4-4-2 at the Emirates was a tactical error. 4-4-2 at OT was a tactical error. Throwing away a ten point lead was the mother of all errors.

Not playing Defoe, or whatever other minor gripe you seem to have, is a doozie compared to the ones above. Still, let's sack him, because you have a gut feeling and as well know, having witnessed your wonderful judgement on Pleat, Santini and Gross (which I'm sure went against the grain; everyone else was obviously blindly supporting them while you alone expressed your doubts and predicted their failure), your gut feeling is never wrong.

Have my babies

 

[Leeds Spur]

We never know what they could have won with him still around howerver that is not the point here.

You said under AVB they struggled to make 6th which isn't true assuming they were 5th and closer to 4th points-wise than under Di Matteo



Good or bad - they are below the level of those who departed so expecting similar performances from those players is completely unrealisitc.

Harry is another one that can't let go.

Things weren't that bad but we fudged off baggy face so get over it.

He aint coming back EVER......he'll be at QPR soon, about his level alongside the likes of Warnock......and when he keeps them up he'll be lauded as per which will be a joke considering their squad

 

[ArcspacE]

This is to assume that his record over those 27 games was somewhat consistent, which was not the case. He picked up 15 points in his last 12 games in charge. On that basis, they were heading for 7th. Not saying it would have happened but they were firmly looking down rather than up.

Now you've changed the story, Harry.

How so? It's equivalent suggesting based on our recent 3 results we are heading for the Championship. Please - your initial comment was incorrect, with respect.

This is a bit of a strawman. I just expected a bit more than midtable results and even worse performances. I don't think that is unrealistic from what he's had available. This is surely self-evident when you look at the 3 clubs directly above us?

WBA, Everton and West Ham have only played 1 of the Top 3 teams

We have played all 3

 

[Ganter]

slowly getting off the AVB train..

this one striker brick and not playing Lloris has to stop. Lloris is one of the best keepers in the world one on one with a striker.

I say lose to Arsenal and Klinsmann will take over

 

[ArcspacE]

slowly getting off the AVB train..

this one striker brick and not playing Lloris has to stop. Lloris is one of the best keepers in the world one on one with a striker.

I say lose to Arsenal and Klinsmann will take over

Hahaha

 

[Ganter]

Hahaha

banged on will happen. mark my words

 

[Spursalot]

slowly getting off the AVB train..

this one striker brick and not playing Lloris has to stop. Lloris is one of the best keepers in the world one on one with a striker.

I say lose to Arsenal and Klinsmann will take over

It's not going to happen.


It's Arsenal away, it's not exactly an easy game to win at the best of times, his managerial tenure is far more likely to be affected by one of the lower teams coming away from the lane with all three points.

 

[Leeds Spur]

banged on will happen. mark my words

:ross:

 

[Leeds Spur]

Now you've changed the story, Harry.

How so? It's equivalent suggesting based on our recent 3 results we are heading for the Championship. Please - your initial comment was incorrect, with respect.



WBA, Everton and West Ham have only played 1 of the Top 3 teams

We have played all 3

We've had the tougest start by a mile

 

[ArcspacE]

We've had the tougest start by a mile

Don't let facst get in the way of a good 'ol smear campaign

 

[DHSF]

Which, in the long term, will probably have you finish above those teams worse than you and ahead of those better than you.

Great fun for a while, but will never see us compete with those at the top. Equally we can't keep uncovering a Modric or a Berbatov every few seasons either, so over time the best we can hope for is 4th (more likely 5th) with dips down a little until we uncover the next Modric/Berbatov.

Go and run about a bit is not a tactic. Neither is it an appropriate plan for anyone who thinks in longer terms than the next 5 minutes or about the general success of the club in general.

Go 'run around' was working for over three years. Yes yes we had a brick second half of last season due to a number of factors one of them is not spending in January (people said that was cos of Harry - well certain transfers this summer defies that belief)

By the way the past is the past im looking at this season solely - im not gonna be concerned with what happened in the past (although you do have to have some basis for comparison)

This season its two or three things. Its the lack of improvement in a progressive manner (we may hit teething problems and stumbling blocks) you expect to see the team evolve but the tactics have actually worsened and the team performances have become quite poor. AVB I think would help himself alot by not being so stubborn and changing things around not only mid game but at the start of the game

 

[scaramanga]

Go 'run around' was working for over three years. Yes yes we had a brick second half of last season due to a number of factors one of them is not spending in January (people said that was cos of Harry - well certain transfers this summer defies that belief)

Go run around kept us comfortably behind 3 clubs and now City are settling in, behind 4. If that's where you're happy then good for you - I know you're a similar age to me so neither of us have seen a Spurs team capable of winning the league since we were very young. I'd like to see it again some time.

 

[DHSF]

Go run around kept us comfortably behind 3 clubs and now City are settling in, behind 4. If that's where you're happy then good for you - I know you're a similar age to me so neither of us have seen a Spurs team capable of winning the league since we were very young. I'd like to see it again some time.

I havent seen us win the league and trust me the way im going we need to win the league within the next five years otherwise I wont see it haha. I would love us to win the League but I also want us in the CL competing and with some continuity we may have had that going forward (Anyways he has gone)

I dont want AVB fired but sometimes you do get the feeling that its not really a marriage made in heaven this. Its actually his stubbornness and his inability to change things during the game that is tinkling people. Barring two or three people who want him fired most on here are actually frustrated by how brick it is. The funny thing is theyre avoidable mistakes - defensive tactics, playing Dempsey, poor substitutions etc etc etc

The guy has time to change things but will his pride and ego allow him to do so? Time will tell