Antonio Conte - officially NOT the coach of THFC

[SpurMeUp]

Conte just needs to give himself time. The idea he’s perfect and everything will slot into place instantly is flawed itself. He has 2 new players, and Romero and Sessengon effectively new. 2 steps forward one step back.

 

[glasgowspur]

Some on here have definitely lost the plot

We haven't lost it, we just can't see it for all the trophies we've won with harry.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Put Kane in peak Chelsea and Barca/Inter sides and he'd have a trophy haul equal to or greater than either of those players

200%
Weird how we have an average game and he is suddenly downgraded by some fans

 

[glasgowspur]

Yes, I'm suggesting they have settled for that, the final losses and failed title challenges have stuck in their head, the expectation of winning has gone, they just go through the motions, they don't believe they will win.

Settlers, been saying it for years, we are a club of settlers.

 

[billyiddo]

We haven't lost it, we just can't see it for all the trophies we've won with harry.

Why is he to blame for this? It's a team sport - seems strange to take aim at your best most consistent individuals, who without you'd likely be much further away from challenging.

There hasn't been a single final or semi that we have lost in his time at the club where we were favourites fwiw

 

[DeanoAustin]

No, then who is?
Harry is our talisman and vice captain, so either he is as good at that as he is at free kicks or maybe he isn't the answer.

There are players in there that have been treading water for years. Sanchez, Doherty, Sessegnon (who I think has potential), Winks, Lucas, Bergwijn. All these boys, to me, just can't be relied upon. You can throw Dele, Ndombele and GLC into that mix. But the club haven't properly backed a manager to win trophies. The closest we got was last year with Jose when he got quite a lot but either didn't use it (Bale, Vinicius) or it wasn't as good as we thought (Doherty). He also didn't get a centre back that he'd have wanted. So the owners also have a lot of responsibility here particularly with how Pochs last two years went.

But trying to lay responsibility for failure at the door of 2 of our top 3 players (the other being Lloris) is crazy stuff. Lose them and we're pretty much a lower mid table team at best.

Correlation does not equal causation.

 

[glasgowspur]

Why is he to blame for this? It's a team sport - seems strange to take aim at your best most consistent individuals, who without you'd likely be much further away from challenging.

There hasn't been a single final or semi that we have lost in his time at the club where we were favourites fwiw

I'm not saying its his fault alone, but you're right he is part of that team a team that keeps failing, and in his, son and hugos case repeatedly.
So whats the options, we keep them and continue to fail, we sell them and continue to fail (no better off, no worse off) or we move them on and rebuild and maybe it makes a difference.

 

[JerusalemMan]

Conte just needs to give himself time. The idea he’s perfect and everything will slot into place instantly is flawed itself. He has 2 new players, and Romero and Sessengon effectively new. 2 steps forward one step back.

It's certainly a new and confusing situation for him.
To be in a place where he has players capable of turning in that Emirates Marketing Project result and performance. But in the midst of this catastrophic losing run.
He's not really encountered this before.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

We have lost at Burnley away with a peak Poch team
The over reaction is on par with Contes
IMO amor course

 

[glasgowspur]

There are players in there that have been treading water for years. Sanchez, Doherty, Sessegnon (who I think has potential), Winks, Lucas, Bergwijn. All these boys, to me, just can't be relied upon. You can throw Dele, Ndombele and GLC into that mix. But the club haven't properly backed a manager to win trophies. The closest we got was last year with Jose when he got quite a lot but either didn't use it (Bale, Vinicius) or it wasn't as good as we thought (Doherty). He also didn't get a centre back that he'd have wanted. So the owners also have a lot of responsibility here particularly with how Pochs last two years went.

But trying to lay responsibility for failure at the door of 2 of our top 3 players (the other being Lloris) is crazy stuff. Lose them and we're pretty much a lower mid table team at best.

Correlation does not equal causation.

Thats laughable.
Sessegnon, Doherty, Bergwijn are the problem?
How long have they been here?

 

[glasgowspur]

We have lost at Burnley away with a peak Poch team
The over reaction is on par with Contes
IMO amor course

I think we were unlucky last, nothing should be judged on that game.
But 1 win 5 is it, questions need to be asked.
Especially the manner of some of those defeats.

 

[billyiddo]

I'm not saying its his fault alone, but you're right he is part of that team a team that keeps failing, and in his, son and hugos case repeatedly.
So whats the options, we keep them and continue to fail, we sell them and continue to fail (no better off, no worse off) or we move them on and rebuild and maybe it makes a difference.

Our supporters need to manage their expectations a little bit - you are saying they are part of teams that repeatedly failed, implying that we have repeatedly been a team that has been good enough to demand trophies as a minimum expectation for the season - which just hasn't been the case, you could maybe argue for a 1 to 2 year period under Pochettino we were at that level but for the vast majority of these players time at the club we have been a level or two below the top tier teams that can set the bar that high - and that isn't the bloody fault of the best and most consistent players, or the ones which have shown loyalty and stuck around longer than most others of their calibre would have

Ffs

 

[Mcfee]

Some on here have definitely lost the plot

It’ll all be ok by Saturday 2:30pm.

 

[DeanoAustin]

Thats laughable.
Sessegnon, Doherty, Bergwijn are the problem?
How long have they been here?

They're part of the same problem that's hindered us forever. Squad depth. I saw a few posts saying Poch had the best team in the league and couldn't get it over the line. That's revisionist claptrap because, squadwise, we've never had depth. At our peak, if Kane got injured, we had Janssen. If Jan or Toby got injured, we had Wimmer. If Son got injured we had Nkoudou or Njie.

It's very hard to win a league with 11 - 13 top players when your rivals have 18-19 of them.

And on the nonsense being spoken about Poch, go back to the 4-2 SF v Chelsea. Look what they brought off the bench and look what we had.

So, yeah, some of these lads are part of the problem because they aren't good enough but we're forced to rely on them. It was ever thus.

 

[glasgowspur]

Our supporters need to manage their expectations a little bit - you are saying they are part of teams that repeatedly failed, implying that we have repeatedly been a team that has been good enough to demand trophies as a minimum expectation for the season - which just hasn't been the case, you could maybe argue for a 1 to 2 year period under Pochettino we were at that level but for the vast majority of these past tennyears we have been a level or two below the top tier teams that can set the bar that high

I've not expected us to win a trophy for a long time, but the players do keep going on about it.
How many have said we should be winning and then freeze when they get there?

 

[Robspur12]

Put Kane in peak Chelsea and Barca/Inter sides and he'd have a trophy haul equal to or greater than either of those players

Surprised that even needs saying.

 

[Mr Gogolak]

I keep hearing things like 'Nobody has managed to get a tune out of these players for almost five years now', but for me that ignores that there have been loads of player changes over that time! E.g. last night we had Sessegnon, Romero, Royal, Hojbjerg, Kulusevski, Bentancur - all new players to varying degrees.

It's true, obviously, but unfortunately, if the change happens too slowly, the new players blend in with the old ones. It's not oil and water. Also, we don't know what goes on behind the scenes. Even Mourinho never dared to take a stance on that matter. According to the rumors at the time, a few players didn't want to play for him. He could have sent them back to the reserves but, instead, he kept on playing Aurier and N'Dombele, for instance. There were also quite a few disappointing comments on Santo's methods at the time.

I could be wrong, of course, but that reminds me of the 90s, when Ferdinand said, after Gross was sacked, 'I hope we taught him a few things'. Back then, we had some superb players: Ferdinand, Anderton, Ginola, Campbell, Carr... we should have been good enough to challenge for the Top 6 and yet, it never happened. Between, say 1994 and 2000, we kept on signing new players too but in order to change a dressing-room mindset, you need either a superstar or a guy with a very strong personality.

Maybe, from that point of view, signing Ronaldo would have been a good thing for us. We need people like Conte who demand a certain attitude. Otherwise, if you add two people in a group of 25 slackers, you will soon have 27 slackers on your hands. That's human nature (or so I believe, anyway). So either you find someone who's so good at his job that he manages to turn 13 of your slackers around - that's what Mourinho thought would happen - or you move them around quickly enough in order to avoid the 'herd effect'.

 

[glasgowspur]

They're part of the same problem that's hindered us forever. Squad depth. I saw a few posts saying Poch had the best team in the league and couldn't get it over the line. That's revisionist claptrap because, squadwise, we've never had depth. At our peak, if Kane got injured, we had Janssen. If Jan or Toby got injured, we had Wimmer. If Son got injured we had Nkoudou or Njie.

It's very hard to win a league with 11 - 13 top players when your rivals have 18-19 of them.

And on the nonsense being spoken about Poch, go back to the 4-2 SF v Chelsea. Look what they brought off the bench and look what we had.

So, yeah, some of these lads are part of the problem because they aren't good enough but we're forced to rely on them. It was ever thus.

I agree re the league, not realistic for us. The one year we had a glimmer everyone did what tgey could to help Leicester out.
But we have had full strength or very close to it s/f, finals and big games and not turned up.
Technically our first team has been as good as almost anyone, mentally they are weak.

 

[Mcfee]

And on the nonsense being spoken about Poch, go back to the 4-2 SF v Chelsea. Look what they brought off the bench and look what we had.

So, yeah, some of these lads are part of the problem because they aren't good enough but we're forced to rely on them. It was ever thus.

Well re that 4-2 we weren’t going to win any game while conceding 4 in 90 minutes.
It was the 2-1 loss to Man U 12 months later that first caused me to wonder if Poch was ever going to bring us a trophy. Compare the teams from that game. I remember we looked clueless once we went 2-1 down though there was loads of time left.

 

[SteveAWOL]

Put Kane in peak Chelsea and Barca/Inter sides and he'd have a trophy haul equal to or greater than either of those players

If only Harry had a better agent than his idiot brother he could be helping €iteh coast to the PL title right now, plus perhaps picking up FA Cup plus CL trophy at the end of this season, rather than having to carry a team which would struggle to finish in top half of the table without him.