thfcsteff
Vic Buckingham
...this is some comment.
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Daniel Levy - Chairman
- Thread starter Howard Webb
- Start date
...this is some comment.
ricky2tricky4city
Les Medley
Yeah but you're not Finney
Finney Is Back
Colin Calderwood
What do you think are the likely reasons why nobody has invested?
Muttley
Ronnie Rosenthal
That one is easy. The club is massively over-valued by the owners. Who would invest in something where you can't increase your share?
It is, but the problem of discussing the problems at Spurs is starting with something that is reality, not internet click bait, in the last two pages
- The shareholders at Tottenham are upset? really, upset that it is the most profitable football club in UK? Since this is so fudging hard to understand, fans are not shareholders (unless they put their own money in club), they are customers. And yes I get that upsets English sensibilities, but really none of the real shareholders (and it's not just Spurs) give a fudge
- The previous two pages, a chart with owner investment, again, basic failure to understand every year that Spurs puts profit back into the club, it's owner investment.
- How many Levy is last chance saloon posts are there? he's going to fire himself?
There is a lot to go after the ownership for, but it helps any conversation to start with reality, reality is
- Spurs as a business (like it or not) is in a very good place
- Spurs generally as a football club has done ok (16 out of last 18 years in Europe, best league run in the history of the club, numerous top level players, Bale, Modric, Kane, Son, etc ..)
Has the club failed to capitalize and convert into trophies? = yes
Has the swings between manager styles cost us in squad coherency cost us? = yes
Has the failure to plan appropriately for HG and Association restrictions been a fudge up? = yes
Did the dreaded rebuild get punted 3 years? = yes
Is the club hesitating on a decision with Ange one way or other? = yes
Can both the owners and the manager be part of the problem? = yes
but hey, lets go down the idiot road again of our owner is a caricature money hoarder and failed businessman that someone is going to magically fire.
It's is valued high and there have been,, will continue to be, cheaper options out there
Villa, Saudi Sportswashing Machine, Everton, etc all cost less than a fifth of what Spurs would.
The only upside is as PSR sets in (if it does), the attraction of having a club that is unlikely to encounter that problem may make Spurs more attractive to other buyers (Seeing how Saudi Sportswashing Machine has been handicapped)
Baleforce
Les Bennett
one like isn't enough
thfcsteff
Vic Buckingham
Nobody -not even the author that you ascribed as you did- does not see the enormous success of ENIC as a business. Nobody. I think deep down you know that it is (on the part of such posts) further frustration at realising how the football side of this club is distinctly second in priority most of the time.
The business of business is making money, the product is irrelevant.
You think Bohley at Chelsea or Saudi investment fund bought Saudi Sportswashing Machine because they care about football?
Don't mistake my statement as "I like it that way", it is more a reality check that someone actually thinks that "the board" will be held accountable when the business continues to work.
Muttley
Ronnie Rosenthal
PSR correlates to the balance sheet / P&L but there have been divergences in how the 2 systems look at what is good versus bad.
Arguably, Levy has got most of the money out of this money train that is the PL. Where does the next big equity increase come from?
Baleforce
Les Bennett
that was long gone before ENIC arrived, didn't old Bill say that in the 70's?
It was Scholar that floated us
thfcsteff
Vic Buckingham
No. Keith Burkinshaw said it after we won the UEFA Cup in '84. I remember it clearly, as it was the first time I realised that boards and managers were not necessarily aligned.
As for Scholar, that man deserves his own thread. Not a black and white story by any measure...but certainly the good, the bad, amnd the ugly!
The author describes Spurs on field issues as a business failure, it is not. Mistakes employees with executives and quite honestly has no fudging clue how a FTSE 100/S&P 500 company works.
I completely get the frustration, I completely get the pain, wtf are we doing in 15th and losing to utter dross?
But to be clear, I often respond because I do have some insight on how much larger organizations than Spurs work, it's why you and I disagree sometimes, and others here, I know how business looks at risk management, at investment vs. outcome vs. risk of not doing, and in that model a lot of what Spurs does is not very unusual.
The oddity is this season, we seem to have frozen, we have neither fired the manager nor bought heavily to back in January (he's been backed previously), and that is a fudge up, that is a genuine issue, hence you would see my comments recently that Munn is backing himself into a place where he will be held accountable as well (heads go, very rarely the main one)
thfcsteff
Vic Buckingham
I didn't read it that way; perhaps I allowed for the inarticulation of what they were wrapping their heads around - that the football side of this is only important to ENIC in the context of business, not actually winning trophies. That is an observation BTW not necessarily a criticism.
Muttley
Ronnie Rosenthal
Or it is strong business acumen to keep putting the long term before the short term. If we land a major player in the next 10 days that we get 5-7 years out of then that's good with me. I bet something is in the works.
Getting to best of the rest is a lot easier than establishing yourself as a permanent top 6, top 4 challenger.
United will be back in the top 6, as will we, in 5 years if Brighton is still in the PL it will be a success for them. Leicester won the league and FA cup, how come we aren't asking how well they are run anymore?
I just realised he is still alive. He's 78 so he wasn't really that old when he was our owner. Surprised me. I have been chatting with dukesy (kitman) last few weeks and he actually worked under Scholar, he's a long serving chap!
We don't know, but lets be clear, if we close January without a substantial addition and/or change in management I really don't know what the fudge we are doing.
Muttley
Ronnie Rosenthal
Well we're about to get Bents, Biss, Romero and VDV back into the setup. With a new signing, that will be +5.
If we still end up with "11 fit players" in Feb-May we should be very suspicious of the methodologies.
I don't think Villa have the same targets we do. I think they're still at the "enjoying the ride" stage.
Chelsea are financially doped, massively so. Under any reasonable system they'd be breaking the rules.
Arsenal, yes. They're probably the only club in the same situation to us. It will be interesting to see if they can find a manager that can do the job.
I agree that smaller clubs tend to look as if they're doing it better - but that's the point I'm making. It's easier to do what they need to do (even with fewer resources) than it is to do what we're trying to.