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Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

I wonder if Angela Rayner will be looked at now for her "tory scum" at party conference season just a few weeks ago.

It seems some are higher and mighty, think about the tone when the labour politician was murdered up north. Politicians need to lead by example.

Labour have my support, but employing people like that does not make it easy for me.
 
MPs at their best are local advocates. One of the few things that works well in our democracy is representation by a local Member of Parliment. That anyone can access their MP giving them a direct root to the mechanism of power, is a fantastic thing. We will need to have people scanned or searched before meeting an MP, and it might be another barrier to access their support. Tragic on an individual level and it will create societal impediments to our democracy.
 
scaramanga said:
Most democracies have some trade restrictions in place - not because the restrictions are to the benefit of the whole, but because various industry lobby groups insist on them.

If you want an example, I offer pretty much every country on this planet. Over the last few decades, trade restrictions have (with a few exceptions) decreased, international trade has increased and populations have prospered. Technology has moved at a pace - much of that due to international cooperation and outsourcing.

It's an overly used and somewhat narrow example, but read I, Pencil - it'll only take a couple of minutes. It shows how international independence is not only harmful, it's impossible.
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Trade increases prosperity. It follows that barriers to trade reduces prosperity. Simple logic, and one of the reasons leaving the EU (a customs union at heart) was illogical. However, protection stops things like beef that has growth hormones being given to native populations. So protection is not bad. It is how it is applied. It is possible to protect local concerns and enhance free trade. A bit like the EU has creating the largest free market in the world.
 
SpurMeUp said:
Trade increases prosperity. It follows that barriers to trade reduces prosperity. Simple logic, and one of the reasons leaving the EU (a customs union at heart) was illogical. However, protection stops things like beef that has growth hormones being given to native populations. So protection is not bad. It is how it is applied. It is possible to protect local concerns and enhance free trade. A bit like the EU has creating the largest free market in the world.
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What's wrong with beef that has growth hormones?
 
Lilbaz said:
What i'm saying is that with automation there would be no difference in price. Amazon would deliver you something that is £3 made in the uk. Hell if 3d printers keep getting better you'd just make it yourself and pay 50p or find a site that did it for nothing on the sly.

I'm not saying for everything.

Did you watch the vid? I know it's fairly long but it explains in brief the plan.
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Yeah with automation the opportunity is very much there.
It'll be interesting, because you can't have high unemployment, so you have to support people if you do.
Who does it first?
What happens to the people who then have to do the jobs that can't be automated? Do we share it around?
Capitalism is job creation - it's dangerous for it to replace that, because it needs people having money to buy stuff.
 
monkeybarry said:
Yeah with automation the opportunity is very much there.
It'll be interesting, because you can't have high unemployment, so you have to support people if you do.
Who does it first?
What happens to the people who then have to do the jobs that can't be automated? Do we share it around?
Capitalism is job creation - it's dangerous for it to replace that, because it needs people having money to buy stuff.
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Andrew yangs proposal when he ran for president was universal income. Which i think is a bad idea (at least the way he wanted to implement it). But it is something we have to think about going forward. In manufacturing the uk will be less effected than most countries, but the advance of ai means a lot of white collar jobs will also be effected.

The last 3 industrial revolutions saw a lot of jobs become obsolete, but these were replaced with new ones. Typists were replaced by photocopiers but needed engineers and it experts. Saddlemakers for horses started making leather seats for cars.
 
scaramanga said:
What's wrong with beef that has growth hormones?
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Always best to err on the side of caution when it comes to food right? Sex hormones are pretty powerful and may be linked to cancer. A number of nations' food standards agencies have seen enough circumstantial evidence to stay clear. Even China doesn't allow it! But you'd have it here, not being sure either way?

It is not a great way to produce beef is it? Using hormones to accelerate a cows growth. Taking hormones in sport is linked to cancer in humans, so the EU, China and other nations stance makes perfect sense to me. If the Aussies and Yanks want to eat sex hormones good on em. In Europe at least, people care more about the food they eat.
 
Lilbaz said:
Andrew yangs proposal when he ran for president was universal income. Which i think is a bad idea (at least the way he wanted to implement it). But it is something we have to think about going forward. In manufacturing the uk will be less effected than most countries, but the advance of ai means a lot of white collar jobs will also be effected.

The last 3 industrial revolutions saw a lot of jobs become obsolete, but these were replaced with new ones. Typists were replaced by photocopiers but needed engineers and it experts. Saddlemakers for horses started making leather seats for cars.
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Some think UBI is inevitable in some form. I'm not too familiar with Yang's version of it but Rutger Bregman made a good case for it in his book Utopia For Realists.

I have three kids of school age, and like any parent I will try and guide them as best I can if they come looking for career advice from me. I have my own views on what they should do, and I certainly try to nudge them in particular directions. I try to sow seeds of ideas in their heads which I hope will influence their choices. I not doing it to be a controlling father type, but rather to steer them away from skills that will soon be obsolete and jobs that will no longer exist in a decade or whatever. Some jobs may be automated away, and that is one thing to consider, but other jobs will become almost meaningless in a climate-ravaged world. Bullsh1t jobs I call them. These will be the first to go when our civilisation gets stretched to breaking point or beyond it.
 
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Rorschach said:
Some think UBI is inevitable in some form. I'm not too familiar with Yang's version of it but Rutger Bregman made a good case for it in his book Utopia For Realists.

I have three kids of school age, and like any parent I will try and guide them as best I can if they come looking for career advice from me. I have my own views on what they should do, and I certainly try to nudge them in particular directions. I try to sow seeds of ideas in their heads which I hope will influence their choices. I not doing it to be a controlling father type, but rather to steer them away from skills that will soon be obsolete and jobs that will no longer exist in a decade or whatever. Some jobs may be automated away, and that is one thing to consider, but other jobs will become almost meaningless in a climate-ravaged world. flimflam jobs I call them. These will be the first to go when our civilisation gets stretched to breaking point or beyond it.
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Basically yangs version was to give everyone $1000 dollars a month. But if you were on benefits (disability or otherwise) you had to choose between the 2. Also no rent controls. So basically would have landlords hike rents. Inflation. Leaving the most vulnerable worse off.
 
Lilbaz said:
Basically yangs version was to give everyone $1000 dollars a month. But if you were on benefits (disability or otherwise) you had to choose between the 2. Also no rent controls. So basically would have landlords hike rents. Inflation. Leaving the most vulnerable worse off.
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Well, that is not very well thought through. He is not a great politician either it would seem.
 
Rorschach said:
Well, that is not very well thought through. He is not a great politician either it would seem.
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Tbf i don't think he expected to get elected. Just used it as a headline grabber to get his face recognised. It did bring it into the conversation and make people aware this is something we need to think about.
 
Lilbaz said:
Tbf i don't think he expected to get elected. Just used it as a headline grabber to get his face recognised. It did bring it into the conversation and make people aware this is something we need to think about.
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Yes maybe he never expected to win but use it to get his name out there, as you say. However, that hasn't helped much with his run at the NYC mayorship. In fact he has become a bit of a joke figure in political conversation over there now. His latest move was to leave the democratic party, a day before his book launch, and got pelters for that too. I'm not sure we'll see too much more of him. I guess he raised the profile of UBI a little so there is that.
 
SpurMeUp said:
Always best to err on the side of caution when it comes to food right? Sex hormones are pretty powerful and may be linked to cancer. A number of nations' food standards agencies have seen enough circumstantial evidence to stay clear. Even China doesn't allow it! But you'd have it here, not being sure either way?

It is not a great way to produce beef is it? Using hormones to accelerate a cows growth. Taking hormones in sport is linked to cancer in humans, so the EU, China and other nations stance makes perfect sense to me. If the Aussies and Yanks want to eat sex hormones good on em. In Europe at least, people care more about the food they eat.
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So let people choose.

Those of us who don't buy in to food scares shared by the Daily Mail can buy the food we want and those who are taken in by such stories can avoid them.
 
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