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Putin & Russia

Putin is KGB thug who has never got over being humiliated in East Germany by the Soviets just letting democracy to happen there and the eastern bloc. Its pay back time.
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
Bloody hell is the nothing your lot won't blame brexit for?

If you think brexit and by extension the British have any blame for this. Then you would have to admit that we historically have spent a lot of money in the defence of Europe through the cold War up to today.

Which is something that really should have been taken into account by our beloved friends in the EU but was not during negotiations. We have stationed in Poland and other Eastern European nations anti aircraft missiles.

Who else in the European Union is paying for the defence of the continent? The Germans have behaved appallingly as is their want. Not allowing RAF planes to fly over their air space. A temporary ban on a gas pipe line does not cut it either. They are the ones with the most trade in Europe with Russia so they can hurt them the most.

So Britain has to pay for the defence of Europe but we can trade on equal terms as the Canadians when it comes to trade with them. Hell they even offered better terms for financial trade to Ecuador then they have us(source the Telegraph) yet for some reason it down to us to defend them and partly our fault that Putin invaded.

Got a lot of respect for you @steff but if you really think we are even in the picture in this problem then you would have to concede the EU really needed to think about that during brexit negotiations.

Also how would brexit have made any difference to us wanting to kick Russia out of swift but the Germans, Dutch and a country I love but often behaves badly Italy did not want to kick them out.

Seen a few quotes recently how some of the Democrat Americans who thought we were stupid for Brexit are now starting to understand it more.

One of the issues with the EU are that it is to big and it's people have to many vested interests and different objectives for it to ever work as is being demonstrated with this crisis. The Germans care first and foremost about money. They will do a few things for show but not a lot else.

Also what if Macron gets his European army who would have the final veto on what it was sent to do? It would be a European army with I assume heavily reliant on French defence contracts sat on a beach somewhere while politicians argued what it could and could not do.
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I think what would help in your analysis of my comments is to understand the following.

1) My observations are not judging Brexit either way. That is ANOTHER comversation.

2) My observations are very binary. When an onlooker and potential adversary sees two parties mutually weaken, they are more likely to take advantage.

3) Putin has been actively destabilizing the US for years.

Mate. Try to look beyond this as 'another attack on Bulldog Bobby.' It is noting observation of a situation which is undeniable.

Again, the blame game is shared by many.
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
Bloody hell is the nothing your lot won't blame brexit for?

If you think brexit and by extension the British have any blame for this. Then you would have to admit that we historically have spent a lot of money in the defence of Europe through the cold War up to today.

Which is something that really should have been taken into account by our beloved friends in the EU but was not during negotiations. We have stationed in Poland and other Eastern European nations anti aircraft missiles.

Who else in the European Union is paying for the defence of the continent? The Germans have behaved appallingly as is their want. Not allowing RAF planes to fly over their air space. A temporary ban on a gas pipe line does not cut it either. They are the ones with the most trade in Europe with Russia so they can hurt them the most.

So Britain has to pay for the defence of Europe but we can trade on equal terms as the Canadians when it comes to trade with them. Hell they even offered better terms for financial trade to Ecuador then they have us(source the Telegraph) yet for some reason it down to us to defend them and partly our fault that Putin invaded.

Got a lot of respect for you @steff but if you really think we are even in the picture in this problem then you would have to concede the EU really needed to think about that during brexit negotiations.

Also how would brexit have made any difference to us wanting to kick Russia out of swift but the Germans, Dutch and a country I love but often behaves badly Italy did not want to kick them out.

Seen a few quotes recently how some of the Democrat Americans who thought we were stupid for Brexit are now starting to understand it more.

One of the issues with the EU are that it is to big and it's people have to many vested interests and different objectives for it to ever work as is being demonstrated with this crisis. The Germans care first and foremost about money. They will do a few things for show but not a lot else.

Also what if Macron gets his European army who would have the final veto on what it was sent to do? It would be a European army with I assume heavily reliant on French defence contracts sat on a beach somewhere while politicians argued what it could and could not do.
Click to expand...

Just to add a further answer to this specifically British related, you're absolutely right, Britain has been a mainstay of maintaining European peace and security...so now there has been a split (Brexit) Putin has acted.
 
Brexit has nothing to do with military capability or strategy. That's run off a British-French axis, with US puppetry. Britain always steered the EU away from military/to defer to NATO. If anything intra-EU military tensions are between French hawks and German doves.

Putin's timing is more to do with Germany joining America and the UK in having a weak leader. I.e it's Merkel's retirement that has enabled all this. She was the one leader Putin feared
 
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Aldo said:
Fifa has ordered Russia to complete their upcoming matches without their flag, anthem and as the Football Union of Russia in neutral territory, following the invasion of Ukraine.

Go FIFA, that’ll learn him…Putin must be soiling himself.
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Well he probably is. He just fired his main general.

As for FIFA, this is very weak tea, isn't it? Just throw them out and be done with it.
 
Lilbaz said:
All gdp is the measure of the size of an economy. People estimate it for the eu. Including the world bank.

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.CD?locations=EU
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GDP is the measure of domestic product (clue is in the title).
You can estimate for the EU as a cumulative indicator for the bloc, but that doesn't have any correlation to % spending of GDP from a NATO member as a commitment of membership.
And it certainly isn't GDP - it's just using that methodology as a equivalence.

So what exactly what the point of your post?
 
thfcsteff said:
I think what would help in your analysis of my comments is to understand the following.

1) My observations are not judging Brexit either way. That is ANOTHER comversation.

2) My observations are very binary. When an onlooker and potential adversary sees two parties mutually weaken, they are more likely to take advantage.

3) Putin has been actively destabilizing the US for years.

Mate. Try to look beyond this as 'another attack on Bulldog Bobby.' It is noting observation of a situation which is undeniable.

Again, the blame game is shared by many.
Click to expand...

Mainly by mainland European countries. Agree with the rest of your post though.
 
thfcsteff said:
Just to add a further answer to this specifically British related, you're absolutely right, Britain has been a mainstay of maintaining European peace and security...so now there has been a split (Brexit) Putin has acted.
Click to expand...

That is like me placing a lay bet when spurs ho a goal down to Burnley, good punting.

We still much to my dismay are actually a mainstay of European security, it was not used in brexit negotiations, except from the other side saying they might keep us out the loop. They changed their mind when apart from the odd sexedup dossier our intelligence is one thing we seem to do quite well.

Our troops are still on mainland Europe along with hardware. Even though as a now 'unfriendly nation" we don't even get the same trading conditions as Canada.

Infact even in this crisis we have done more and quicker then other European nations. So I politely disagree that brexit has had any impact really in this particular situation.

What has had an impact is some European nations and I expected it of the Germans but not the Dutch have thought about the impact on their finances before the Ukrainian people who just wanted self determination. But I'm not sure Europeans like the idea of self governance.
 
The EU is awesome!

What have we learnt? Essentially, that all empires are bad. Whether, China, the US or Russia, having such broad sweeping power causes problems. Empires try to shape things globally and abuse their dominance or misplace their influence. Small more localised nations do far better.

Russia would be far more stable broken up into smaller nations. But then you need international cooperation: free trade and a means to collaborate. To do things like allow phone roaming or to help people move around and live freely. To control corporate greed and to control pollution. How could you not like the EU? Smaller than Birmingham council and able to get 27 highly distinct nations working for common good. Mighty impressive.
 
SpurMeUp said:
The EU is awesome!

What have we learnt? Essentially, that all empires are bad. Whether, China, the US or Russia, having such broad sweeping power causes problems. Empires try to shape things globally and abuse their dominance or misplace their influence. Small more localised nations do far better.

Russia would be far more stable broken up into smaller nations. But then you need international cooperation: free trade and a means to collaborate. To do things like allow phone roaming or to help people move around and live freely. To control corporate greed and to control pollution. How could you not like the EU? Smaller than Birmingham council and able to get 27 highly distinct nations working for common good. Mighty impressive.
Click to expand...

Maybe not.

 
SpurMeUp said:
The EU is awesome!

What have we learnt? Essentially, that all empires are bad. Whether, China, the US or Russia, having such broad sweeping power causes problems. Empires try to shape things globally and abuse their dominance or misplace their influence. Small more localised nations do far better.

Russia would be far more stable broken up into smaller nations. But then you need international cooperation: free trade and a means to collaborate. To do things like allow phone roaming or to help people move around and live freely. To control corporate greed and to control pollution. How could you not like the EU? Smaller than Birmingham council and able to get 27 highly distinct nations working for common good. Mighty impressive.
Click to expand...

Under what definition is the EU not an empire? It's the most successful imperialism the world has seen since Roosevelt's 'Grand Area' and 'American economic Lebensraum' policy of the 40s.
 
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