Students

[Gilzeantoscore]

Learning from Poland ...... hahahahaha

Irrational ...... hmmm typical lefty response, if we're losing throw insults and no longer partake in argument.

Hail comrade

Poland have made big strides in student outcomes recently. Where did I personally address any comment towards you? Touchy:-k

 

[Gilzeantoscore]

Not sure how any of this would help with parental motivation.

Sorry quoted wrong post.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

Apparently Poland have been the big mover in academic performance in Europe over the last few years, so maybe there is something to be learnt from them. I'm not going to respond to irrational rants from those with an ideological axe to grind. Yeah every ones been to school, so we are all experts. Yeah, right!

How do the Poles go about teaching their pupils? I was under the impression that once the hugely impressive Gove's new measures had been implemented that we would rise up the league tables. A bit like how British sport was in the doldrums at the Olympics but once the was a greater attention to detail we improved.

 

[P.D.]

Give talks a good game and does seem intelligent but not sure I can agree with a lot of his policies. Seems to be going back in time and not noticing that culture and attitudes have changed. Basing a lot of his reasoning on Asian schools isn't the best idea, they stifle creativity, the arts and put insane pressure on students to succeed such that they have the highest rates of teenage suicide in the world. I do agree that there should be greater emphasis on the core subjects like maths, English and science but not with just exams. Coursework is an important part and having solely exams puts extra stress on pupils.

The free schools also seem to keep increasing without much attention being focused on them, not sure how setting your own curriculum is necessarily an advantage.

I'd also like to see more emphasis on languages so more people are fluent in additional languages. Seems like every time I travel lots of people I meet speak English but not vice versa. Its something I wish I'd focused on more.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

Give talks a good game and does seem intelligent but not sure I can agree with a lot of his policies. Seems to be going back in time and not noticing that culture and attitudes have changed. Basing a lot of his reasoning on Asian schools isn't the best idea, they stifle creativity, the arts and put insane pressure on students to succeed such that they have the highest rates of teenage suicide in the world. I do agree that there should be greater emphasis on the core subjects like maths, English and science but not with just exams. Coursework is an important part and having solely exams puts extra stress on pupils.

The free schools also seem to keep increasing without much attention being focused on them, not sure how setting your own curriculum is necessarily an advantage.

I'd also like to see more emphasis on languages so more people are fluent in additional languages. Seems like every time I travel lots of people I meet speak English but not vice versa. Its something I wish I'd focused on more.

English is the world's language so it is quite easy for some nations to focus on it. Last summer I was in France we travelled back through Belgium and Holland. Would be impossible to learn all those languages, my Latvian friends are lucky when they go to Germany and speak English to the hotel staff, the staff can tell they are not English so are impressed that they speak their mother tongue and English, where as we (English) have to speak every language or run the risk of being told we are not making an effort.

On Gove's reforms it seems something needs to be done if we are slipping down the league tables and employers are complaining that pupils are not even able to hand in C.V.'s without lots of spelling mistakes. The liberal wishy washy teaching techniques over the last couple of decades have not seen standards rise but fall, so it seems something really does need to be done.

It seems to me that when reform is needed in an industry or sector the is always some resistance to it with the usual candidates trying to sound like they are open to the reform by saying something like "I think we need some changes but I am not sure I agree with these changes" thus they can seem open to change while in actual fact they are dead against it and are quite closed minded. I see this in a lot of areas in life these days.

 

[RomanzoCriminale]

I couldn't believe it when i found out they didn't teach times tables as part of the curriculum in schools. I brought this up at a parents evening and my sons teacher said Labour had removed it but the government in power now were bringing them back.

Why the hell would you remove times tables???? dumbing down the nation, no wonder so many Businesses complain about the standard of graduates/school leavers.

 

[Gilzeantoscore]

The biggest stumbling block to education in the 21st century is the computer. If I was running education, I would allow IT as a discrete subject, but I would ban them from every other subject. They distract students from the task at hand, they provide short cut answers when deeper research is required and they are a barrier to decent literacy standards.

 

[Baleforce]

The biggest stumbling block to education in the 21st century is the computer. If I was running education, I would allow IT as a discrete subject, but I would ban them from every other subject. They distract students from the task at hand, they provide short cut answers when deeper research is required and they are a barrier to decent literacy standards.

I strongly disagree with that, computers are just a tool, they don't think for you, granted if you put garbage in you get garbage out, they are no more a distraction than anything else to a child not interested in the task at hand

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

That is very true,however no political party can do much about that.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/educ...en-disrespect-teachers-at-school-9505172.html

Looks like one party is trying to though. If you say parents not giving a sh*t is a problem for teachers then would you concede that someone trying to change that would be doing the right thing?

My son is in private school we are looking for a new one as we move from one side of sussex to the other. But in his current one and all the ones we know of, they despite being fee paying will happily exclude a child for poor behaviour. As parents we are made aware in the acceptance interviews of our responsibility to him, the school and the other children.

Anyway although I will not discuss politics I welcome anyone trying to help our poor over worked teachers life's that little bit easier.

 

[Gilzeantoscore]

In government schools, the attitudes of some parents have not just become apathetic towards their child's education, they are downright aggressive. Some refuse any sort of meaningful sanction for the little darlings and can be highly abusive towards teachers who seek to do something about their poor behaviour.

 

[Richie]

I think a lot of the problems when it comes to bad parenting stems from the big government approach. In our society whenever there is a problem it is expected that the government fix it. Its a case of 'something must be done, therefore the government must do something'. People are often unwilling to take responsibility.

Sadly a lot of this ends up at the teachers doorstop, where they are expected to raise the children aswell as teach them. There was a survey which said 1,600 pupils in primary school were still wearing nappies, a number of them couldn't use knifes and forks etc...

I don't have kids but I can't imagine any disciplinary situation where I would take my (hypothetical) childs side over that of a teacher, and if I did I wouldn't undermine the teacher by letting my kid know about it.

One of the reasons I think private schools have overwhelmingly superior results is that they can ask and expect a certain level from the parents as well as the students.

 

[Gilzeantoscore]

More often than not, the parent is seeking retribution, for their own 'traumatic' school experience. The other explanation is that they know in their heart of hearts that the problem is down to their own dysfunction and they don't want to acknowledge it.

 

[Baleforce]

at some point in the last 2 decades this country seemed to completely forget about personal responsibility, all the school and the teachers can (or should) be expected to do is be there

it's up to the parents to instil the value of education into their children

I have two, if they don't get a good education it will be 100% my fault

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

In government schools, the attitudes of some parents have not just become apathetic towards their child's education, they are downright aggressive. Some refuse any sort of meaningful sanction for the little darlings and can be highly abusive towards teachers who seek to do something about their poor behaviour.

So a minister trying to do something about that would be doing a good thing?

 

[Gilzeantoscore]

So a minister trying to do something about that would be doing a good thing?

A good start would be to withhold benefits from parents who refuse to send their children to school. Emphasis on the refuse!

 

[RomanzoCriminale]

More often than not, the parent is seeking retribution, for their own 'traumatic' school experience. The other explanation is that they know in their heart of hearts that the problem is down to their own dysfunction and they don't want to acknowledge it.

I'm not sure about the first point but the second i agree has a lot to do with it. That and the fact they want to mouth off and act the big one if anyone dare say anything about their beloved Ethan or Kylie. Someone once mentioned that there isn't really a lower, middle and upper class in this country anymore. I actually agree to an extent, although i would say there is a new class which is a scum class, that doesn't have any morals or believe they should have to work to get ahead in life. Its their children we should feel sorry for, they're being brought up without rules or respect. It must be hard to teach in this day and age, its sad really because the working class man used to always want to work hard to better himself and his family, isn't that where the middle classes were born from?

 

[chicken_badge]

In government schools, the attitudes of some parents have not just become apathetic towards their child's education, they are downright aggressive. Some refuse any sort of meaningful sanction for the little darlings and can be highly abusive towards teachers who seek to do something about their poor behaviour.

Spot on. And some kids know this.

 

[Craig_J]

In government schools, the attitudes of some parents have not just become apathetic towards their child's education, they are downright aggressive. Some refuse any sort of meaningful sanction for the little darlings and can be highly abusive towards teachers who seek to do something about their poor behaviour.

I finished school 4 years back and I agree with you that some parents don't do anywhere near enough. I've seen the 'chavy generation' (of which I was probably "Lead chav" yet still ended up at University!) do nothing for their children and accept no blame and merely kick of at teachers despite the fact they were doing nothing to discourage it.

But at the same time I went to a school in the bottom 80 of the whole country. They did nothing for the students and having someone lecture you for your tie being slightly lose whilst the head of the science department didn't mark anyones book over the course of the year didn't seem exactly fair to me. Thing is all the students critised the school, Ofsted criticised it, the parents criticised it, the parents criticised it yet at the same time they changed the school uniform every year thinking all of sudden we'd change into obdient, as you say "little darlings" but we could all sense the whole school was a joke. We laughed at the teachers like they were muppets, which they truly were. I stayed on for a year of 6th form and came out with three D's. Two years at A level got me BBC, better than I'd even got at my GCSE's.

The whole education system is messed up, there's no blaming just parents or just the schools. When you live in a top down society the blame should start from the top down. No sort of labour policy is adequate enough and neither is a Conservative "Lets take us back 50 years and hope for the best" policy. Small nations like Switzerland are wiping the floors with us in terms of education and our government has a lot to answer for.

 

[RomanzoCriminale]

I finished school 4 years back and I agree with you that some parents don't do anywhere near enough. I've seen the 'chavy generation' (of which I was probably "Lead chav" yet still ended up at University!) do nothing for their children and accept no blame and merely kick of at teachers despite the fact they were doing nothing to discourage it.

But at the same time I went to a school in the bottom 80 of the whole country. They did nothing for the students and having someone lecture you for your tie being slightly lose whilst the head of the science department didn't mark anyones book over the course of the year didn't seem exactly fair to me. Thing is all the students critised the school, Ofsted criticised it, the parents criticised it, the parents criticised it yet at the same time they changed the school uniform every year thinking all of sudden we'd change into obdient, as you say "little darlings" but we could all sense the whole school was a joke. We laughed at the teachers like they were muppets, which they truly were. I stayed on for a year of 6th form and came out with three D's. Two years at A level got me BBC, better than I'd even got at my GCSE's.

The whole education system is messed up, there's no blaming just parents or just the schools. When you live in a top down society the blame should start from the top down. No sort of labour policy is adequate enough and neither is a Conservative "Lets take us back 50 years and hope for the best" policy. Small nations like Switzerland are wiping the floors with us in terms of education and our government has a lot to answer for.

You were LEAD CHAV, how the hell did you find out did you have a competition :lol:

I was taught by some of the most horrible, arrogant, ignorant, disinterested ****ers that you could imagine and that was just the nuns (went to Catholic schools). History lessons consisted of a teacher either writing on a blackboard and you had to copy it, or he's put his feet up and tell you to copy out of a book. How the hell was that learning History..... There were a couple of great teachers though, the ones that actually showed they cared, wanted to build a rapport with the class. Don't remember laughing at the teachers though or calling them muppets, behind their backs maybe, we'd have got the pump, rubber pipe, cane or maybe just the blackboard rubber thrown at us. Still get laughs at a couple of my mates who were in the Spaz classes, they reckon they had all the best teachers who just let them toss it off though.

 

[Baleforce]

I finished school 4 years back and I agree with you that some parents don't do anywhere near enough. I've seen the 'chavy generation' (of which I was probably "Lead chav" yet still ended up at University!) do nothing for their children and accept no blame and merely kick of at teachers despite the fact they were doing nothing to discourage it.

But at the same time I went to a school in the bottom 80 of the whole country. They did nothing for the students and having someone lecture you for your tie being slightly lose whilst the head of the science department didn't mark anyones book over the course of the year didn't seem exactly fair to me. Thing is all the students critised the school, Ofsted criticised it, the parents criticised it, the parents criticised it yet at the same time they changed the school uniform every year thinking all of sudden we'd change into obdient, as you say "little darlings" but we could all sense the whole school was a joke. We laughed at the teachers like they were muppets, which they truly were. I stayed on for a year of 6th form and came out with three D's. Two years at A level got me BBC, better than I'd even got at my GCSE's.

The whole education system is messed up, there's no blaming just parents or just the schools. When you live in a top down society the blame should start from the top down. No sort of labour policy is adequate enough and neither is a Conservative "Lets take us back 50 years and hope for the best" policy. Small nations like Switzerland are wiping the floors with us in terms of education and our government has a lot to answer for.

so they got one real lesson into you at least, thats more than i learnt from my school, they were obsessed with curriculums and and facts