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Next seasons squad

Bedfordspurs said:
But when he played we did score a lot of goals. So the player suited the manager and the system, no?
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Ange's system tends to score lots of goals regardless of who is playing. We scored 10 more goals the season before Solanke joined. So it doesn't really ring true that he was a perfectly suited player when he didn't contribute more than what we had previously and we paid for that privilege.
 
Bishop said:
Ange's system tends to score lots of goals regardless of who is playing. We scored 10 more goals the season before Solanke joined. So it doesn't really ring true that he was a perfectly suited player when he didn't contribute more than what we had previously and we paid for that privilege.
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The season before we had the best striker on the planet and peak son
Ange didn’t have them
But I get where you want to go here
If you can’t buy the best create a way of playing to get results
That’s what I’ve seen from RDZ in his brief tenure so far
Will Solanke be part of that… I don’t know
 
I feel there is money to be made with outgoings for a change.

Vicario - £20m
Romero - £60m
Dragusin - £20m
Davies - £0
Bissouma - £0
Sarr - £18m
Richie - £40m (£50m if its to Saudi)
Solanke - £25m
Scarlett - £3m
Thats £190m with this lot

Others who could potentially be sold
Porro - £45m
Spence - £30m
Bergval - £35m

I can’t see us selling all of these and i think it will either be Richie or Solanke and not both. Add the £150m ish that should be available for transfers anyway and there is no reason why we can’t drop some money on a couple of £80m players and then the normal £50m players here and there.


New Keeper - Kinsky
Porro - Spence
Danso - Vuskovic
VDV - Senesi
Udogie - Robertson
Wharton - Gray
Bentancur - Bergval
Maddison - Xavi
Kudus - Odobert
New LW - New LW
New ST - Richie or Solanke.

Unless we end up selling Porro, Spence and Udogie i can’t see us making many more defensive signing. We need a Wharton in there but who else is available that will be much better than Bentancur, Bergval, Maddison and Xavi in those 2 positions?

I have high hopes for Odobert and Kudus is obviously going to be back at some point so i think the right wing is covered. Are we going to give Mikey Moore a crack? If so we only need 1 Left winger.

The striker position is what is needed but i can’t see us selling both Richie and Solanke in the same window.

I think we will only sign 3 or 4 more players other than the 2 freebies coming in.
 
Yiddo said:
I feel there is money to be made with outgoings for a change.

Vicario - £20m
Romero - £60m
Dragusin - £20m
Davies - £0
Bissouma - £0
Sarr - £18m
Richie - £40m (£50m if its to Saudi)
Solanke - £25m
Scarlett - £3m
Thats £190m with this lot

Others who could potentially be sold
Porro - £45m
Spence - £30m
Bergval - £35m

I can’t see us selling all of these and i think it will either be Richie or Solanke and not both. Add the £150m ish that should be available for transfers anyway and there is no reason why we can’t drop some money on a couple of £80m players and then the normal £50m players here and there.


New Keeper - Kinsky
Porro - Spence
Danso - Vuskovic
VDV - Senesi
Udogie - Robertson
Wharton - Gray
Bentancur - Bergval
Maddison - Xavi
Kudus - Odobert
New LW - New LW
New ST - Richie or Solanke.

Unless we end up selling Porro, Spence and Udogie i can’t see us making many more defensive signing. We need a Wharton in there but who else is available that will be much better than Bentancur, Bergval, Maddison and Xavi in those 2 positions?

I have high hopes for Odobert and Kudus is obviously going to be back at some point so i think the right wing is covered. Are we going to give Mikey Moore a crack? If so we only need 1 Left winger.

The striker position is what is needed but i can’t see us selling both Richie and Solanke in the same window.

I think we will only sign 3 or 4 more players other than the 2 freebies coming in.
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If someone is willing to pay £40 million for Richie then please point them in my direction. I have some magic beans that I'd be very happy to sell them.
 
Finney Is Back said:
Then IMO you completely misunderstand what the problem has been at Spurs these past 8 years or so.

I think you’re so infatuated by Daniel Levy that you want to create a narrative that the new exec team are worse if they don’t have as large a net spend as we did under Levy, even though we bought badly, sold badly and had poor investment and pathways for our academy players in that time.

Running a business (football club) well doesn’t mean spending money you don’t have, it means spending the money you do have in the best way possible.
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No mate it's actually the opposite. I've been consistent in my views, you (and don't take it personal) and several others are so obsessed with blaming Levy (some of which he absolutely deserves) that you are willing to give the new ownership a pass for everything/anything.

I never heard anyone say when we were building the stadium and didn't back Poch, it's ok, because we didn't have the money. Never heard anyone say when certain squad resets didn't happen, or certain players weren't replaced, it's ok, we didn't have the money. I've heard Conte, Ange, Frank weren't backed. What I constantly heard was spend, spend, spend, put money in or sell up and get out.

To hear that all of a sudden, fans of Spurs are ok with zero net spend or negative because we have debt (the same debt we have been managing for 7+ years) is such a tell.

As we are obviously not going to agree, what is your ambition? (thing I have had thrown at me for years on this board), if the club is going to spend less money than the Levy era (and that's fine with you), what do you think we can achieve with that less spending (considering every other top 6 club is going to spend even more on teams that are already better squads)
 
Raziel said:
No mate it's actually the opposite. I've been consistent in my views, you (and don't take it personal) and several others are so obsessed with blaming Levy (some of which he absolutely deserves) that you are willing to give the new ownership a pass for everything/anything.

I never heard anyone say when we were building the stadium and didn't back Poch, it's ok, because we didn't have the money. Never heard anyone say when certain squad resets didn't happen, or certain players weren't replaced, it's ok, we didn't have the money. I've heard Conte, Ange, Frank weren't backed. What I constantly heard was spend, spend, spend, put money in or sell up and get out.

To hear that all of a sudden, fans of Spurs are ok with zero net spend or negative because we have debt (the same debt we have been managing for 7+ years) is such a tell.

As we are obviously not going to agree, what is your ambition? (thing I have had thrown at me for years on this board), if the club is going to spend less money than the Levy era (and that's fine with you), what do you think we can achieve with that less spending (considering every other top 6 club is going to spend even more on teams that are already better squads)
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What you would have heard at the time if you were paying attention is people like me saying we need to use the market intelligently and sell some of the players we have at the height of their value and reinvest wisely. Ie. Dele, Eriksen and reportedly Poch was happy for Toby to go. That's what a clued up chairman would have done if the cash flow was a concern. Instead he sat, and let us stagnate.

You never quite get this view, we aren't asking for more money to be spent, we are asking for the money we do have to be spent intelligently. Use the market to achieve your goals, why is other teams can do this but it's beyond Spurs?
 
Bishop said:
What you would have heard at the time if you were paying attention is people like me saying we need to use the market intelligently and sell some of the players we have at the height of their value and reinvest wisely. Ie. Dele, Eriksen and reportedly Poch was happy for Toby to go. That's what a clued up chairman would have done if the cash flow was a concern. Instead he sat, and let us stagnate.

You never quite get this view, we aren't asking for more money to be spent, we are asking for the money we do have to be spent intelligently. Use the market to achieve your goals, why is other teams can do this but it's beyond Spurs?
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and I'm not disagreeing with the perspective, I'm not saying don't spend wisely, better, have better people in charge.

What I'm saying is an awful lot of people consistently called for more investment (along with smarter buys), an awful lot of people claimed the owners should sell if they didn't have the money to put in, literally no one said "we are happy with the self sustaining model" I know, because I got brick for it, I got the "no ambition" brick all the time, not because I was happy with it, or didn't want better, but because I understood where we were, and I had concerns re the "anyone but this leadership" will make the club magically better.

To suddenly see people twisting themselves in knots to explain why spending less than we earn (not the same, not smarter), less than we have spent in last 5 years is ok because we have debt for no other explanation than anything the new leadership does is somehow better, is ridiculous. Go through this thread, this thread and see me saying we can't change the whole squad, players like Porro, or saying we may need to choice to keep one of Richi/Solanke (because we have to prioritize spend) and get told, we have to do better, we have to just upgrade. Now, suddenly it's ok because it's not Levy

So I'll ask you the same question, if suddenly we have no money to spend, what is your ambition for the club, knowing everyone in top 6 and some of the next best teams are going to? if we end up with a net spend of less than last season, where do see us finish and are you happy with that?
 
Raziel said:
and I'm not disagreeing with the perspective, I'm not saying don't spend wisely, better, have better people in charge.

What I'm saying is an awful lot of people consistently called for more investment (along with smarter buys), an awful lot of people claimed the owners should sell if they didn't have the money to put in, literally no one said "we are happy with the self sustaining model" I know, because I got brick for it, I got the "no ambition" brick all the time, not because I was happy with it, or didn't want better, but because I understood where we were, and I had concerns re the "anyone but this leadership" will make the club magically better.

To suddenly see people twisting themselves in knots to explain why spending less than we earn (not the same, not smarter), less than we have spent in last 5 years is ok because we have debt for no other explanation than anything the new leadership does is somehow better, is ridiculous. Go through this thread, this thread and see me saying we can't change the whole squad, players like Porro, or saying we may need to choice to keep one of Richi/Solanke (because we have to prioritize spend) and get told, we have to do better, we have to just upgrade. Now, suddenly it's ok because it's not Levy

So I'll ask you the same question, if suddenly we have no money to spend, what is your ambition for the club, knowing everyone in top 6 and some of the next best teams are going to? if we end up with a net spend of less than last season, where do see us finish and are you happy with that?
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I can't say i'm really fussed about the headline number. If we are indeed cash strapped I've watched enough football for long enough to know there are ways to work around that if you use the market intelligently.

There is decades of evidence of where clubs sold player X for X headline amount to then buy a lesser heralded player or 2 for less and the club have come out better on the other side. Thats what I mean by using the market more intelligently and that isn't something that we should only be doing now it's how we should have always worked.

For me I don't care who we sell, every player is replaceable if you build your squad well. We could sell Romero, VDV, Spence, Porro, Bentancur, Maddison, Kulu, Kudus etc and still come out better on the other side if we bought well. Obviously that's a ridiculous number to sell and i'm not actually advocating for that but the point is, net or gross spend is less important than who you actually spend that money on.

I would judge the success of the window on who we bought rather than how much we spent.
 
Raziel said:
No mate it's actually the opposite. I've been consistent in my views, you (and don't take it personal) and several others are so obsessed with blaming Levy (some of which he absolutely deserves) that you are willing to give the new ownership a pass for everything/anything.

I never heard anyone say when we were building the stadium and didn't back Poch, it's ok, because we didn't have the money. Never heard anyone say when certain squad resets didn't happen, or certain players weren't replaced, it's ok, we didn't have the money. I've heard Conte, Ange, Frank weren't backed. What I constantly heard was spend, spend, spend, put money in or sell up and get out.

To hear that all of a sudden, fans of Spurs are ok with zero net spend or negative because we have debt (the same debt we have been managing for 7+ years) is such a tell.

As we are obviously not going to agree, what is your ambition? (thing I have had thrown at me for years on this board), if the club is going to spend less money than the Levy era (and that's fine with you), what do you think we can achieve with that less spending (considering every other top 6 club is going to spend even more on teams that are already better squads)
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Again (and I can only assume that you’re purposely missing the point now) I don’t think the amount of net spend we’ve allocated to transfers has been the problem for the past 6 years or so, the problem is instead that we spent money badly under the previous exec team, perhaps in part due to the terrible flip-flopping between managers.

I’m not prepared to give the new exec team a pass for anything and everything it’s just that, unlike you, I think it takes some time to turn around a badly performing organisation. I will therefore wait before I judge.

I get that Levy leaving the club is very upsetting for people like you who idolised him, but give the new (hopefully improved) exec team a bit of time to make and bed in their changes and then judge them. Do you not think that is fair? You may end up right and they may be just as bad as Levy has been these past 8 years or so (I honestly don’t think they could be worse) or they may surprise you and do much better. Only time will tell on that.

I think that by now you must know that I’d love ENIC to sell up for better owners and also that I think they should’ve diluted their equity to bring in investment for the football team around stadium build time, but it seems we’re stuck with the owners for the medium term at least and therefore I want us to have the best possible football structure beneath them and I really don’t think we had that when the previous chairman was running the show.
 
Finney Is Back said:
Again (and I can only assume that you’re purposely missing the point now) I don’t think the amount of net spend we’ve allocated to transfers has been the problem for the past 6 years or so, the problem is instead that we spent money badly under the previous exec team, perhaps in part due to the terrible flip-flopping between managers.

I’m not prepared to give the new exec team a pass for anything and everything it’s just that, unlike you, I think it takes some time to turn around a badly performing organisation. I will therefore wait before I judge.

I get that Levy leaving the club is very upsetting for people like you who idolised him, but give the new (hopefully improved) exec team a bit of time to make and bed in their changes and then judge them. Do you not think that is fair? You may end up right and they may be just as bad as Levy has been these past 8 years or so (I honestly don’t think they could be worse) or they may surprise you and do much better. Only time will tell on that.

I think that by now you must know that I’d love ENIC to sell up for better owners and also that I think they should’ve diluted their equity to bring in investment for the football team around stadium build time, but it seems we’re stuck with the owners for the medium term at least and therefore I want us to have the best possible football structure beneath them and I really don’t think we had that when the previous chairman was running the show.
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I think a theme is less about buying badly and more about having no set way of wanting to play
Flip flopping from different types of coach makes many players look worse imo
And that’s not to say we havent got some bang average players but any player looks worse with constant changes imo
 
Finney Is Back said:
Again (and I can only assume that you’re purposely missing the point now) I don’t think the amount of net spend we’ve allocated to transfers has been the problem for the past 6 years or so, the problem is instead that we spent money badly under the previous exec team, perhaps in part due to the terrible flip-flopping between managers.

I’m not prepared to give the new exec team a pass for anything and everything it’s just that, unlike you, I think it takes some time to turn around a badly performing organisation. I will therefore wait before I judge.

I get that Levy leaving the club is very upsetting for people like you who idolised him, but give the new (hopefully improved) exec team a bit of time to make and bed in their changes and then judge them. Do you not think that is fair? You may end up right and they may be just as bad as Levy has been these past 8 years or so (I honestly don’t think they could be worse) or they may surprise you and do much better. Only time will tell on that.

I think that by now you must know that I’d love ENIC to sell up for better owners and also that I think they should’ve diluted their equity to bring in investment for the football team around stadium build time, but it seems we’re stuck with the owners for the medium term at least and therefore I want us to have the best possible football structure beneath them and I really don’t think we had that when the previous chairman was running the show.
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Mate, that brick isn't funny anymore, if you can't have a conversation without making personal digs/insults, just let me know and I'll avoid the discussion altogether. I don't care who owns the club, I care what happens to the club.

Time will tell, the first set of their decisions (from my perspective) were worse than previous (not surprising), maybe that's them not knowing what they are doing, maybe that's (your theory) they need time to turn it around.
 
Raziel said:
Mate, that brick isn't funny anymore, if you can't have a conversation without making personal digs/insults, just let me know and I'll avoid the discussion altogether. I don't care who owns the club, I care what happens to the club.

Time will tell, the first set of their decisions (from my perspective) were worse than previous (not surprising), maybe that's them not knowing what they are doing, maybe that's (your theory) they need time to turn it around.
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Just accept Finney is superior to you :)
 
If we do sign Savinho, which is looking more likely where does it leave the rest of our LW options Tel, Odobert, Moore?

One really needs to be sold on/Loaned out.

Moore championship loan?

Odobert is out of action for a while so he won't be moving
 
It has felt like we have struggled for options/players, but the truth is we have been decimated by injuries for two seasons.

Line-up everyone and we probably have too many players.

Some will go because their contracts end.
Some need to go as the evidence is they are not the level we require.
Some will go because they are not mentally bought in.
Some should go if they're injury prone
Some will go as we have too many in their position.

That could be a lot of players, and potentially too much work to do.

We also have the problem that 4 injured players are still with us but might not start the season with us. Oderbert probably back at Xmas and Xavi Easter? Not sure on Kudus, and Deki????????!

There's probably a good consensus around who is going.....
Vic, Romero, Dragusin, Biss, one of Solanke/Richie

I think we could get away with just focusing on attackers this window, definitely CFs, then 10s and widemen. As stated slightly muddied by the fact 4 injured players will come back in these positions.
(Oh, and a keeper) (I say all this thinking Robertson and Senesi are already coming)
 
ricky2tricky4city said:
It has felt like we have struggled for options/players, but the truth is we have been decimated by injuries for two seasons.

Line-up everyone and we probably have too many players.

Some will go because their contracts end.
Some need to go as the evidence is they are not the level we require.
Some will go because they are not mentally bought in.
Some should go if they're injury prone
Some will go as we have too many in their position.

That could be a lot of players, and potentially too much work to do.

We also have the problem that 4 injured players are still with us but might not start the season with us. Oderbert probably back at Xmas and Xavi Easter? Not sure on Kudus, and Deki????????!

There's probably a good consensus around who is going.....
Vic, Romero, Dragusin, Biss, one of Solanke/Richie

I think we could get away with just focusing on attackers this window, definitely CFs, then 10s and widemen. As stated slightly muddied by the fact 4 injured players will come back in these positions.
(Oh, and a keeper) (I say all this thinking Robertson and Senesi are already coming)
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List below, big issues

Too many CBs - Romero, VDV, Danso, Dragusin, Vuskovic, Senesi, Phillips, Takai, Dorrington, Byfield
Not enough HG
Too many loan payers with no real plan to be integrated into 1st team - Solomon, Scarlett, Yang, Devine, Phillips, Donley, Hall, Moore, Lankshear

Some sales to do.

1780397520924.png
 
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