K.D.D.D.D.Soc
Ian Walker
Anyone going to Jezza's farewell do?
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Politics, politics, politics
- Thread starter markysimmo
- Start date
Hotshot-Tottenham
Edgar Davids
It seems so.
I really, really hope he stays.
He's been the best thing to happen to politics in this country for a while - shown the Labour Party up for what they really are.
Watson might be a decent replacement in that regard, I can just see his IRA quotes on the front pages in the run up to the next election.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
They are the kind of tossers who once they get a smell of the barmaids apron act like that all the time, Its just newsworthy to some at this present time.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
No they are probably tossers all the time, but at the moment they are newsworthy to some.
Hotshot-Tottenham
Edgar Davids
But why is it newsworthy at the present time?
What's made it relevant? What has changed? What is different from last week?
There must be something...
I'll be voting for him again, against whatever 'inspirational' figure that the PLP put up. They've been out for him from the beginning, pure opportunism to try and turn the referendum result against him.
Let the PLP put up a candidate and let's get on with it and get the votes done and counted.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
Indeed, someone trying to make a point?
Precisely. Just being newsworthy does not make it the cause.
Rorschach
Sonny Walters
Bloke was American, wasn't he?
Braindead little pi.ssants.
LutonSpurs
Eric Dear
What do people think of Anna Soubry as Tory leader?
thfcsteff
George Hunt
I disagree. He is the Prime Minister! You cannot say his only bargaining chip was the threat of leaving! You don't get yourself re-elected off the back of promising a referendum, that's a good start. Of course nobody believed he'd leave - he didn't want to! - so to throw the dice the way he did was a roostertail of arrogant and irresponsible. I am not privvy to these meetings (!!!
) however I have to wonder whether if finding Old Junker to be particularly inflexible and egregious, he couldn't have gone directly to the Dutch, Germans and French to articulate his fears of UKIP-fueled anger and advise that concessions might well prevent the union itself from imploding. He had less to lose taking a longer-term softly-softly approach than throwing the dice like he did...unless his motivations for throwing said-dice had as much to do with his own party turmoils as anything else?!!!!
thfcsteff
George Hunt
I hadn't read your post yet agree and feel/said something similar. The point of timing is vital, as is the point about his own popularity being on the wane. He tried to win it all by showing he 'cared' with the referendum, yet did not do enough work to win it as he believed it wasn't in doubt. He further tried to tame his own party with it,and blew that one too. Perhaps he should take over the national team, seems qualified for it.
Not in a million years. I've seen her get shown up badly on a couple of occasions on Question Time.
I would go for Andrea Leadsom tbh. I was very impressed with how she conducted herself during the run up to the referendum on the different debates she was involved in and would definitely be backing her if she is in the race.
Outside of the main hopefuls I would actually be very pleased to see David Davis have a run at the top job but I suspect that he would feel too old now at 68, too outside the populist parliamentary bubble and probably still quite disappointed at how his leadership campaign turned out in 2005.
thfcsteff
George Hunt
It is an interesting read with many valuable points, specifically when dealing with cultural homogenization and the creation of a single 'state' which can the be manipulated more easily. Of course, the truth is that the easiest way to manipulate is via oil and fear (not together!), thus for decade upon decade, one or the other has been the primary tool behind world movements and events. Whilst I do not believe all Brexiters were simply manipulated by 'fear of foreigners', the majority were most certainly invested in 'what about me/what's best for me' thinking. The same thinking that allowed Thatcher to privatise many things in the UK and sell-off many others, the same thinking that allowed Bliar to land his body blows 'for progress' (the ones which actually further decimated large areas of the population, the same ones which ended up Brexiting).
"Those in the mainstream who seek to dismiss the suffering of the English, Greek, or Spanish working classes as far-right bias or provincial ignorance are dangerous people with vested interests in corruption and inequality, whether they have the personal intellect to realise it or not."
I agree with this, furthermore, I would be farmer relaxed about the result if there was some element of 'future plan' about Brexit. What IS the future? How WILL we negotiate? These are worthy questions that should've been available before the vote, if only so as Brexiters could have something to say they stood for other than 'immigration issues' and 'had enough of being controlled by a bureaucracy'...
Who are the altruists entrusted to lead Britain in a post-Brexit era? Johnson? Farage? Neither suggest a particular penchant for looking after the impoverished and ignored more than satisfying their own personal motivations.
Sorry, the cold, hard truth is that immigration and jobs were the two major platforms which forced the Brexit through. Of course not every Brexiter is a racist, that's pathetic, that's like saying every Arsenal fan is a clam - wait a minute, bad example!!!
- that's like saying every remain voter is a young, über rich city person. But (IMO) make no mistake - the Brexit WAS sold to people on the fence as the only way to get away from levels of immigration those specific voters felt was unacceptable, and to re-deliver those jobs back to them. Along with that 350 million a week back in our pockets, but hey, none of us believed that line!!!!!!!!What we want to hope is when the portion of Brexiters who DID vote Brexit for those reasons discover that there is no instant-answer to their demands, that the 'change' doesn't happen as quick as a bag of microwave popcorn, that they don't start to really cause disharmony and problems. Because it could well happen. Of course I hope not, but we shall see. In the meantime, look forward to a few years of people looking curiously at us wherever we go, unable to understand why we don't want to 'be' with them. Because whatever the reality, that is the perception...and in a twitter/social media world, the perception, the shouted message, the 140 character-driven 'manifesto', is the 'truth'!
milo
Jack L. Jones
Like so many of Cameron's decisions, I think that it was short termist. I think that he made the offer of a referendum to deal with the immediate problem of defections to UKIP and keeping Eurosceptic MPs in line, thinking that he would not get an overall majority at the last election and could then jettison it in coalition talks.
Glenda's Legs
Paul Walsh
Watching the news coverage of yesterday's events in Brussels one thing was abundantly clear (though not necessarily unknown) - what a total d*ck Nigel Farage is. Arrogant crowing and insults were not what was needed. Fortunately he is not part of our government so I trust he will be kept a million miles away from our negotiations.
AuroRaman
Chris Armstrong
It is an interesting read with many valuable points, specifically when dealing with cultural homogenization and the creation of a single 'state' which can the be manipulated more easily. Of course, the truth is that the easiest way to manipulate is via oil and fear (not together!), thus for decade upon decade, one or the other has been the primary tool behind world movements and events. Whilst I do not believe all Brexiters were simply manipulated by 'fear of foreigners', the majority were most certainly invested in 'what about me/what's best for me' thinking. The same thinking that allowed Thatcher to privatise many things in the UK and sell-off many others, the same thinking that allowed Bliar to land his body blows 'for progress' (the ones which actually further decimated large areas of the population, the same ones which ended up Brexiting).
"Those in the mainstream who seek to dismiss the suffering of the English, Greek, or Spanish working classes as far-right bias or provincial ignorance are dangerous people with vested interests in corruption and inequality, whether they have the personal intellect to realise it or not."
I agree with this, furthermore, I would be farmer relaxed about the result if there was some element of 'future plan' about Brexit. What IS the future? How WILL we negotiate? These are worthy questions that should've been available before the vote, if only so as Brexiters could have something to say they stood for other than 'immigration issues' and 'had enough of being controlled by a bureaucracy'...
Who are the altruists entrusted to lead Britain in a post-Brexit era? Johnson? Farage? Neither suggest a particular penchant for looking after the impoverished and ignored more than crack covering their own personal motivations.
Sorry, the cold, hard truth is that immigration and jobs were the two major platforms which forced the Brexit through. Of course not every Brexiter is a racist, that's pathetic, that's like saying every Arsenal fan is a clam - wait a minute, bad example!!!
What we want to hope is when the portion of Brexiters who DID vote Brexit for those reasons discover that there is no instant-answer to their demands, that the 'change' doesn't happen as quick as a bag of microwave popcorn, that they don't start to really cause disharmony and problems. Because it could well happen. Of course I hope not, but we shall see. In the meantime, look forward to a few years of people looking curiously at us wherever we go, unable to understand why we don't want to 'be' with them. Because whatever the reality, that is the perception...and in a twitter/social media world, the perception, the shouted message, the 140 character-driven 'manifesto', is the 'truth'!
Thank you
glasgowspur
Luka Modric
With the voting public having gone from apathy to some semblance of decent participation numbers I think I prefer the apathy.
The amount of people walking about proud of themselves because they've "given the politicians a bloody nose" is amazing. Maybe if you had exercised your vote in the past the politicians wouldn't have needed a bloody nose. By not voting you have given them the mandate for doing what they want.
I've watched two referendums tear the country apart in the last two years for nothing but vague, empty unfulfillable promises.
With little fact to back up either side they have been nothing but a choice between scare tactics or too good to be true options. Surely we can do and should demand better than this.
Oh and one more thing, where is this Scotland that you keep pontificating about from the moral high ground Ms Sturgeon?
Show me this all welcoming (unless your Catholic or Protestant depending on preference)Scotland , these warm Scots extending their hands to everyone, unless you're English if course.
Rant over, I feel better now.
The amount of people walking about proud of themselves because they've "given the politicians a bloody nose" is amazing. Maybe if you had exercised your vote in the past the politicians wouldn't have needed a bloody nose. By not voting you have given them the mandate for doing what they want.
I've watched two referendums tear the country apart in the last two years for nothing but vague, empty unfulfillable promises.
With little fact to back up either side they have been nothing but a choice between scare tactics or too good to be true options. Surely we can do and should demand better than this.
Oh and one more thing, where is this Scotland that you keep pontificating about from the moral high ground Ms Sturgeon?
Show me this all welcoming (unless your Catholic or Protestant depending on preference)Scotland , these warm Scots extending their hands to everyone, unless you're English if course.
Rant over, I feel better now.