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American politics

scaramanga said:
How quickly can you Assemble 1100 troops, create a plan to enter the building, deploy them and successfully save all the VIPs without casualties (at least, none that matter)?
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Errr...if you have to "create a plan" as it is happening, that is the biggest problem of all.

Proper logistical production work would've seen this coming from a mile off and the situation would never have unfolded. Security teams would've advanced the situation two weeks ago, from sniper positions to breach points. That no-one thought of double ring-fencing the building 50 and 100 feet out smacks of negligence. If that negligence was willful, then you have bigger issues even than what happened. If it was "oops didn't see that coming" then the idiots in charge need sacking and replacing with people who have a degree of fudging competence.

You're choosing to debate points with limited context. Of course given the fact they were outnumbered there was little more to be done, but the point is it did not have to be that way.

This happened because one man wanted it to. You appear to think otherwise.
 
scaramanga said:
I was listening to the Opening Arguments podcast today where they pointed out that DC is under federal rule, so Trump can pardon every one of them if he wishes.

I guess we'll see in the coming days how he really feels about it all.
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Wow, horrible.
I don't think he'll get to it in time, but interesting.
 
awesome dawson said:
Bear in mind who is telling you this information and how often that source is wrong.
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Disagreeing with you is not being wrong.

In fact, given how often you and I disagree, it's as close to a guarantee of being right as you'll ever get ;)
 
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thfcsteff said:
Errr...if you have to "create a plan" as it is happening, that is the biggest problem of all.

Proper logistical production work would've seen this coming from a mile off and the situation would never have unfolded. Security teams would've advanced the situation two weeks ago, from sniper positions to breach points. That no-one thought of double ring-fencing the building 50 and 100 feet out smacks of negligence. If that negligence was willful, then you have bigger issues even than what happened. If it was "oops didn't see that coming" then the idiots in charge need sacking and replacing with people who have a degree of fudging competence.

You're choosing to debate points with limited context. Of course given the fact they were outnumbered there was little more to be done, but the point is it did not have to be that way.

This happened because one man wanted it to. You appear to think otherwise.
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We'll know if that's true - he won't hesitate to pardon them all if so.
 
scaramanga said:
We'll know if that's true - he won't hesitate to pardon them all if so.
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Scara.
Please.
Right now, there is little to no chance he will be allowed to get close to that sort of mass activity in two weeks. There is a lot of behind the scenes pressure on all manner of people to keep him in check. He might well be fudged off to a social for the next 10 days as he can be kept away from himself.
Besides that, you're missing the elephant in the room...until he has figured out how he can pardon himself, something which will eat up most of whatever time he's allowed to have. Perhaps if there's time he'll spare a pardon thought for his sons.

He will not "pardon them all". See you back here in 2 weeks.
 
thfcsteff said:
Scara.
Please.
Right now, there is little to no chance he will be allowed to get close to that sort of mass activity in two weeks. There is a lot of behind the scenes pressure on all manner of people to keep him in check. He might well be fudged off to a social for the next 10 days as he can be kept away from himself.
Besides that, you're missing the elephant in the room...until he has figured out how he can pardon himself, something which will eat up most of whatever time he's allowed to have. Perhaps if there's time he'll spare a pardon thought for his sons.

He will not "pardon them all". See you back here in 2 weeks.
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I don't think he will pardon them either - because I don't think he wanted them to storm the building. I think he'd have been fine with general violence and destruction, but not that.

If he did want to though, it's one letter, one paragraph, not per person.

To paraphrase the lawyer who explained it, he only needs to write "I pardon any person committing any crime within ... yards of the Capitol Building between the times of ... and ... on the date ...

Scary, huh?

Edit:

As for pardoning himself, that will almost certainly end up in the SC. Most lawyers I've heard opine seem to think he can but it's not settled. Again though, a paragraph is enough.

He has nothing to do but golf now.
 
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Diamond Lights said:
Was watching CNN interview a protestor and his words were "the police are cool with us, i think a lot of them are on our side".

He's not wrong that's for sure. And now it's come out a Policeman died. Thank GHod it was the hands of a far right white mob otherwise it may have been a real problem to tackle.
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It's moving forward that scares me. There are enough nut jobs amongst us.
 
scaramanga said:
I don't think he will pardon them either - because I don't think he wanted them to storm the building. I think he'd have been fine with general violence and destruction, but not that.

If he did want to though, it's one letter, one paragraph, not per person.

To paraphrase the lawyer who explained it, he only needs to write "I pardon any person committing any crime within ... yards of the Capitol Building between the times of ... and ... on the date ...

Scary, huh?

Edit:

As for pardoning himself, that will almost certainly end up in the SC. Most lawyers I've heard opine seem to think he can but it's not settled. Again though, a paragraph is enough.

He has nothing to do but golf now.
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I disagree and think he had no "off-limits" thoughts when he was drumming up 250 million and flames of ignorant fury. Have you seem the video of him and his in a marquee watching it all go down, laughing and drinking champagne?! You should try to find it.

As for self-pardoning/pardons, yes, of course he can and that's the fight within, keeping him docile with a diet of golf and threats of 25th. He is still quite dangerous to the GOP.
 
scaramanga said:
I don't think he will pardon them either - because I don't think he wanted them to storm the building. I think he'd have been fine with general violence and destruction, but not that.

If he did want to though, it's one letter, one paragraph, not per person.

To paraphrase the lawyer who explained it, he only needs to write "I pardon any person committing any crime within ... yards of the Capitol Building between the times of ... and ... on the date ...

Scary, huh?

Edit:

As for pardoning himself, that will almost certainly end up in the SC. Most lawyers I've heard opine seem to think he can but it's not settled. Again though, a paragraph is enough.

He has nothing to do but golf now.
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The pardoning himself thing will be very interesting. The legal opinions I have read say quite the opposite, that he cannot do this. I guess we'll see.

There is a list circulating (not sure if genuine) of the people he was planning to pardon on the 19th. Don Jr and Erik are not on it funnily enough.
 
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