spurs' magna carter
Ronnie Rosenthal
Sorry for a second there I thought you were talking about this season :lol:
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Juande Ramos
- Thread starter diego_maradona
- Start date
Sorry for a second there I thought you were talking about this season :lol:
braineclipse
Steve Sedgley
From what I remember a combination of a lot of factors, some that had started previously. We had a terrible run-in in the league after the league cup win iirc.
Some factors I think contributed:
-Ramos was pretty extreme on fitness and health. The "took away the ketchup" stories seem petty, but I think it illustrates the situation. I think we had a lot of players that just weren't up for, used to or motivated for that kind of dedication as footballers. As a result I think the players didn't respond 100% to his instructions and this contributed to his downfall.
-Our transfer dealings. I think Berbatov covered up a lot of faults during his time with us, he was extreme. Midfield passing didn't work? Hoof it to Berba and he could make it stick. Goals from nowhere, assists from nowhere and so on. I think this was true both for Ramos and Jol btw. In addition Berbatov and Keane was a very good strike partnership. We essentially replaced that with clearly inferior players that in addition couldn't form a partnership for the life of them. Not only did we no longer have the magic, we no longer had a functioning attacking force.
-Other imbalances in our squad. Primarily the lack of a defensive midfielder, something we'd struggled with since Carrick left. Zokora was no replacement. Again I think the majestic awesomeness that was Ledley King covered for this to some extent at times previously. But it was a glaring problem in our squad and one our manager and DoF failed to rectify.
-I'm not sure Ramos ever managed to find a team that worked in that 2 from 8 season. He was chopping and changing from game to game. Probably as a result of the previous factors I mentioned, but he just couldn't find something that worked, at all.
I agree with you that he looked promising, the league cup win was obviously a huge positive. I also think that some of the ideas he tried to implement, like higher fitness levels and better nutrition were good ideas. He just didn't find the right way to implement them, or the right players to work with perhaps. In a different universe, where it didn't all implode as spectacularly, perhaps it would have worked over time. I always thought that he was influential in making Tom Huddlestone the player he became by slimming him down and making him a bit more mobile for example.
Some factors I think contributed:
-Ramos was pretty extreme on fitness and health. The "took away the ketchup" stories seem petty, but I think it illustrates the situation. I think we had a lot of players that just weren't up for, used to or motivated for that kind of dedication as footballers. As a result I think the players didn't respond 100% to his instructions and this contributed to his downfall.
-Our transfer dealings. I think Berbatov covered up a lot of faults during his time with us, he was extreme. Midfield passing didn't work? Hoof it to Berba and he could make it stick. Goals from nowhere, assists from nowhere and so on. I think this was true both for Ramos and Jol btw. In addition Berbatov and Keane was a very good strike partnership. We essentially replaced that with clearly inferior players that in addition couldn't form a partnership for the life of them. Not only did we no longer have the magic, we no longer had a functioning attacking force.
-Other imbalances in our squad. Primarily the lack of a defensive midfielder, something we'd struggled with since Carrick left. Zokora was no replacement. Again I think the majestic awesomeness that was Ledley King covered for this to some extent at times previously. But it was a glaring problem in our squad and one our manager and DoF failed to rectify.
-I'm not sure Ramos ever managed to find a team that worked in that 2 from 8 season. He was chopping and changing from game to game. Probably as a result of the previous factors I mentioned, but he just couldn't find something that worked, at all.
I agree with you that he looked promising, the league cup win was obviously a huge positive. I also think that some of the ideas he tried to implement, like higher fitness levels and better nutrition were good ideas. He just didn't find the right way to implement them, or the right players to work with perhaps. In a different universe, where it didn't all implode as spectacularly, perhaps it would have worked over time. I always thought that he was influential in making Tom Huddlestone the player he became by slimming him down and making him a bit more mobile for example.
Kingdawson
Banned
The brand of football in that infamous '2 points from 8 games' era was worse then anything AVB produced tbh.
The guy was utterly clueless. He played Luka as a ****ing DM, he claimed jenas was one of our most important players and gave him the captains armband, he played bentley on the left, he persisted with the ineffective Dos Santos.
The guy was utterly clueless. He played Luka as a ****ing DM, he claimed jenas was one of our most important players and gave him the captains armband, he played bentley on the left, he persisted with the ineffective Dos Santos.
Basically we won a trophy on the back of a brilliant strike partnership of Keane and berbatov and Levy decided he'd sell them that summer and replaced with cack.
milo
Jack L. Jones
A top post and one that's pretty much my reading of it too.
Quality night that was, even if the cretins in the home end did hit me a good one with a coin
Kingdawson
Banned
A great cup manager for sure but pathetic in the league.
Mumorn
Vic Buckingham
Performance at Old Trafford was damn good though, robbed!
Kingdawson
Banned
was that when Nani scored that screamer? we blitzed them that game and got totally conned by Webb.
Kingdawson
Banned
oh wait...Tevez the **** equalising in the 94th min.
Lily White
Clive Wilson
Playing Ledley in Europa league matches and not the league even though we were bottom.
Lemonade Money
Les Medley
Didn't Ledley say in his autobiography that Ramos only prepared them for big games?
hmm. Did we tactically do anything different?
I just always wondered how we went from the Chelsea and UTD performances looking really difficult to beat into relegation form?
My only theory that made sense to me was he was too much of a disciplinarian which only worked for a while but inevitably sooner or later turned the players against him.
I just always wondered how we went from the Chelsea and UTD performances looking really difficult to beat into relegation form?
My only theory that made sense to me was he was too much of a disciplinarian which only worked for a while but inevitably sooner or later turned the players against him.
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
And we have a winner. Played Ledley King in Europe when we were bottom of the league and rested him in the league. The guy would be getting tarred and feathered by most if he was English and his name was John Smith rather than Juande Ramos.
metalgear
Luka Modric
similarities to this season - when you take away your main goals scoring threat, its going to take time to replace. that and other factors listed above. i diidn't find ramos half bad but i think the players were unprofessional starting from after the league cup win - where you could see berbs agitating for a move. never want them back, knew keane was going to be a waste of space without berbs.
Weird thing was he went to Real after and won 18 league games on the spin and almost took them to the title.
His Seville side were awesome as well.
Not sure I believe it but have read various comments stating that many believe Ramos was a coach that was actually ahead of his time hence his methods being rejected.
His Seville side were awesome as well.
Not sure I believe it but have read various comments stating that many believe Ramos was a coach that was actually ahead of his time hence his methods being rejected.