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Politics, politics, politics

Dorothy said:
I don't ask to be seen as credible by you? I don't even know you and you don't know me. I try not to deal in generalisations. I do however gladly offer my opinion on something I know about in my local area. When I was in my local casualty, which is newly built and a vast improvement on the previous regional status quo, it was plain to see that there were people in there taking the fudgeing tinkle. People who for one reason or another had not bothered to consult their local GPs, who for some unknown reason didn't understand they or their kids had a heavy cold or flu. They to the man (bar of course those who were in there for alcohol related injuries) were belligerent, unpleasant, ill mannered and generally out of order. On our first visit we were seen relatively quickly, but then had to wait (not a problem, glad to have the resource) and sat fudgeing horrified at what we were seeing. I kid you not we even saw people keeping the car running at the drop of point, causing natural friction with the reception teams as they had clearly expected to be seen, served and supplied in that '15 minute window' I flippantly alluded to in another post. Were they the majority? No, of course not but they were the vocal majority and the only people causing the friction. Am I qualified to provide a visual IQ test? No, of course not and in the modern way I humbly apologise. Perhaps these people weren't ignorant, just troubled and severely let down by ermm 'millionaires' or 'posh' people.

A couple of years before I took my Grandmother, who had fallen down the stairs, and had what we believed to be a minor head injury to the local casualty (now torn down for housing - thank Deities). As a first aider (someone who took the time to learn...) I made a decision that I could use less resources and get her to the hospital safely, quicker than I could getting an ambulance. Everything went according to plan until I arrived at the Casualty department and found them poorly equipped, undermanned, in what we could consider 'dirty' conditions. A 95 year old lady was left to wait for hours. i was always polite, always mindful of the bigger picture. When the it was clear the first stage of care wasn't forthcoming I politely asked for the necessary supplies, was given them and treated my Grandmother's wounds. It was just a stop gap but she was alarmed that her clothing would be ruined and it caused her distress. Without going into any detail I was bizarrely asked in front of my Grandmother (when they eventually got her in a bed to assess her) whether we wanted her to be Awoken if she lost consciousness. I forget the terminology but others will be aware.

So I've seen both sides, I've seen failings both locally and previously in North London where I lived previously. I've been well aware of the need for change and improvement. All I can truthfully say is that the place that horrified so many of us is gone. A new hospital exists. The care, the professionalism, the investment is plain to see and so very welcome. I can't begin to try to account for how many people have been delighted at the care they have received. That is just my opinion, from the ground. It will be different for others and I'm sure some will have been let down as I felt I was a few years earlier but I've seen that the feedback given was taken on board and a difference is being made. I'm also very aware of how much it all costs. So I wonder why even in their perceived moment of need, others can't respect the NHS, respect the emergency services, the casualty departments and think about the bigger piciture. Those sort of people are one of two things. They are clams or they are uneducated and in need of a bit of a steer.
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Ha, ha. "You don't know me..." Oh the irony. You didn't know the people in the Emergency Department either, but it didn't prevent you from making snide judgements about them. One rule for you and another for every one else. Another typical Tory (or worse attitude.) "I try not to deal in generalizations..." You had better try harder methinks.
 
Richie said:
I'm in a similar situation, although my seat is far from safe which is making me really consider my vote. I think the gay marriage issue is much ado about nothing, I really believe Cameron introduced it because it's a issue he cared about, he should be lauded for putting forth a law that could alienate him from his own core vote. If nothing else Cameron deserves a lot of credit for the gay marriage bill, he could easily have left it to a later parliament.

I completely agree over the "snoopers charter" though, and I'm pretty strongly opposed to anything this government has to say about the internet. The Libertarian in me really struggles with the dismantling of civil liberties that has occurred over the last 15 years. Props to the Lib Dems in Coalition, there have been a few things I've been glad to see them block.

The only party I'm certain not to vote for is Labour (or Greens). I like the Lib Dems on many social issues but they aren't tough enough economically, and Conservatives have got it as close to correct on economic policy but some of their policies on privacy are worrisome.

As UKIP, I generally agree with their ambitions like leaving the EU, but for different reasons. I have no issue with immigration, but I hate the bureaucracy associated with the EU.

Then it comes down to candidates, and my local Tory MP follows the party whip a little too often for my liking, rebelling in only 6 out of over 1000 votes this parliament. I struggle to trust someone who follows the party line so blindly, give me the chance and I'd vote for David Davis or Zac Goldsmith any day of the week.

I'm certain I'm either going Tory, UKIP, or spoiling my ballot. I've got a few months to make up my mind.
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We're in a fairly similar boat other than the safety of our seats.

I wish David Davis had become leader of the party as so many thought he would. I don't particularly dislike Cameron and I think he's done pretty well with a difficult job but I can't throw the weight of my support behind him the way I could Davis. I've made that clear to the party through reduced donations, but I sincerely doubt they'll notice my drop in the ocean.
 
Gilzeantoscore said:
Ha, ha. "You don't know me..." Oh the irony. You didn't know the people in the Emergency Department either, but it didn't prevent you from making snide judgements about them. One rule for you and another for every one else. Another typical Tory (or worse attitude.) "I try not to deal in generalizations..." You had better try harder methinks.
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Nothing really 'snide' about the comments. They were actually quite clear and direct. You would be amazed at what you learn about people over a few hours in a casualty waiting room. Especially from those happy to broadcast their stories repeatedly at the desk for all to hear. A generalisation would be suggesting that this is the only reason casualty departments have long queues. Pointing out that on each occasion there were a veritable army of fudgewits being ignorant, rude and wasting people's time, isn't generalisation at all. It is a sad fact.

Speak to those that work in these departments and you will hear all about it. In the same way that often up to half the cases you'd see on a Friday night will be booze related.

Many of those complaining repeatedly, kicking off, mouthing off hadn't grasped that on the other wide of the casualty department was a corridor that had a steady stream of people being brought in on gurneys straight out of the ambulances. Most of them not looking very well at all. I deduced these people were ignorant but perhaps they were just shortsighted.

I certainly don't think I have any right to use public services more than anyone else using them for their intended purpose. I'm glad they are there, I@m glad they are improving and I understand the challenges they face, considering our population is only increasing. I also didn't have too much choice on where I ended up considering I was unconscious when they carted me away in an ambulance or the time I wasn't accompanying a 95 year old woman with cracked ribs and a head injury who had fallen down the stairs.

It is actually one rule for everyone but you will always have some within society who just do as they please or are incapable of understanding the rules. You'll also have those who know full well what they are doing but think that they are somehow immune. ;) Considering you appear not to deal in reality and don't understand the issues that casualty departments deal with on a day to day basis, I'd expect nothing more than to be labelled by you. :)
 
So in a nutshell there are 2 proper parties, red and blue. Labour's economic policy would absolutely and fundamentally cripple the country (e.g. build lots of shiny things, staffed by new jobs, who cares who will pay for it?) whereas the other lot, won't.

The end. Every other issue is insignificant in comparison.
 
Bullet said:
So in a nutshell there are 2 proper parties, red and blue. Labour's economic policy would absolutely and fundamentally cripple the country (e.g. build lots of shiny things, staffed by new jobs, who cares who will pay for it?) whereas the other lot, won't.

The end. Every other issue is insignificant in comparison.
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Unfortunately people who aren't very bright tend to have difficulty in dealing with delayed gratification. Those dim people have votes that are equal to yours and mine.

Take a look at recent polls to see that people think the current cost of living is as important or more than the state of the economy.
 
Bullet said:
So in a nutshell there are 2 proper parties, red and blue. Labour's economic policy would absolutely and fundamentally cripple the country (e.g. build lots of shiny things, staffed by new jobs, who cares who will pay for it?) whereas the other lot, won't.

The end. Every other issue is insignificant in comparison.
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how do you add multiple likes on here?
 
Dorothy said:
Nothing really 'snide' about the comments. They were actually quite clear and direct. You would be amazed at what you learn about people over a few hours in a casualty waiting room. Especially from those happy to broadcast their stories repeatedly at the desk for all to hear. A generalisation would be suggesting that this is the only reason casualty departments have long queues. Pointing out that on each occasion there were a veritable army of fudgewits being ignorant, rude and wasting people's time, isn't generalisation at all. It is a sad fact.

Speak to those that work in these departments and you will hear all about it. In the same way that often up to half the cases you'd see on a Friday night will be booze related.

Many of those complaining repeatedly, kicking off, mouthing off hadn't grasped that on the other wide of the casualty department was a corridor that had a steady masked water tyrant of people being brought in on gurneys straight out of the ambulances. Most of them not looking very well at all. I deduced these people were ignorant but perhaps they were just shortsighted.

I certainly don't think I have any right to use public services more than anyone else using them for their intended purpose. I'm glad they are there, I@m glad they are improving and I understand the challenges they face, considering our population is only increasing. I also didn't have too much choice on where I ended up considering I was unconscious when they carted me away in an ambulance or the time I wasn't accompanying a 95 year old woman with cracked ribs and a head injury who had fallen down the stairs.

It is actually one rule for everyone but you will always have some within society who just do as they please or are incapable of understanding the rules. You'll also have those who know full well what they are doing but think that they are somehow immune. ;) Considering you appear not to deal in reality and don't understand the issues that casualty departments deal with on a day to day basis, I'd expect nothing more than to be labelled by you. :)
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The comment regarding generalizations was aimed at your comment re the under educated and unemployed, not the state of emergency departments. What the hell is a "steady masked water tyrant of people?" WTF?
 
Bullet said:
So in a nutshell there are 2 proper parties, red and blue. Labour's economic policy would absolutely and fundamentally cripple the country (e.g. build lots of shiny things, staffed by new jobs, who cares who will pay for it?) whereas the other lot, won't.

The end. Every other issue is insignificant in comparison.
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How and why?

Institutions in the financial sector being allowed to do what they like (by a Labour government, cheer-led by Tory opposition here, and by Republicans cheer-led by Democrats in USA) crashed the World Economy around 2008. It wasn't the sole work of a Labour Government (but they played their part).

Labour voted through Tory austerity spending recently, did they not? IIRC, they want to cut spending, but do so more slowly and perhaps in different areas. Surely there's not such a huge difference there that the country will be crippled as a result?

The difference, as I see it, is that under Labour, the worst off in society will be a little less worse off, and the most well off will be a little less well off. I think this is what most people see, which might be why Labour has been ahead in the polls, despite losing core voters (especially losing them in Scotland). It's all very bland, but maybe that's a good thing.
 
the dza said:
The difference, as I see it, is that under Labour, the worst off in society will be a little less worse off, and the most well off will be a little less well off. I think this is what most people see, which might be why Labour has been ahead in the polls, despite losing core voters (especially losing them in Scotland). It's all very bland, but maybe that's a good thing.
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The difference is that Labour aim to give the poor a larger slice of the pie (seeing as they refuse to put numbers on anything I'll reserve judgement).

The problem is that they're very likely to make the pie smaller in doing so - therefore making everyone worse off.
 
Good to know that the Labour leader has absolutely no understanding of the tax system. His latest smear campaign is to accuse anyone related to the Conservative Party (i.e. those who have previously funded it) of tax avoidance. Ermm.. Ed there is nothing wrong with avoiding tax, it is both entirely legal, totally moral and has just made you look like a fudging clown. An ISA is tax avoidance, as would any gift you survive by 7 years. I think what the 'potential' leader is trying to refer to is 'tax evasion' i.e. hiding your money from the tax man. Anyone worried that this arseclown doesn't know the difference. Does Ed Milliband have an ISA? I'd expect so. Is he a Tax Avoider. Yes he would most certainly be. What a total bell.
 
Dorothy said:
Good to know that the Labour leader has absolutely no understanding of the tax system. His latest smear campaign is to accuse anyone related to the Conservative Party (i.e. those who have previously funded it) of tax avoidance. Ermm.. Ed there is nothing wrong with avoiding tax, it is both entirely legal, totally moral and has just made you look like a fudgeing clown. An ISA is tax avoidance, as would any gift you survive by 7 years. I think what the 'potential' leader is trying to refer to is 'tax evasion' i.e. hiding your money from the tax man. Anyone worried that this arseclown doesn't know the difference. Does Ed Milliband have an ISA? I'd expect so. Is he a Tax Avoider. Yes he would most certainly be. What a total bell.
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I am more concerned that the are a lot of MP's that do not know the difference between deficit and debt. They talk like that once the deficit is gone everything will be rosy, when the will still be massive amount of work to do to get the debt levels to an amount where by we are not paying more interest on them then we are the whole of the defence budget.

But yes Millbland concerns me when he talks.
 
Most of them are a concern. :) It is worrying though that there are genuinely some people out there of moderate intelligence who would invite these pretend socialists back into the fold after what they presided over last time. It is akin to getting a tradesman back in to your home to do some more work after he shat on your carpet on the last week. What has changed? The people at the helm look even less likely to be able to lead or manage the country than the last bunch who were shown to be fudging hopeless. I've always felt that the best approach lies in coalition governments. Perhaps I see it from a more utopian perspective rather than what we are forced into via our current system.

As for talk of one group lying and another not. Wow. :eek: They all lie, it is part of the job. Look past that, look past the obvious attempts at smearing, the SPIN and look at the real numbers. Look at the markets, look at the general confidence. Are people investing? Is unemployment coming down? How is education looking? What about the NHS? Crime? What has happened in the house market? People don't appear to be having to work as hard as the last Labia government had to to SPIN what was quite obviously flimflam.

Of course, there is so much to work on. So much to improve upon. Things that will take generations and must not be ignored if we are to compete on the world stage. We still have far to many employers in the UK at the lower end of the scale far happier to employ foreign workers because they are harder working, more reliable and do a better job. That is a crying shame for us and fabulous for those who come here to work. Ok, not all the money will stay here but why would anyone earn and leave when the economic situation is still far more favourable in the UK. I know guys who said they can earn here in a day what they would earn in a week back home.
 
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