Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

[Bedfordspurs]

For every multinational paying their tax in another country there was also one paying it here.... The number of those paying the tax here is sadly reducing. It is really, really very hard to do business in the UK at present unless a large majority of your business is with the UK. It is difficult to have a good economy when you are restricting businesses who are domiciled in your country to only be able to do business with a relatively small part of the World. I doubt a single foreign business would ever choose to setup or relocate here for the duration of this Brexit deal and that will be combined with several existing UK domiciled businesses relocating.

I can’t quote numbers
I know many didn’t
And still don’t
Doubt more do now though
We seem to be easy to “cheat” as a government

 

[SpurMeUp]

For every multinational paying their tax in another country there was also one paying it here.... The number of those paying the tax here is sadly reducing. It is really, really very hard to do business in the UK at present unless a large majority of your business is with the UK. It is difficult to have a good economy when you are restricting businesses who are domiciled in your country to only be able to do business with a relatively small part of the World. I doubt a single foreign business would ever choose to setup or relocate here for the duration of this Brexit deal and that will be combined with several existing UK domiciled businesses relocating.

The question posed to those who continue to support brexit, is simply, should we make up the shortfall in tax revenue due to lost UK enterprise by taxing people more, or cutting services?

Around £40b each year of lost tax income! 4% of GDP. It is worrying that politicians are not being upfront about this, putting their own quest for power over truth and honesty.

Edit: I believe that at this juncture we could go back into the EU and take our old terms. They want us part of the collaboration.

 

[SpurMeUp]

What would've been the point of a Norway style Brexit though?.... It was significantly worse than the deal we already had... We had the VERY BEST deal in the EU. Our our currency, able to set our own interest rates and a veto. Not a single other country in Europe had that brilliant deal. This deal or any future deal that we negotiate will not be anywhere near as good as that deal. I suspect we'll end up back in the EU in a sevaral decades' time. However we'll be in as a standard member, adopting the Euro.

Norway would have been less damaging That is all. Better than what we have now because our trade, freedom, academia etc wouldn't have been as affected. The problem was it was too obvious that being in the EU was better than Norway. With the harder Brexit that we got, people can still cling to a - undefinable - mirage that there is still gold at the end. No one can outline it, but it might be there godammit!

 

[SpurMeUp]

We agreed to follow the dame process for a period of OJEU…
Still publish the same way

But that is not the reason DfE can't fund a computer recycling program. If we want to get around these rules we can. We did during Covid - handing out contracts to Ministers mates. I work with DfE, and they are a huge institutional mess. That is why smart advancements are not made. Quite churlish to blame the EU for our own failings.

 

[Baleforce]

The question posed to those who continue to support brexit, is simply, should we make up the shortfall in tax revenue due to lost UK enterprise by taxing people more, or cutting services?

Around £40b each year of lost tax income! 4% of GDP. It is worrying that politicians are not being upfront about this, putting their own quest for power over truth and honesty.

Also: I believe that at this juncture we could go back into the EU and take our old terms. They want us part of the collaboration.

I think we are still in the window where we can beg forgiveness and idiocy, and rejoin on the same terms, but that window will close soon.

It would be a great advert for the EU for us to admit our mistake, it would also be very "big boy pants" of us to do so.

 

[SpurMeUp]

I think we are still in the window where we can beg forgiveness and idiocy, and rejoin on the same terms, but that window will close soon.

It would be a great advert for the EU for us to admit our mistake, it would also be very "big boy pants" of us to do so.

It would be sad in one way. A terrible waste. And the end of a dream (for some). I am all for innovation and experimentation. But pragmatically we can do more whilst in the EU with more cash, more connections and prospects. You'd hope that a politician would see that we can offer a 'brexit package' to the nation which focuses on many of the themes of Brexit, while rejoining the EU. But it won't happen. We'll have to experience more pain before it is an option, as our politics and government is stayed and laborious.

 

[Lilbaz]

I think we are still in the window where we can beg forgiveness and idiocy, and rejoin on the same terms, but that window will close soon.

It would be a great advert for the EU for us to admit our mistake, it would also be very "big boy pants" of us to do so.

No party is going to ask for another referendum it will be political suicide. Even if more people want to rejoin there will be enough that don't that means a party would lose an election for even suggesting it.

Not happening.

 

[Baleforce]

No party is going to ask for another referendum it will be political suicide. Even if more people want to rejoin there will be enough that don't that means a party would lose an election for even suggesting it.

Not happening.

It shouldn’t be a referendum, it shouldn’t be a choice, it’s the Chancellors responsibility to make the economy work, there is a massive fix just sat there waiting.

Draft a bill, put it through the commons and the lords, go beg in Brussels.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

But that is not the reason DfE can't fund a computer recycling program. If we want to get around these rules we can. We did during Covid - handing out contracts to Ministers mates. I work with DfE, and they are a huge institutional mess. That is why smart advancements are not made. Quite churlish to blame the EU for our own failings.

Sorry I wasn’t saying that
I was just responding to GBs post about how tenders are run
Tenders are run using OJEU principles and rules still but under a UK name. They can’t advance because they follow archaic rules and they don’t really allow for new brains and ideas to come in
Before my current role I was the government commercial lead on 4 large overseas projects worth £2.1B
The one I got scrutinised on the most was the lowest value one as it was over certain thresholds with the savings we made. No one understood the scope had changed so much… took over 6 months of explanation from me and my team. Mental and missed opportunities

 

[Lilbaz]

It shouldn’t be a referendum, it shouldn’t be a choice, it’s the Chancellors responsibility to make the economy work, there is a massive fix just sat there waiting.

Draft a bill, put it through the commons and the lords, go beg in Brussels.

It shouldn't be a choice? But it was. Now it is the chancellor's responsibility to make it work.

 

[Lilbaz]

I don't think some of you realise what has happened.

2015 general election.
11 million voted tories.
9 million voted labour.
3.8 million voted ukip (more than lib dem, snp put together).

2019 they voted boris.

The country has been a swing state for the last 7 years. If a party doesn't address the issues of why those people voted ukip. Then they will lose. Calling them stupid or racist won't help. You'll just drive them further away.

 

[Baleforce]

It shouldn't be a choice? But it was. Now it is the chancellor's responsibility to make it work.

It can't work.

 

[Baleforce]

I don't think some of you realise what has happened.

2015 general election.
11 million voted tories.
9 million voted labour.
3.8 million voted ukip (more than lib dem, snp put together).

2019 they voted boris.

The country has been a swing state for the last 7 years. If a party doesn't address the issues of why those people voted ukip. Then they will lose. Calling them stupid or racist won't help. You'll just drive them further away.

Sooner or later, the wishing has to meet reality, what they voted for doesn't, and can't, exist.

We can either be part of the customs union and have a functioning economy, or not, its a binary choice.

 

[SpurMeUp]

I don't think some of you realise what has happened.

2015 general election.
11 million voted tories.
9 million voted labour.
3.8 million voted ukip (more than lib dem, snp put together).

2019 they voted boris.

The country has been a swing state for the last 7 years. If a party doesn't address the issues of why those people voted ukip. Then they will lose. Calling them stupid or racist won't help. You'll just drive them further away.

Do you favour higher taxes or less money for things like the NHS?

People aren't stupid. They were told Brexit would stop immigration. Its increased.

Lets focus on the brexit promises and mistruths, there are plenty to choose from.

 

[DTA]

I think we are still in the window where we can beg forgiveness and idiocy, and rejoin on the same terms, but that window will close soon.

It would be a great advert for the EU for us to admit our mistake, it would also be very "big boy pants" of us to do so.

i dont think they would let us rejoin on the same terms. Would be great if they did. But I can’t see that.

 

[Lilbaz]

Do you favour higher taxes or less money for things like the NHS?

People aren't stupid. They were told Brexit would stop immigration. Its increased.

Lets focus on the brexit promises and mistruths, there are plenty to choose from.

They were told that in 2015? You are missing the point.

 

[SpurMeUp]

They were told that in 2015? You are missing the point.

They were told there would be extra money for the NHS. And less immigration. Have either been delivered? No. There is less money for the NHS!!!

Answer the question: how should we deal with the budget deficit caused by Brexit? More tax? Less spend on services?

 

[Lilbaz]

Sooner or later, the wishing has to meet reality, what they voted for doesn't, and can't, exist.

We can either be part of the customs union and have a functioning economy, or not, its a binary choice.

For a lot of people it was never about the referendum. It was decided way before. But people wouldn't listen, just as you aren't now.

You'll never understand and that is why votes won't go the way you think. Because the people voting don't do polls.

 

[Lilbaz]

They were told there would be extra money for the NHS. And less immigration. Have either been delivered? No. There is less money for the NHS!!!

Answer the question: how should we deal with the budget deficit caused by Brexit? More tax? Less spend on services? This is binary too.

In 2015?

 

[Baleforce]

For a lot of people it was never about the referendum. It was decided way before. But people wouldn't listen, just as you aren't now.

You'll never understand and that is why votes won't go the way you think. Because the people voting don't do polls.

It's not about listening, you can't summon a unicorn just by wishing for it. What we need is honesty from government.

The UK economy can't survive out of the CU, anymore than you or I could survive without oxygen.