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European Super League - Dead on arrival

I can see a compromise being reached and a certain number of teams qualify for the CL through UEFA coefficients. That would mean that the big teams that are nearly always present would still qualify even if they had one bad year and ended the season outside the top 4. It would stop the other teams from being shut out as they can also qualify through league position.
That way the teams looking to break away have what they really want and that is a more or less guaranteed place in the CL.
 
AdamB said:
Given that this announcement would have happened, would you have preferred to be in the 11, or left on the outside?

The announcement/proposal not happening isnt an option. its just where we're in, or out
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I’d prefer to be on the outside as I think we and the other clubs could be suffocated and snuffed out with the fading of the current tranche of players.

All our competitors and the old football authorities would be looking to see the ESL and the clubs within it die away. That includes the football pyramid, feeder clubs and so on.

Should we be completely detached from the rest of the game the signing of new players becomes immensely complex.
 
Wonder what happened to PSG? Would have thought that they would have been nailed on to join this

Similarly, Bayern aren't included....though they're owned by their members so perhaps they would have needed a vote in advance of signing up...and I think there is some rule in Germany requiring their clubs to be owned to some extent by fans, so maybe its the same for Dortmund?
 
AdamB said:
Wonder what happened to PSG? Would have thought that they would have been nailed on to join this

Similarly, Bayern aren't included....though they're owned by their members so perhaps they would have needed a vote in advance of signing up...and I think there is some rule in Germany requiring their clubs to be owned to some extent by fans, so maybe its the same for Dortmund?
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I would imagine PSG and City are heel draggers as they’ve been ‘working’ recently with UEFA to get off the hook for ffp breaches. I guess they don’t want to be part of this gamble for fear of massive penalties should it fail to come off.
 
johnola said:
I’d prefer to be on the outside as I think we and the other clubs could be suffocated and snuffed out with the fading of the current tranche of players.

All our competitors and the old football authorities would be looking to see the ESL and the clubs within it die away. That includes the football pyramid, feeder clubs and so on.

Should we be completely detached from the rest of the game the signing of new players becomes immensely complex.
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i think a scenario where clubs in the existing structure cut off the 12 break-aways by not selling them players doesnt work if the financials are very different.

Take, say, James Maddison and say he's worth £40m today. After the split, assume clubs in the PL are much poorer due to the reduce marketability etc of the league. They might only be able to now value him at more than say £20m but all the cash which the break-away teams have might mean they could pay £60m for him.

Would Leicester be able to turn down £60m for him if they know he's now only worth £20m?

However if the financial difference isn't much, then I agree with what you say
 
Baleforce said:
I wondered how long it would be before the trust piped up,

https://www.thstofficial.com/thst-news/no-to-breakaway-european-super-league

Someone clearly received a thesaurus for Christmas.

The ever so clever wordy sleight at our owners is worth reading to the end for.
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The problem with their poll, is it that its pitched as 'would you like a super league to happen'.

The right question is 'assume a super league is happening and those clubs included will be a lot richer, and those not included would be a lot poorer. Would you like Spurs to be included'

Its a very different question
 
AdamB said:
i think a scenario where clubs in the existing structure cut off the 12 break-aways by not selling them players doesnt work if the financials are very different.

Take, say, James Maddison and say he's worth £40m today. After the split, assume clubs in the PL are much poorer due to the reduce marketability etc of the league. They might only be able to now value him at more than say £20m but all the cash which the break-away teams have might mean they could pay £60m for him.

Would Leicester be able to turn down £60m for him if they know he's now only worth £20m?

However if the financial difference isn't much, then I agree with what you say
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Depends if the top six have been kicked out doesn’t it.

Then Maddison has to consider that perhaps joining an ESL club makes him persona non grata in the fifa structure.

if he doesn’t fit in the team he signs for then he is completely screwed.

ALSO Leicester will be perennial favourites to win a place in the champions league every year, and not selling their best players to the ESL means those clubs whither on the vine.

Three seasons of clubs not selling players into the ESL will have the effect of completely destroying that competition so all of a sudden instead of United, City, Chelsea. Arsenal, Liverpool and Spurs dominating. A new elite emerge, Everton, Leicester, Sheffield, Leeds, West Ham, Saudi Sportswashing Machine.

Why wouldn’t that happen? They’ll receive all the existing financing that currently goes to their now defunct rivals. That’s the picture UEFA and the national leagues and associations are setting out.

after all, it didn’t take long for Chelsea and City to earn their places in the elite and we are only so described for financial reasons.
 
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My instinct here is that I'm appalled by the proposal and as a traditionalist I don't want us to be involved. I'd far prefer that we return to a European Cup for Champions only, 3pm Saturday kick off's and no unnecessary wearing of change strips!

However, lets wait to see the detail. I get the feeling this is a big powerplay to UEFA and I have my concerns about their integrity. My understanding is that this wont replace participation in PL and league structure apart from inevitably withdrawing from the League Cup which I think we all know is on its death bed. It sounds like this will supercede the UCL/UEL structure securing high profile midweek pan European league played over the course of the season to mesh with domestic leagues.

Also think we need to see this through the eyes of Levy who as a business owner (of sorts) will want to secure the long term financial standing of the club. We know he has a track record of not (bothering to) reading the 'mood of the room' as to what the supporters think. That we are even been mentioned in these conversations is vindication of how we have progressed as a club under his stewardship.

My point is, on supporter reaction, we need to be careful not to become hypocrites - we can't blame Levy for not spending money and then criticise him for wanting to cash in on the greed that a new Super League would provide.
 
johnola said:
Depends if the top six have been kicked out doesn’t it.

Then Maddison has to consider that perhaps joining an ESL club makes him persona non grata in the fifa structure.

if he doesn’t fit in the team he signs for then he is completely screwed.

ALSO Leicester will be perennial favourites to win a place in the champions league every year, and not selling their best players to the ESL means those clubs whither on the vine.

Three seasons of clubs not selling players into the ESL will have the effect of completely destroying that competition so all of a sudden instead of United, City, Chelsea. Arsenal, Liverpool and Spurs dominating. A new elite emerge, Everton, Leicester, Sheffield, Leeds, West Ham, Saudi Sportswashing Machine.

Why wouldn’t that happen? They’ll receive all the existing financing that currently goes to their now defunct rivals. That’s the picture UEFA and the national leagues and associations are setting out.
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If the top 6 are kicked out, and the other big clubs from abroad, there isn’t anything of value left in the fifa structure.
 
johnola said:
Depends if the top six have been kicked out doesn’t it.

Then Maddison has to consider that perhaps joining an ESL club makes him persona non grata in the fifa structure..
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he wouldnt care. He'd be playing in the biggest competition, against the best players, earning 2x-4x say what he would at Leicester

johnola said:
ALSO Leicester will be perennial favourites to win a place in the champions league every year, and not selling their best players to the ESL means those clubs whither on the vine.
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The CL would be massively de-valued without the ESL teams.

johnola said:
Why wouldn’t that happen? They’ll receive all the existing financing that currently goes to their now defunct rivals. That’s the picture UEFA and the national leagues and associations are setting out.
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I dont think its feasible. even if some clubs held out, all wouldnt be able to. We'd sign players from Portugal, Scandi, Brazil, argentina, other ESL teams. Its great in theory, but I dont see its as being practical
 
Baleforce said:
If the top 6 are kicked out, and the other big clubs from abroad, there isn’t anything of value left in the fifa structure.
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There are plenty of clubs ready and willing to supplant the elite clubs. That’s the whole point of open competition and why these clubs have decided to opt out of it.

So then give Everton multiple national and European titles and hey presto, they are the biggest club in England.
 
I guess the upside Kane might just stay and we don't have to worry about terminating Mourinho's contract as we can no longer be relegated.

Apart from that, this is a death sentence for the game I fell in love with, and - I fear - the start of the end of my three decades long relationship with Spurs.

See my post from the other thread on the topic:

Robbo said:
What this will do, is to change the whole fabric of what it means to be a football fan (much more so than the past 30 years' development has, of course). The transition from fan to consumer/customer will be complete.

A football game in this new context is pure, commercial entertainment. Football isn't going to be a sport anymore, the connection between fans and players will completely dininish and a game between Real Madrid and Bayern will be like any new Marvel movie - same formula, no surprises, just a product tailor made to maximize profits.

And profitable they probably will be. I expect myself and other like minded fans to be less and less interested though. People like us, who come back to support our club time and time again, through good times and bad times, even if we play brick and don't get results. The loyalists will disappear.

In return, there will be plenty new consumers, of course. People who don't really have a big affection for football as a sport, but just want their entertainment. They will do their shopping in a world where football is a product just like movies and concerts.

The fan culture that built football will disappear. The die hards that go to every game and sing their hearts out, making it a proper experience for us sporadic spectators, is a dying breed. What's left then? Just a hollow shell.

That's just not for me.
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