Transfer speculation

[DubaiSpur]

I think that five is enough, especially when we are as comfortable with a back four.

Who are these five? Wimmer is clearly on his way out, so that leaves, Toby, Verts, Dier and CCV (who hasn't had a single minute of PL football so far).

 

[Gutter Boy]

To use that bricky term used in rugby - I think he would be a good finisher to see out games.

Like Winks you mean?

 

[AdamB]

I think that five is enough, especially when we are as comfortable with a back four.

Dier is a DM - he can fill in at CB but is far better as a DM. CCV is a kid and hasnt exactly looked brilliant in the cup games in which he's played. Poch only seems to play Wimmer in desperation rather than to take to load off JV occasionally.

Therefore we really only have TA and JV as first choices. I think we need another CB who is almost as good as these two so that we can rotate them in cup games and also play Dier in CM

 

[milo]

Who are these five? Wimmer is clearly on his way out, so that leaves, Toby, Verts, Dier and CCV (who hasn't had a single minute of PL football so far).

Those are our current five. I'm not against replacing departing players but I can't see space for an additional central defender in the squad.

 

[milo]

Dier is a DM - he can fill in at CB but is far better as a DM. CCV is a kid and hasnt exactly looked brilliant in the cup games in which he's played. Poch only seems to play Wimmer in desperation rather than to take to load off JV occasionally.

Therefore we really only have TA and JV as first choices. I think we need another CB who is almost as good as these two so that we can rotate them in cup games and also play Dier in CM

Dier can and does play both positions well. CCV is a kid but do we want to bring in someone who blocks his chances to play? I am not against replacing Wimmer if he leaves but I do not see space for another CB on top of this.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Those are our current five. I'm not against replacing departing players but I can't see space for an additional central defender in the squad.

Ah, okay. Fair enough, although I disagree - I'd like two centre-backs if possible. One a 'pure' centre-back, and one a pacy full-back/centre-back who could conceivably cover for Rose and offer more of a threat than Davies does.

Or even cover for Davies, come to think of it, given that Rose is likely to be out for the start of the season and will then have to make up for missing a pre-season on top of it.

 

[milo]

Ah, okay. Fair enough, although I disagree - I'd like two centre-backs if possible. One a 'pure' centre-back, and one a pacy full-back/centre-back who could conceivably cover for Rose and offer more of a threat than Davies does.

Or even cover for Davies, come to think of it, given that Rose is likely to be out for the start of the season and will then have to make up for missing a pre-season on top of it.

I just don't see them getting enough games unless they are replacing someone. I could see your preferred business working if they were replacing Wimmer and Davies.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

I'd agree that another striker has to be on the list, my view

- New Striker
- This year's N'Jie/GKN/Sissoko wide player that Poch is still looking for
- Backup for Eriksen
- 1/2 punts on the next young potential

I agree with 3 of targets, but have yet to see evidence that Poch wants a wide player, he's hardly picked any of the 3 you mentioned to start games. His system appears to get the width from the fullbacks and have 3 supporting midfielders who can interchange positions in attacking areas. I'm sure he'd like someone with a bit of pace but only if they can be flexible within the system.

 

[DubaiSpur]

I just don't see them getting enough games unless they are replacing someone. I could see your preferred business working if they were replacing Wimmer and Davies.

Depends on whether we stick with three at the back as a primary formation - if we do, they'll get a lot of games, and if that 'pacy' LCB is someone like Terence Kongolo (who's been used as an LB for most of this season, and has duly excelled in that role), there's always a secondary role being a straight backup/competitor to Rose if he doesn't get enough time at CB. In that case, we could move Davies on after next season (if he wants to leave and get more game time elsewhere), capitalizing on his home-grown status, his reliability, his relative youth and his domestic experience to wring a very decent fee for him (I'd imagine).

 

[milo]

Depends on whether we stick with three at the back as a primary formation - if we do, they'll get a lot of games, and if that 'pacy' LCB is someone like Terence Kongolo (who's been used as an LB for most of this season, and has duly excelled in that role), there's always a secondary role being a straight backup/competitor to Rose if he doesn't get enough time at CB. In that case, we could move Davies on after next season (if he wants to leave and get more game time elsewhere), capitalizing on his home-grown status, his reliability, his relative youth and his domestic experience to wring a very decent fee for him (I'd imagine).

I think that Poch isn't that wedded to formations and is happy to adjust the way we play to accommodate the best (or most in form) players that he has available.

 

[DubaiSpur]

I think that Poch isn't that wedded to formations and is happy to adjust the way we play to accommodate the best (or most in form) players that he has available.

Which duly brings up the question of how many players to have in a specific position, especially one with more limited prospects of playing time for non-starters. CB spots and up front in a lone-striker formation are areas where limited game time is a very real issue for backups (which is why we headed into this season with only four real CBs and two strikers up front plus the adaptable Son) - yet, you need a lot of CBs in a three-man back line, and you need more than two strikers in (for example) a two-striker formation.

*Some* decisions as to shape and overall tactical approach have to be made in order to solve these conundrums in the market, no? If it were 100% based on the players available, we wouldn't be able to make decisions like the ones outlined above in terms of determining how many strikers/CBs we need, how much playing time we can promise them, etcetera.

 

[milo]

Which duly brings up the question of how many players to have in a specific position, especially one with more limited prospects of playing time for non-starters. CB spots and up front in a lone-striker formation are areas where limited game time is a very real issue for backups (which is why we headed into this season with only four real CBs and two strikers up front plus the adaptable Son) - yet, you need a lot of CBs in a three-man back line, and you need more than two strikers in (for example) a two-striker formation.

*Some* decisions as to shape and overall tactical approach have to be made in order to solve these conundrums in the market, no? If it were 100% based on the players available, we wouldn't be able to make decisions like the ones outlined above in terms of determining how many strikers/CBs we need, how much playing time we can promise them, etcetera.

I think that is one of the reasons why Poch likes flexible players who can play a number of positions. The other being that it allows us to change shape during the game/transitions of play.

In the league, he seems to prefer to have a reasonably tight group of players and does not make a lot of unforced changes.

The solution to having only four real first team CBs is switching to a back four if one is out, I think that Poch is happy doing that.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Which duly brings up the question of how many players to have in a specific position, especially one with more limited prospects of playing time for non-starters. CB spots and up front in a lone-striker formation are areas where limited game time is a very real issue for backups (which is why we headed into this season with only four real CBs and two strikers up front plus the adaptable Son) - yet, you need a lot of CBs in a three-man back line, and you need more than two strikers in (for example) a two-striker formation.

*Some* decisions as to shape and overall tactical approach have to be made in order to solve these conundrums in the market, no? If it were 100% based on the players available, we wouldn't be able to make decisions like the ones outlined above in terms of determining how many strikers/CBs we need, how much playing time we can promise them, etcetera.

How does that square with Poch's clear preference for a tight 23 man squad though?

 

[DubaiSpur]

How does that square with Poch's clear preference for a tight 23 man squad though?

Perfectly. Assuming a 3-4-2-1 as a standard formation, simply fill in each position with a direct backup. 22 players. Plus one third goalie and two youth team players (out of Onomah/Edwards/KWP/Sterling) and that's a 25 man squad right there. Squad size isn't the issue, really, it's how to plan our recruitment given our evident tactical fluidity - do we go with three at the back and thus bring in more than one CB, or do we stick with four as a template and stay with four CBs overall?

I think that is one of the reasons why Poch likes flexible players who can play a number of positions. The other being that it allows us to change shape during the game/transitions of play.

In the league, he seems to prefer to have a reasonably tight group of players and does not make a lot of unforced changes.

The solution to having only four real first team CBs is switching to a back four if one is out, I think that Poch is happy doing that.

Right, but imagine if you will a scenario where the 3-man back line really works, where it leads to us being fluid and simultaneously defensively sound and structured - while the 4-2-3-1 struggles to retain fluency or any attacking threat. like the situation prior to the season's first NLD late last year, which mirrored this scenario to an enormous extent.

In that sort of situation, the last thing you want is an enforced change to a system that isn't working as well as the one you're being forced to abandon. And that sort of thing increasingly makes a difference the higher up the table we finish and the more points we aim to accumulate.

 

[Raziel]

I agree with 3 of targets, but have yet to see evidence that Poch wants a wide player, he's hardly picked any of the 3 you mentioned to start games. His system appears to get the width from the fullbacks and have 3 supporting midfielders who can interchange positions in attacking areas. I'm sure he'd like someone with a bit of pace but only if they can be flexible within the system.

He keeps buying them mate, I just think they aren't working in training, hence we don't see them on pitch. He used that type of player before in Southampton, he tried Townsend and has bought theses 3, rumours of the player we are after that's similar.

I think Poch players the system that he feels the players can pull off, if we had that type player, we might see additional variations.

 

[Cochise]

Ok, so here's the summary from today (@DubaiSpur please don't take these as my personal view's, I'm just summarising stuff for people who haven't had a look themselves).

Ross Barkley will cost £50 million. That's what Everton want though other stories detail our interest as having "cooled".
Sandro Ramirez has had us interested since before he moved to Malaga last summer. We are still interested, however the player is apparently waiting to see if Atletico Madrid have their transfer embargo lifted this summer before agreeing any move.
The Pau Lopez signing isn't completed yet. Apparently the fee hasn't quite been hashed out yet, but it is thought to be only a matter of time.
Andre Gray is another striker we have been linked with. Apparently the race for his signature is between us and Everton.

Finally, the most tenuous story out there is with regards to Jerome Boateng. He is seeking talks with the Bayern board, as he's not happy and our name has somehow been listed as a possible destination. One thing though, is that if he does leave, it could solve the problem of people sniffing around Alderweireld.

 

[DeleHarry]

Ah, okay. Fair enough, although I disagree - I'd like two centre-backs if possible. One a 'pure' centre-back, and one a pacy full-back/centre-back who could conceivably cover for Rose and offer more of a threat than Davies does.

Or even cover for Davies, come to think of it, given that Rose is likely to be out for the start of the season and will then have to make up for missing a pre-season on top of it.

Ryan Sessegnon!!! No brainer now that Fulham are in the Championship again next season

The most promising young left sided player since a certain G Bale imo

 

[DeleHarry]

Michael Keane back to M Utd according to the Daily Mail. 25 million. We were linked with him. I think we might go for that Maguire lad at Hull

 

[NaijaSpurs]

I agree with 3 of targets, but have yet to see evidence that Poch wants a wide player, he's hardly picked any of the 3 you mentioned to start games. His system appears to get the width from the fullbacks and have 3 supporting midfielders who can interchange positions in attacking areas. I'm sure he'd like someone with a bit of pace but only if they can be flexible within the system.

I actually think a natural winger would be of great benefit considering from now on we will be playing in a much larger pitch

 

[NaijaSpurs]

Ryan Sessegnon!!! No brainer now that Fulham are in the Championship again next season

The most promising young left sided player since a certain G Bale imo

i see other teams doubling what ever wages we offer this kid