ricky2tricky4city
Paul Stewart
It's the culture wars, innit.
-
Dear Guest, Please note that adult content is not permitted on this forum. We have had our Google ads disabled at times due to some posts that were found from some time ago. Please do not post adult content and if you see any already on the forum, please report the post so that we can deal with it. Adult content is allowed in the glory hole - you will have to request permission to access it. Thanks, scara
Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)
- Thread starter SpurMeUp
- Start date
thfcsteff
Sonny Walters
It would be great if people looked to be better than what they're allowed to be mate.
I'm not going to highlight individual posts and posters for this, not that it would be that difficult. I agree with Finney - if you don't that's cool, no biggie....
Fair enough. I was just looking to learn
People are more offended at being called a bellend than being accused of bigotry. But OK I'll hear you big bro
I did years of being nice when I was baited. Kind of had enough. But if you find me calling you names here and there unpalatable then tell me. I won't.
Silly McSilly Face
Andy Sinton
Rich people pay more tax than anyone else, quick google, 2023 to 2024 tax year:
Income tax revenue:
- top 1% of earners pay c. 30% of all income tax, a percentage that is at its highest level in 20 years.
- top 10% of earners pay c. 60% of all income tax.
- the top 0.1% of earners pay more income tax than the bottom 50% of earners combined.
Fairness:
The top 1% share of total income is c. 13% but they pay 30% of all income tax.
Those earning over £200k a year or holding over £2 million in assets paid 25% of all UK tax revenue from personal taxes (including income tax).
Moving on to discuss the green's wealth tax policies, wealth taxes are almost always bad and never achieve what they set out to achieve. Many countries that implemented them have withdrawn them.
In terms of the Green's proposed tax of 1% on all assets above £10 million, to see how much the devil would be in the detail of this policy and how potentially unworkable it would be, i will just discuss the issue of how you'd deal with shares in a limited company:
I am Mr A. I have set up a new business using inheritance of £100k and a bank loan of another £100k.
I incorporate a limited company, A Limited, which issue to me 100 ordinary shares with a fully paid up value of £1 a share.
After a number of years the business has taken off. I am managing to pay myself a director's salary of £100K a year and dividends of £50k a year. I employ 15 people full time.
I receive an offer from a large business in my sector to buy the business for £20 million. I reject the offer because i want to continue growing the business and i get my own valuation done that values the business at £30 million. My ownership of the business still manifests itself as 100 £1 ordinary shares.
How are you treating Mr A's ownership of A Limited for the purposes of this wealth tax?
If it is wealth of £100 then the wealth tax is completely worthless and will easily be avoided.
If it is £30 million, then you are asking Mr A to find £300K when he only earns £150K. Even if he scrapes the money together HMRC will be back for another £300K the next year.
You have totally disincentivised business and growth...
thfcsteff
Sonny Walters
Oh I get your point there for sure mate, and equally think the initial point you made was sadly accurate. I just wish the world would strive for better.
I am old-fashioned in that sense; I still send texts with 'hi hope all is well', 5 words most people consider absolutely unnecessary in a text LOL!
Put it this way, when Roy Keane said 'no' is a sentence, it blew my mind hahahaha...
thfcsteff
Sonny Walters
I know you've copped it too many times. And absolutely, I get that you're reaching a limit with regards to tolerance.
On a general point I was saying it is a shame that we are here. As you know I avoided this specific area of the forum for a long time because discussion was not happening. It was baiting and reaffirmation of set positions.
I dipped back in and am thinking it might be time to dip back out again. @ricky2tricky4city offered some good advice my way earlier that got me thinking.
Stay strong my friend, stay strong. And yeah, wherever possible, take the lift to the upper floors
I know you've copped it too many times. And absolutely, I get that you're reaching a limit with regards to tolerance.
On a general point I was saying it is a shame that we are here. As you know I avoided this specific area of the forum for a long time because discussion was not happening. It was baiting and reaffirmation of set positions.
I dipped back in and am thinking it might be time to dip back out again. @ricky2tricky4city offered some good advice my way earlier that got me thinking.
Stay strong my friend, stay strong. And yeah, wherever possible, take the lift to the upper floors
Appreciated.
Leaving aside the continued kicks to the head, I still question how kicking someone in their body and standing on their back (on their rucksack) is the wisest course of action when you believe the person might be concealing an explosive device (as Mark Rowley explicitly said was the case here).
But it seems that’s accepted practice.
Silly McSilly Face
Andy Sinton
The capital gains tax is a tax you need to be really careful with, as it is a tax on positive investment outcomes and investment is what you need to keep happening for the economy to function.
Its a tax that is part of a whole environment where you are essentially trying to remain competitive internationally. Decisions such aa where to base your European headquarters, which global stock market should i list on...which stocks should i invest in...these decisions are all impacted by things like the capital gains tax rate.
Income is more guaranteed, whereas capital gains are often punts that have worked out. They are returns on sometimes risky investments and for every gain there will also be losses. The tax is set lower comparatively to reflect that and no to disincentivise investing.
Uk companies raise money by issuing stocks, and other assets to market for investors to purchase. If they are able to do so less and less because investors are going elsewhere to other markets in other countries as the conditions are unfavourable in the UK then you are going to get a diminishing economy or even a crash.
On business rates and council tax, these are local authority taxes that raise money for local services. There are national land taxes e.g. SDLT for land and property transactions.
Finney Is Back
Paul Stewart
Where have I tried to stifle debate?
To me reading the comment “
‘Finney and Silly are world experts on tasers bro. Don't question it ffs lol”
Would suggest to me that you want to stifle (or at least belittle) anyone who had a different opinion to you…. But to each their own.
I took that back pal.
Finney Is Back
Paul Stewart
The first one of those would discourage investment and perhaps also lower asset values in this country.
What do you mean by merging NI into income tax?
How would your land value tax work? Who values the land? How does the charge get paid? How does it get distributed? Does all land tax raised in e.g. Hackney go to Hackney council?
Rent caps work how exactly? Would your rent cap drive landlords away from the market do you think?
Last edited:
Finney Is Back
Paul Stewart
Who are the ‘parasite class’?
MartyFunkhouser
George Hunt
Rent should be capped to a % over the mortgage IMO. Multiple home owning is an issue but its here. What it shouldn't be is a license to drive renters out the market by making absence profit at their demise
Finney Is Back
Paul Stewart
Do you rent property out @MartyFunkhouser?
What percentage over the mortgage should it be capped at? And by that do you mean ‘mortgage rates’…. So I assume base rate?
What percentage of the property should be the mortgage be considered on? I assume 100% of it?
if a property is worth £320k and base rate is 3.75%, that is £1,000 a month of interest. How much money should a landlord be allowed to make?
If the base rate goes up then does the rent automatically go up?
Also what does ‘absence profit at their demise’ mean?
Last edited:
Finney Is Back
Paul Stewart
Ah yes, apologies, I see that you did indeed take it back after you’d been pulled up by @Rafa87, though even then you left Silly out, further emphasising my point really.
So back to the other part of my post, where have I tried to stifle debate?
MartyFunkhouser
George Hunt
No, I have moved up the scale and sold up when I have had the chance, living abroad also meant I had less appetite to do so.
But I will give you a scenario rather than thrash out mechanics on here that mean little. My first one bedroom flat was on a mortgage of £580 a month, nice little place in Chafford Hundred, if I decided to rent that property out and not sell (for a profit I may add) and move up the ladder I could have rented it out for neat £900 a month. Now I might sound like I have has too much smashed avocado for breakfast but I had no interest in that and what I see still to the day as a poor loaded society that has the ability to push down on people needing a roof over their heads who earn less. Also given I had the opportunity to make a profit on the place (I grant its timing but that was my risk not a renters) I don't see it as very ethical to make double profit only for people who need a chance to not get that chance.
With 2m+ double home owners in the country, that's a lot of inventory being used and outpricing people in need of a home whose salary is being swallowed up by the increased cost of living.
I have a fairly solvent business now and I do ok and I am feeling it every day even with a modest living and taste in life. GHod knows how others are doing it out there in the market where there is A limited inventory on the market and B rents are unbelievably high now for poor quality, lets alone the choices on life such as food and fuel.
The wealth gap in this country is get wider and wider, the have and have not, I am glad to see on here there are still some people who want to see that gap reduced, maybe we are all dreamers, but I take that every day than what seems to be a trend in this country of continuously punching down on the classes.
Last edited:
This never happened. You misinterpreted it. Or made it up. Maybe it wasn't to stifle debate buy you seemed bothered by the discussion.
Epstein class. The billionaires. What you looking for here?
I see Farage chickened out of appearing on Laura Kuenssberg's programme this morning. (£)5 million reasons why?
He's a typical bully who's happy to give it large but can't/won't accept scrutiny himself.
Then again politically it was probably an astute move as the flak he'll get for not appearing will be far, far less than the bad press from the clips that would have been shown after being questioned about this 'gift'.
He's a typical bully who's happy to give it large but can't/won't accept scrutiny himself.
Then again politically it was probably an astute move as the flak he'll get for not appearing will be far, far less than the bad press from the clips that would have been shown after being questioned about this 'gift'.