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The Defensive Midfielder

imcallingbullsh*t said:
I agree we need to protect the back 4 more, however disagree with the solution.
This weekend we needed Townsend to come back with Young, so walker could get closer with fellani and leave Dier in the centre.

If we had a DM he would have been out doing that job which would have just left holes in the centre.

Mason i am undecided if he is the solution, but we need that kind of player (Modric) in there and i wouldnt like to see him pushed out unless we are getting guaranteed quality. However we do not somebody to push him on, as physically i think he can improve
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I I can't dance with most of that to be honest, however why we expect Townsend to back up the FB when he has never done it is asking for trouble. Dier had the job of marking Fellini and to be honest I fully expected him to have problems with doing that and that is why we should have played Fazio ( imo).

A more defensive CM player would go where the danger is ( at least a good one will) and pick up where the runners are, we fail to do that and from my seat ( behind the goal) is obvious to me and those around me that we fail o track runners and it happens far to often.

As for Mason I am not sure he will push on ( I hope I am wrong).
 
NaijaSpurs said:
Indeed, he was breaking all kinds of goal scoring records as attacker in our under 18 team while the heck is playing as a defensive midfielder now?

He needs to be playing further up the pitch
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I think as back up he's okay in central midfield and he does what we need (distributes quickly) but long term he isn't what we need. Like you say, he's better attacking wise, I'd prefer him more up field, reminds me abit of Lallana and I'm sure he could provide a similar impact
 
United caused problems in part by bypassing our midfield and going directly to Fellaini. He found space quite well (as he does) and won physical duels (as he does), causing us a lot of problems. He's a very good player in that role when used correctly. Perhaps we were a bit naive in the first half, thought we did better in the second when our back 4 stayed organized and left Bentaleb to deal with Fellaini when United played long balls.

Their goals didn't come from them running straight through our midfield at all I thought. First goal Walker and Dier are giving away way too much space between them, I don't see how the midfield can be blamed for that. Second goal a set piece. Third goal a mistake by our midfield, but even then we have 4 players surrounding Rooney as she approaches and I honestly wouldn't want us to keep more players back than that when we're in possession.
 
NaijaSpurs said:
Indeed, he was breaking all kinds of goal scoring records as attacker in our under 18 team while the heck is playing as a defensive midfielder now?

He needs to be playing further up the pitch
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That's interesting. I'd like to see him further up the pitch too. Perhaps if Bentaleb were given the more dedicated DM role this would release Mason for more attacking forays against the likes of Leicester.
 
I was thinking it through during the game and couldn't quite tell what they should've done. I thought it either a case of narrowing the back four so that Walker stayed on Fellaini, leaving Young in space or shifting the back four so that Rose could double up with Jan to mark Rooney, allowing Dier to go tight to Fellaini.

Mason imo started ok, positioning himself to block off passing lanes as seen in the first goal, where he starts in a decent enough position. Watching Swansea last night, Neville and Carragher highlighted how well the Swansea midfield played in keeping the middle of the pitch under control. The narrow wall of 3 that was provided in front of the CB's effectively stopped all play through the middle. Sometimes I feel that Mason and Bentaleb have too much to do in that respect or that Chadli/Eriksen/Dembele don't fall back enough to fill in the spaces.
 
Once again a clear damnation of the quality of our midfield! Outplayed by f****** Villa!

Of all the 5 that started it is only Eriksen and possibly Bentaleb that should be starting next season. I honestly cannot stand to see Mason anymore - people slate Townsend but to me he is less effective. As for Chadli, has there been a player who promises so much and delivers so little.

This is sooo depressing!
 
parklane1 said:
Not suggesting for one minute we get rid of Bentaleb, as for Mason he is home grown but I really believe he is overhyped by some on here. However we need to protect our back four more, our CM is weak they may all be good players but they are open to runners, Eriksen can not tackle and the other two have blindspots which allows opposing players to run in behind them.
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Our biggest issue remains in those two 'wide' spots behind Kane (wide is, err, a 'wide' term but you know what I mean)...neither Eriksen/Chadli or Townsend are up to it. Lamela is OK simply because he does not lose the ball with the regularity either of those two do. Those are absolutely key positions for us, the high-press and maintaining good possession in those spots allows Bentaleb and Mason to read and move with more clarity.

Sadly today, on three occasions it was Bentaleb mopping up for the Cbs (and TBH I didn't think he had anywhere close to one of his better games) but again, for me anyway, our entire system collapses when Eriksen (Chadli) and Townsend don't work out. I actually think Chablis' presence today cost us a lot. But Poch needs to find that balance. Dare I say it (and a touch of hypocrisy about to flourish!) this was a perfect day for Eriksen Dembele Lamela with Kane up top. THAT side might've had more purpose?
 
The thing is, we have given Chadli and Townsend plenty of starts recently and neither has served up much of not in the last 4-5 games.
 
I've been saying it all season, mason is not good enough. Not close. People are mental! And further up the pitch? Have you seen his shooting?

We need an absolute quality central midfielder in the summer. I would go for steel, protect the back four, free up bentaleb to be kpre box to box.
 
I think Bentaleb has to stop giving away so many simple square or backwards passes. He seems to be doing it game after game lately, since Liverpool away. Mason also does this at times. They can still improve, but at the moment, there is a lack of both technical ability and good decision making all across the team. I think tiredness plays a part with these two young midfielders, because they haven't yet had a full season of top level football before this one. Hopefully, getting this season in the bank will go a long way to helping them find consistency for us.
 
Mason and Bentelab aren't the problem. It's the lazy farts in front who are

Yesterday the middle two won plenty of ball and passed it well enough. What did the 3 in front do other than balloon the ball over every time?

We need genuine quality in there for this system to flourish and we need players who are different. There all very samey and when there not playing well we just stop creating

We should have a go with erisken (our best player in that 3 by a mile even when playing bad) with Dembele and maybe Lamella as at least he puts a shift in
 
Maltese Falcon said:
They were outplayed by Fabian Delph! No further comment needed...
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I didn't think they were. I thought Deplh looked hi usual run around a lot self with his normal inability to pass.

I didn't think anyone for villa played particularly well. Benteke scored but looked like a carthorse for a lot of the game. Cleverley was probably their best player

The problem was the so called creative players created f£&ok all. Not sure how you can blame Mason and Bentelab for the lack of work/effort/quality from Erisken, Chadli and Townsend???
 
Looking at your original post when you started this @Maltese Falcon you mention Song as a player we should have gone for. I actually thought at the time that would have been a good move however he now (and since the turn of the year) has been the spammers worst player.

You also mention the need for a pacey winger IIRC . We don't have one anymore as the one we had is playing well for Everton.

I agree we need too play the ball better from the middle two (whatever you call them positions now) but when the players in front offer nothing and we don't have the pace to get behind the opposition were fudged. Upgrade the creative players with some variety and im sure we sill see the Mason/Bentelab pairing that dominated arsenal and Chelski (with dembeles help)
 
Bedfordspurs said:
I didn't think they were. I thought Deplh looked hi usual run around a lot self with his normal inability to pass.

I didn't think anyone for villa played particularly well. Benteke scored but looked like a carthorse for a lot of the game. Cleverley was probably their best player

The problem was the so called creative players created f£&ok all. Not sure how you can blame Mason and Bentelab for the lack of work/effort/quality from Erisken, Chadli and Townsend???
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But it's always that with us isn't it? Whenever we play a team we look down on and end up not having a decent shot on goal - whereas the opposition score, have a shot hit the post and miss another glorious opportunity thanks to a wonder save from our keeper and run riot every time they attack - it never because they played well or set up using the right formation & tactics, is it? It's always because we were not good enough.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Looking at your original post when you started this @Maltese Falcon you mention Song as a player we should have gone for. I actually thought at the time that would have been a good move however he now (and since the turn of the year) has been the spammers worst player.

You also mention the need for a pacey winger IIRC . We don't have one anymore as the one we had is playing well for Everton.

I agree we need too play the ball better from the middle two (whatever you call them positions now) but when the players in front offer nothing and we don't have the pace to get behind the opposition were fudgeed. Upgrade the creative players with some variety and im sure we sill see the Mason/Bentelab pairing that dominated arsenal and Chelski (with dembeles help)
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We will agree to disagree I suppose.

I don't think the Masaleb combo is good enough for us. One of them maybe but together they are not good enough when we dominate possession. We struggle against the so called lower teams because we have no creativity from the back starting with those two. Hence why I thought Song may have been an option.
 
We were toss and they played better than us. I wouldnt disagree with that but I don't think they played that well really. It helps if you let them play there game and let them disrupt ours (whatever that was meant to be)

They were also motivated whereas our team were thinking of sunnier climes

Where you genuinely impressed with anyone in the. Villa side yesterday?
 
Maltese Falcon said:
We will agree to disagree I suppose.

I don't think the Masaleb combo is good enough for us. One of them maybe but together they are not good enough when we dominate possession. We struggle against the so called lower teams because we have no creativity from the back starting with those two. Hence why I thought Song may have been an option.
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I thought Song would be too but looking at how poor he looks now I'd beg to differ

I'd like to see Tom Carroll given a chance in those games for us
 
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