Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked

[Pirate55]

Thanks. It certainly gives me even more encouragement than i already have for the run-in. Great Stuff

In fact, it's like an AVB/Mourinho team, but with more hunger for goals and a greater freedom to show flair!

So, nothing at all like an AVB/Mourinho team then

 

[thfcsteff]

Erm yes...from everything I research and read from others I respect on here including your good self the last 18 months have been incredible....across the board, mentality, training facilities, Acadamy, stadium plans...everything looks rosy and forgive me if I seem to be overlooking the bigger picture.

however I would say that we are in the 'Potential' stage still...we have been here before....had many false dawns before.

Potential is nothing if never realised...as a spurs worrier I fear things going wrong even though things at the moment seem like a dream, I can see our progress staring me in the face like a gigantium pair of hooters with flashing police lights but I still dare not believe it.

My message was lets all calm down a little, though its a contradiction as I find it hard to do that myself.

Poch has done so much good work but ultimately he will be judged by the honours he can win. As I said our players/Poch still have far to go...

For me personally, judgement is an individual thing. My criteria is probably different to many. I see Poch as someone who is putting in the foundations for a house which can show it's class and quality for a good decade or so; hopefully he will be there to enjoy it. For me, he is already more successful than any manager we have had since Burky/Shreeves...Venners and Ossie could've but it didn't happen. Poch has rebuilt expectations and respect from the tea-lady on, Levy has delivered a world class training and academy facility. Yes, we have had many potential top 4 finishes in the last decade, but never in that time have I felt with any sense of certainty we could establish until now...

 

[thfcsteff]

I think it would be fair things to call out, and I think your reply is very very good. The fact we share the same frustration/disappointment means I can very much relate to your post, I can see the passion for the club that burns within and I can assure you I feel the same, of course people react to frustration in different ways which brings me to....

I see a real lack of empathy on this board sometimes, and it frustrates the hell out of me it really does, just to be clear I am not singling you out on this, its across the spectrum and you are the unfortunate recipient of built up annoyance within me that has obviously bubbled over, so sorry about that.

Those are fair things to call out and I would like to think I am not guilty of any of them, but if we all said nothing because we do not know the goings on between Levy and Poch then this forum would be very dull indeed.

Half the time all we can do is speculate, is that not what this place is for?

It would please me greatly if sometimes we could all entertain the notion that as posters sometimes our view could quite possibly be wrong, or that a different opinion might be worth politely debating, rather than such and such is moaning again, because things then get posted that puts other peoples backs up. I think some people get to precious and see disagreement on their views like a personal attack.

I do think Poch is the bees knees, I think he is also bringing out the best in Levy, but I do not think either of them should be held on such a pedal stool where someone cannot come on here and question things if it does not sit right with them, I do not think it makes them any less of a devoted Spurs fan to question either of our hierarchy.

Please forgive my rambling, I am recovering from my frustration at our lack of transfer dealings, I did not intend to transform into a poopy head overnight...I am getting over this and last night certainly helped.....I threw a wobbler I hope you can understand this!

With regards to Poch and Levy I will choose to do exactly what I did after the disappointment of not signing a striker in the summer...

I will choose to trust.

Keep posting what you need to say my friend, as you say, important to feel comfortable doing so...COYS!

 

[alekaras]

I think it would be fair things to call out, and I think your reply is very very good. The fact we share the same frustration/disappointment means I can very much relate to your post, I can see the passion for the club that burns within and I can assure you I feel the same, of course people react to frustration in different ways which brings me to....

I see a real lack of empathy on this board sometimes, and it frustrates the hell out of me it really does, just to be clear I am not singling you out on this, its across the spectrum and you are the unfortunate recipient of built up annoyance within me that has obviously bubbled over, so sorry about that.

Those are fair things to call out and I would like to think I am not guilty of any of them, but if we all said nothing because we do not know the goings on between Levy and Poch then this forum would be very dull indeed.

Half the time all we can do is speculate, is that not what this place is for?

It would please me greatly if sometimes we could all entertain the notion that as posters sometimes our view could quite possibly be wrong, or that a different opinion might be worth politely debating, rather than such and such is moaning again, because things then get posted that puts other peoples backs up. I think some people get to precious and see disagreement on their views like a personal attack.

I do think Poch is the bees knees, I think he is also bringing out the best in Levy, but I do not think either of them should be held on such a pedal stool where someone cannot come on here and question things if it does not sit right with them, I do not think it makes them any less of a devoted Spurs fan to question either of our hierarchy.

Please forgive my rambling, I am recovering from my frustration at our lack of transfer dealings, I did not intend to transform into a poopy head overnight...I am getting over this and last night certainly helped.....I threw a wobbler I hope you can understand this!

With regards to Poch and Levy I will choose to do exactly what I did after the disappointment of not signing a striker in the summer...

I will choose to trust.

Nigey, moaning is fine, but at least moan about the right things (e.g. ref screwed us). As far as empathy is concerned, I think all of us go through the same emotions: joy and elation when the team wins, disappointment and sadness when it loses, frustration and anger when it has been treated unfairly, etc. So it's not like we do not understand people's feelings, because we are feeling them ourselves.

And as far as debate is concerned, the whole premise of a debate is facts and logical arguments. OTT comments are not debate and those who make them are inviting the mockery they receive.

In any case, I'm looking forward to the next three and a half months and our team making us happy so we can all forget any moaning and bad feelings. Cheers.

 

[Nigeyman]

Nigey, moaning is fine, but at least moan about the right things (e.g. ref screwed us). As far as empathy is concerned, I think all of us go through the same emotions: joy and elation when the team wins, disappointment and sadness when it loses, frustration and anger when it has been treated unfairly, etc. So it's not like we do not understand people's feelings, because we are feeling them ourselves.

And as far as debate is concerned, the whole premise of a debate is facts and logical arguments. OTT comments are not debate and those who make them are inviting the mockery they receive.

In any case, I'm looking forward to the next three and a half months and our team making us happy so we can all forget any moaning and bad feelings. Cheers.

fair do's

 

[JerusalemMan]

Back on Poch, I think these recent words from Toby are a very good summary of what it is that he has brought.

“The most important thing is we have no heroes in this team.We have a team with a lot of quality that wants to improve. Everybody works hard for each other. When one makes a mistake, the other one picks it up. We have a togetherness. We want to achieve something this season and I think you can see that on the pitch. He only puts the guys in who work very hard. A lot of guys have left the club. If you don't follow that path, you don't belong in Tottenham. Physically we are 100 per cent. We can run all game and that is the way we want to play. If you work hard and put the effort in like we do every week, we are confident that we can beat every team. It is self-belief - not arrogance."

The talk of heroes, from a players perspective, is telling. Of course we fans have heroes like Kane & Alli. But for Toby - a senior figure, probably one of the most well respected in the squad - to specifically say that the team is not orientated around one or two 'special men', but that the thing of primary importance is that they all are working in unison, in sync...it seems special.

 

[alekaras]

Back on Poch, I think these recent words from Toby are a very good summary of what it is that he has brought.

“The most important thing is we have no heroes in this team.We have a team with a lot of quality that wants to improve. Everybody works hard for each other. When one makes a mistake, the other one picks it up. We have a togetherness. We want to achieve something this season and I think you can see that on the pitch. He only puts the guys in who work very hard. A lot of guys have left the club. If you don't follow that path, you don't belong in Tottenham. Physically we are 100 per cent. We can run all game and that is the way we want to play. If you work hard and put the effort in like we do every week, we are confident that we can beat every team. It is self-belief - not arrogance."

The talk of heroes, from a players perspective, is telling. Of course we fans have heroes like Kane & Alli. But for Toby - a senior figure, probably one of the most well respected in the squad - to specifically say that the team is not orientated around one or two 'special men', but that the thing of primary importance is that they all are working in unison, in sync...it seems special.

Between you and me, I don't believe a word. I think he's just toeing the company line.

 

[lurker of old]

You have to pinch yourself, enjoy this great run, and not believe the media hype. We know that normally what can go wrong will go wrong, but...it feels as if this group of players could be the equivalent of the Beckham/Scholes/Giggs team under Fergie....just got to enjoy the ride and somehow try and not think about the future too much....

 

[glorygloryeze]

So, nothing at all like an AVB/Mourinho team then

To be fair, i was talking about the plans they take to shut a game down and control the tempo; often they do that very well.
The issue for those two is that they often concentrate too much on that side of things...it's great that Poch seems to be building a balance of BOTH into the team/squad

 

[metalgear]

we are now playing very differently compared to the start of the season.:
- less intricate football in front of goal, more speed and early crosses from the flanks
- more player freedom - dembele, alli especially, very hard to anticipate where they will be
- more direct/early balls -not hoofing, but more risks

poch is winning me back!

 

[DubaiSpur]

Wait, you get all twisted like a pretzel that we didn't sign a backup striker who would likely sit on the bench the rest of the season, but you're "meh" about Poch leaving??? The guy who is at the core of everything we have achieved this season and has put us on the path to become an elite team? I'm speechless...

Well, yeah. While the manager's here, he gives us his 100%, and we back him with whoever he wants. One of those things didn't happen in the Window that Shall Not be Named (although I'll be damned if I know which one).

When he's gone, meh, we'll find another one. I loved Harry like a second father, but the drama around his departure has consistently stopped me hero-worshipping any of our managers, even given my fondness for some of 'em (AVB, for instance: and Poch now). Managers can be prised away much more easily than players can: we did it ourselves to lure Poch here, and it is possible that someone will do it to us to lure Poch away. The principles behind backing our managers and them ensuring our chances of success are at their highest, however, are what I want to see us upholding: and in that sense, we've been up and down, with the summer being good and the WtSNbN being bad.

 

[alekaras]

Well, yeah. While the manager's here, he gives us his 100%, and we back him with whoever he wants. One of those things didn't happen in the Window that Shall Not be Named (although I'll be damned if I know which one).

When he's gone, meh, we'll find another one. I loved Harry like a second father, but the drama around his departure has consistently stopped me hero-worshipping any of our managers, even given my fondness for some of 'em (AVB, for instance: and Poch now). Managers can be prised away much more easily than players can: we did it ourselves to lure Poch here, and it is possible that someone will do it to us to lure Poch away. The principles behind backing our managers and them ensuring our chances of success are at their highest, however, are what I want to see us upholding: and in that sense, we've been up and down, with the summer being good and the WtSNbN being bad.

Actually, the reason we "lured" Poch away from Soton is because Cortese left. Poch had already declared a year before he signed for us that if Cortese leaves, so will he (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2013/may/16/mauricio-pochettino-quit-southampton-nicola-cortese). The reason Cortese left was because the trust that owns Soton wasn't willing to commit to his plan for solidly establishing the club in the league. In our case we have a chairman that is committed to the plan Poch has laid out and has been supporting him from day 1 (I mean, he did give him a 5-year contract!), else Poch wouldn't be singing his praises (http://www.espnfc.us/tottenham-hots...riticism-unfair-tottenham-mauricio-pochettino). Could someone pry Poch away? Sure they can. But I don't think it will be as easy as when we pried him from Soton. The situation he has at Spurs and the relationship with the chairman are solid enough to make it difficult for another club to lure him away. If any of these things change, that's another story, but so far there's no indication they will.

As for finding another manager, sure we can. They're a dime a dozen these days. But then there are those rare gems like SAF, or Simeone. Managers who have a vision and who the players love playing for. Poch seems to be on his way to becoming one of those gems. And a gem of a manager can build you a dynasty, something that one or two players (even a Bale and a Modric) cannot. Personally, I would rather have the greatest manager in the world with average players than the greatest players with a lousy manager.

 

[spasm]

the only moaning i want to hear is from a pretty girl when i have two fingers inside her...

 

[spasm]

sorry.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Actually, the reason we "lured" Poch away from Soton is because Cortese left. Poch had already declared a year before he signed for us that if Cortese leaves, so will he (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2013/may/16/mauricio-pochettino-quit-southampton-nicola-cortese). The reason Cortese left was because the trust that owns Soton wasn't willing to commit to his plan for solidly establishing the club in the league. In our case we have a chairman that is committed to the plan Poch has laid out and has been supporting him from day 1 (I mean, he did give him a 5-year contract!), else Poch wouldn't be singing his praises (http://www.espnfc.us/tottenham-hots...riticism-unfair-tottenham-mauricio-pochettino). Could someone pry Poch away? Sure they can. But I don't think it will be as easy as when we pried him from Soton. The situation he has at Spurs and the relationship with the chairman are solid enough to make it difficult for another club to lure him away. If any of these things change, that's another story, but so far there's no indication they will.

As for finding another manager, sure we can. They're a dime a dozen these days. But then there are those rare gems like SAF, or Simeone. Managers who have a vision and who the players love playing for. Poch seems to be on his way to becoming one of those gems. And a gem of a manager can build you a dynasty, something that one or two players (even a Bale and a Modric) cannot. Personally, I would rather have the greatest manager in the world with average players than the greatest players with a lousy manager.

Right, but I wouldn't cite Cortese's 'plan' for establishing Soton as...well, a sound one. The man was a bit insane, by all accounts (threw tantrums over the wallpapers in the club shop being the wrong colour or something, for example), and wanted to increase spending year on year well beyond what the new owner considered reasonable: funnily enough, Katharina Liebherr insisted that the club use its own revenues to compete instead of getting injections from the Liebherr family anymore.

In other words, she wanted to run the club in exactly the same way that this club is run. And that caused Cortese + Poch to leave. Surely that at least should tell you that the risk of someone nabbing Poch is quite real (whatever its dimensions), especially when that 'someone' can give him 300,000,000 pounds to spend on whatever he wishes without blinking.

Also, true, a manager who builds a dynasty would be nice. However, I'm not banking on it, and I don't think Levy is either.
Plus, with the new stadium, we could always just get the *actual* Simeone, you know. What with all the swimming pools full of revenue and all.

 

[parklane1]

Back on Poch, I think these recent words from Toby are a very good summary of what it is that he has brought.

“The most important thing is we have no heroes in this team.We have a team with a lot of quality that wants to improve. Everybody works hard for each other. When one makes a mistake, the other one picks it up. We have a togetherness. We want to achieve something this season and I think you can see that on the pitch. He only puts the guys in who work very hard. A lot of guys have left the club. If you don't follow that path, you don't belong in Tottenham. Physically we are 100 per cent. We can run all game and that is the way we want to play. If you work hard and put the effort in like we do every week, we are confident that we can beat every team. It is self-belief - not arrogance."

The talk of heroes, from a players perspective, is telling. Of course we fans have heroes like Kane & Alli. But for Toby - a senior figure, probably one of the most well respected in the squad - to specifically say that the team is not orientated around one or two 'special men', but that the thing of primary importance is that they all are working in unison, in sync...it seems special.

That is the main thing I have noticed this season, I have watched a lot of different teams during my time supporting Spurs but this one is different. As I said in the match tread this is a team who work hard and for each other, there are no super stars and are a unit. All the players graft ( contrary to what some may say) for each other and trust each other to do so.

And its fantastic to hear a player come out and say that.

 

[StephenH]

Right, but I wouldn't cite Cortese's 'plan' for establishing Soton as...well, a sound one. The man was a bit insane, by all accounts (threw tantrums over the wallpapers in the club shop being the wrong colour or something, for example), and wanted to increase spending year on year well beyond what the new owner considered reasonable: funnily enough, Katharina Liebherr insisted that the club use its own revenues to compete instead of getting injections from the Liebherr family anymore.

In other words, she wanted to run the club in exactly the same way that this club is run. And that caused Cortese + Poch to leave. Surely that at least should tell you that the risk of someone nabbing Poch is quite real (whatever its dimensions), especially when that 'someone' can give him 300,000,000 pounds to spend on whatever he wishes without blinking.

Also, true, a manager who builds a dynasty would be nice. However, I'm not banking on it, and I don't think Levy is either.
Plus, with the new stadium, we could always just get the *actual* Simeone, you know. What with all the swimming pools full of revenue and all.

I better get this leaving card for Poch in the post pronto then! Thanks for the heads up!

My little ray of sunshine!

 

[parklane1]

I better get this leaving card for Poch in the post pronto then! Thanks for the heads up!

My little ray of sunshine!

A'int he just. ( boring is a better example).

 

[StephenH]

A'int he just. ( boring is a better example).

Needs to up his medication IMHO

 

[Baleforce]

it's the way the game is now, he won't be here for a decade, he'll either get poached or fired, thats football