Andre Villas-Boas - Head Coach

[NWND]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Absolutely stunned by what I am reading.


Sadly, whenever the mob calling for the manager's grows in numbers on here they get what they want, seen it all before with Jol, Ramos and Redknapp...

Either way, AVB has my backing.

You're stunned people are questioning whether the manager of what has been a safely top-5 team should keep his job after:

No goals from open play and with 7 conceded in 4 games.
Minus goal difference and 4 defeats in 13
9 goals in almost a third of the season gone, 6 from open play
6-0 and 3-0 defeats
Disinterested performances
Open criticism of the fans by the manager???

 

[NWND]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

From the post above
3) AVB is making us tough to beat first, but the players will be let off the leash soon enough

But, we aren't that tough to beat. Our defence has got away with it on numerous times this season when teams have attacked us. Many teams come to WHL and sit back, even then they've created chances on the break. The West Ham, Saudi Sportswashing Machine and City performances and results were coming. We look shaky whenever we're attacked with pace, even against teams as poor as Sheriff.We consistently get done by simple through-balls and balls over the top. One ball is enough to cause panic, and the less said about defending set-pieces the better!

Totally agree.

For me yesterdays defeat has been coming since the Sheriff away match. I still dont know how we won that match let alone keep a clean sheet. They could have scored 6 themselves that night, and quite frankly they are a pub-team and at times made us look like one.
I remember saying to the wife that night, GHod I hope we arent this bad when we go to Everton and City.

Granted we were very good in that first half at Goodison, but now I start to wonder were Everton just sh#t in the first 45 mins, because I just dont know how a team can play so well in that 45mins and then turn in a display like yesterday in their next away game

Yep, if anything our points total and win ratio highly flatters our performances this season. We were. Highly, highly fortunate to get those pens and wins against Hull and Palace. Hull created the better chances in that game, we were very very lucky in the second half v Chelsea, they carved us open at will, just like City did. Only horrendous finishing and Torres getting sent off stopped us losing. We needed extra time to score v Cardiff and Aston Villa were getting on top before Townsend scored that fluke, then they were looking like equalising before we did them on the break!

 

[NWND]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Oh and people have asked me to name a potential successor to AVB and I've just been reading an interview with Frank De Boer. He comes across really well, talks about implementing a long-term vision at Ajax and going back to basics, encouraging players to express themselves and integrating young talent into the team.

I think with the new academy and training centre, the director of football set-up and long-term project we want to implement as well as the philosophy of playing attractive basic football based on freedom and enjoyment I think he'd be worth a shout

 

[spurs' magna carter]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

You're stunned people are questioning whether the manager of what has been a safely top-5 team should keep his job after:

No goals from open play and with 7 conceded in 4 games.
Minus goal difference and 4 defeats in 13
9 goals in almost a third of the season gone, 6 from open play
6-0 and 3-0 defeats
Disinterested performances
Open criticism of the fans by the manager???

NO. I'm sickened.

Because it is always the way. I remember very well during the latter end of the 2010/11 season people on here saying that we should dump Harry Redknapp on his bum hole and go for this young Portuguese manger whose Porto side were leaving opposition chasing shadows, posting his leaked scout report from his days at Chelsea assessing teams for Jose Mourinho.

I am not stunned that people are questioning him, after recent results and so few goals I'm am not stunned by that, I am stunned because some people are now saying that we should sack him whilst we can? Jesus tap dancing Christ, it literally takes five minutes for a large section of this board to begin sharpening the knives. To be honest I'm not that impressed either but for crying out loud sacking the man isn't going to solve anything.

 

[NWND]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

NO. I'm sickened.

Because it is always the way. I remember very well during the latter end of the 2010/11 season people on here saying that we should dump Harry Redknapp on his bum hole and go for this young Portuguese manger whose Porto side were leaving opposition chasing shadows, posting his leaked scout report from his days at Chelsea assessing teams for Jose Mourinho.

I am not stunned that people are questioning him, after recent results and so few goals I'm am not stunned by that, I am stunned because some people are now saying that we should sack him whilst we can? Jesus tap dancing Christ, it literally takes five minutes for a large section of this board to begin sharpening the knives. To be honest I'm not that impressed either but for crying out loud sacking the man isn't going to solve anything.

Well actually it could solve a lot, just as Santini leaving allowed Jol to free up the players and get them firing and sacking Ramos allowed Harry to come in and get us out of a hole. I can't believe another manager would not make us more effective in attack with the players we have and reducing the high line would instantly stop us getting ripped to shreds by pace!

 

[Pirate55]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

NO. I'm sickened.

Because it is always the way. I remember very well during the latter end of the 2010/11 season people on here saying that we should dump Harry Redknapp on his bum hole and go for this young Portuguese manger whose Porto side were leaving opposition chasing shadows, posting his leaked scout report from his days at Chelsea assessing teams for Jose Mourinho.

I am not stunned that people are questioning him, after recent results and so few goals I'm am not stunned by that, I am stunned because some people are now saying that we should sack him whilst we can? Jesus tap dancing Christ, it literally takes five minutes for a large section of this board to begin sharpening the knives. To be honest I'm not that impressed either but for crying out loudsacking the man isn't going to solve anything.

So, you aren't impressed by AVB, but you don't think sacking him will solve anything? You don't think anyone else could possibly do a better job? Really?

How long would you be prepared to stick with him if there were no improvement - indefinitely?

 

[milo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Please can everyone calm it down a little and treat each other (and each others' opinions) with a little more respect. If anyone is uncertain of the site rules now might be a good time to refresh your memory

http://www.glory-glory.co.uk/announcement.php?f=2

 

[BrainOfLevy]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

NWND, your longer post above...I find it hard to disagree with a lot of it. You are right in that other clubs have dealt with a big turnover of players and are still playing nice football. I don't agree much with the fact that we weren't solid, I think generally we were but there were games where absolutely nothing clicked and it all just combusted really. But I don't think that means that the system is inherently wrong...I don't think reducing the defensive like cures all ills and I don't think taking more risks definitely does. Every system has flaws...but maybe the particular tactic of trying to thread the perfect pass to a small poacher just isn't suited to this league, or takes a hell of a long time to learn.

I've been thinking as to why we as a club are prone to massive dips in league placing despite spending near the top clubs often - certainly more than other mid table teams. It's because we have ambition above our normal station. We have to try something a bit different in order to rise up another level. So far the times we have tried - like Jol to Ramos - have backfired on us and I think a little bit of it is happening now. But it doesn't mean that we shouldn't see through one of these attempts. One thing is for sure, I don't think we will ever move up to the level we want to be at by 'playing it simple' 'letting the players go free' or anything like that. For certain games, yes. For certain runs of form, yes. But I don't think that approach allows us to consistently punch above our weight. I think establishing something beyond that does, and I think we need to go through a bit of pain and patience to get there.

Why do I believe it is worth doing with AVB? Simply his reputation in the game, his thoughts on the game, his knowledge. And the way the players seem to buy into him. I just flatly disagree that he wants to play defensive football. I think he knows his stuff, I think he is trying to get us to a place that will see us good and if we can hold on, and if the players retain that belief, I think we can get there.

 

[superfaisty]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Klinsmanns not available until after the summer so we either hold off sacking avb until then or replace with sherwood and freund. Levy wont keep taking these kind of performances but he will give avb time to turn it round.

 

[NWND]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

NWND, your longer post above...I find it hard to disagree with a lot of it. You are right in that other clubs have dealt with a big turnover of players and are still playing nice football. I don't agree much with the fact that we weren't solid, I think generally we were but there were games where absolutely nothing clicked and it all just combusted really. But I don't think that means that the system is inherently wrong...I don't think reducing the defensive like cures all ills and I don't think taking more risks definitely does. Every system has flaws...but maybe the particular tactic of trying to thread the perfect pass to a small poacher just isn't suited to this league, or takes a hell of a long time to learn.

I've been thinking as to why we as a club are prone to massive dips in league placing despite spending near the top clubs often - certainly more than other mid table teams. It's because we have ambition above our normal station. We have to try something a bit different in order to rise up another level. So far the times we have tried - like Jol to Ramos - have backfired on us and I think a little bit of it is happening now. But it doesn't mean that we shouldn't see through one of these attempts. One thing is for sure, I don't think we will ever move up to the level we want to be at by 'playing it simple' 'letting the players go free' or anything like that. For certain games, yes. For certain runs of form, yes. But I don't think that approach allows us to consistently punch above our weight. I think establishing something beyond that does, and I think we need to go through a bit of pain and patience to get there.

Why do I believe it is worth doing with AVB? Simply his reputation in the game, his thoughts on the game, his knowledge. And the way the players seem to buy into him. I just flatly disagree that he wants to play defensive football. I think he knows his stuff, I think he is trying to get us to a place that will see us good and if we can hold on, and if the players retain that belief, I think we can get there.

But in the face of recent performances, where do you draw the line? Is it close to the end with you, I.e. Would you change your mind if we lost heavily to Man U then lost to Sunderland? I don't think we have ideas above our station, I think we should expect good attacking performances from this very expensively assembled squad!

I'm struggling to see where AVB is going and how he's going to take us up a level. We're already down a level IMO since Harry and we're sliding further.

If I'm honest I'd struggle to think of many top-flight managers that wouldn't come in and make improvements to our play immediately

 

[Baleforce]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Oh and people have asked me to name a potential successor to AVB and I've just been reading an interview with Frank De Boer. He comes across really well, talks about implementing a long-term vision at Ajax and going back to basics, encouraging players to express themselves and integrating young talent into the team.

I think with the new academy and training centre, the director of football set-up and long-term project we want to implement as well as the philosophy of playing attractive basic football based on freedom and enjoyment I think he'd be worth a shout

How much time would you give him to get us playing attractive football, how long term are you thinking?

 

[NWND]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

How much time would you give him to get us playing attractive football, how long term are you thinking?

Well not too long term IMO there would need to be signs of improvement. I don't think Everton or Liverpool are the finished article but the way Martinez and Rogers have almost instantly stamped a style on them while improving performances and playing squads is impressive and a lesson for AVB

 

[thfcsteff]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Oh and people have asked me to name a potential successor to AVB and I've just been reading an interview with Frank De Boer. He comes across really well, talks about implementing a long-term vision at Ajax and going back to basics, encouraging players to express themselves and integrating young talent into the team.

I think with the new academy and training centre, the director of football set-up and long-term project we want to implement as well as the philosophy of playing attractive basic football based on freedom and enjoyment I think he'd be worth a shout

You'd have him sacked within 14 months if he didn't deliver. 'Comes across really well' yet you've only just read an interview with him? As for your Liverpool comments above, first off, were you one of the people taking the **** out of Rogers last season (there were many here I just cannot remember who, I clearly remember being in a minority pointing out that it was clear what he was trying to do) and secondly, you are comfortably ignoring the fact that in Gerrard they have nearly two decades worth of club man and star experience, plus they have Luis Suarez, without whom I'd wager their season might be on a points par with ours.

You tell me, how long does Frank De Boer get from you if AVB was tin-tacked in January? What does he have to do to keep your faith for longer than a proverbial minute?

EDIT: apologies, it appears someone else has beaten me to the question. Your answer is unconvincing. You seem to be fantastic at knowing what you don't want. What do you want?

 

[Hootnow]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

So what reason did many of those same people have for disliking him before our performances ever happened? Or when they were quite good? Or when he reversed last season's poor results?

The same reason you, GB and various other posters were always the last to give Redknapp credit and the first to give him abuse/ call for him to leave when things started to go wrong. Because of personal problems with that manager from the beginning.

That doesn't mean that those personal feelings are wrong. I found Redknapp an incredibly dislikeable man. But personal biases do play a part. I also think it is very easy to dislike AVB (indeed, many neutrals seem to). His football since January 2013 has hardly been scintillating.

There's also a sense of the Emperor's new clothes with AVB. And it has nothing to do with class but everything to do with how he speaks and what he actually says. I used to have a teacher when I first moved to this country who was incredibly articulate and who would answer all of our questions. We thought the man was a genius. Then one of us realised that he was banking on us not knowing quite enough to ever challenge him and he would answer qs he had no idea about in a roundabout way to appear intelligent. Similar to what Jurgen has outlined in the workplace.

Also, I think performances are incredibly important in football. Not because I want to be entertained but because consistently playing poorly but scraping by for me is akin to going all in on 2-7 in poker and hitting a 2 and a 7. That play might have worked for you that once. It may even work for you a few more times. But in the long term, you're going to lose out. And for a while now we've been picking up points while playing poorly. And I feel like our performances are not getting any better. Some say that is the sign of a title winning team. True but not when those performances are in the majority, rather than the minority.

Anyway, I've said in quite a few threads now that our next 5 games are not at all easy. This board (and our points total/ position) may not look so pretty in a month's time. We'll see.

 

[thfcsteff]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Well not too long term IMO there would need to be signs of improvement. I don't think Everton or Liverpool are the finished article but the way Martinez and Rogers have almost instantly stamped a style on them while improving performances and playing squads is impressive and a lesson for AVB

How many years experience do they each have in the prem? Rogers? Again, remember how many brainiacs were ****ging the **** out of him here last season…Martinez? I think we can all agree he is a fine manager and will get even better. Man Utd picked the wrong man IMO...

 

[thfcsteff]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

The same reason you, GB and various other posters were always the last to give Redknapp credit and the first to give him abuse/ call for him to leave when things started to go wrong. Because of personal problems with that manager from the beginning.

That doesn't mean that those personal feelings are wrong. I found Redknapp an incredibly dislikeable man. But personal biases do play a part. I also think it is very easy to dislike AVB (indeed, many neutrals seem to). His football since January 2013 has hardly been scintillating.

There's also a sense of the Emperor's new clothes with AVB. And it has nothing to do with class but everything to do with how he speaks and what he actually says. I used to have a teacher when I first moved to this country who was incredibly articulate and who would answer all of our questions. We thought the man was a genius. Then one of us realised that he was banking on us not knowing quite enough to ever challenge him and he would answer qs he had no idea about in a roundabout way to appear intelligent. Similar to what Jurgen has outlined in the workplace.

Also, I think performances are incredibly important in football. Not because I want to be entertained but because consistently playing poorly but scraping by for me is akin to going all in on 2-7 in poker and hitting a 2 and a 7. That play might have worked for you that once. It may even work for you a few more times. But in the long term, you're going to lose out. And for a while now we've been picking up points while playing poorly. And I feel like our performances are not getting any better. Some say that is the sign of a title winning team. True but not when those performances are in the majority, rather than the minority.

Anyway, I've said in quite a few threads now that our next 5 games are not at all easy. This board (and our points total/ position) may not look so pretty in a month's time. We'll see.

I might not agree with everything you say, but that was a really interesting read and really interesting, thought-provoking set of counter points. Good post matey…

 

[billyiddo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Rodgers and Martinez - my first and second choice to replace Redknapp at the time funnily enough.

 

[NWND]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

You'd have him sacked within 14 months if he didn't deliver. 'Comes across really well' yet you've only just read an interview with him? As for your Liverpool comments above, first off, were you one of the people taking the **** out of Rogers last season (there were many here I just cannot remember who, I clearly remember being in a minority pointing out that it was clear what he was trying to do) and secondly, you are comfortably ignoring the fact that in Gerrard they have nearly two decades worth of club man and star experience, plus they have Luis Suarez, without whom I'd wager their season might be on a points par with ours.

You tell me, how long does Frank De Boer get from you if AVB was tin-tacked in January? What does he have to do to keep your faith for longer than a proverbial minute?

EDIT: apologies, it appears someone else has beaten me to the question. Your answer is unconvincing. You seem to be fantastic at knowing what you don't want. What do you want?

Don't be so patronising, you lot have demanded an option, I've put one in the ring. I'm no expert. What I want is a team that isn't the most boring to watch in the league, that doesn't lose 3-0 to one of the worst teams in the division and 6-0 to one of the best!

I need to be given something from the manager, signs we are going in the right direction, a blue-print, good performances mixed in at the start, doing the basics right, looking a threat etc

I don't need you telling me I wouldn't give a manager a minute and what I thought of Rogers last season.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Rodgers and Martinez - my first and second choice to replace Redknapp at the time funnily enough.

Yeah Rodgers was my first choice too. Wahey we agreed on something \o/

 

[Jurgen the German]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

You'd have him sacked within 14 months if he didn't deliver. 'Comes across really well' yet you've only just read an interview with him? As for your Liverpool comments above, first off, were you one of the people taking the **** out of Rogers last season (there were many here I just cannot remember who, I clearly remember being in a minority pointing out that it was clear what he was trying to do) and secondly, you are comfortably ignoring the fact that in Gerrard they have nearly two decades worth of club man and star experience, plus they have Luis Suarez, without whom I'd wager their season might be on a points par with ours.

You tell me, how long does Frank De Boer get from you if AVB was tin-tacked in January? What does he have to do to keep your faith for longer than a proverbial minute?

EDIT: apologies, it appears someone else has beaten me to the question. Your answer is unconvincing. You seem to be fantastic at knowing what you don't want. What do you want?

Gerrard has been on the decline for about 5 seasons now and He's had Suarez banned for 10 games in recent months and has still got very good results.