New New Manager Poll (The Lets Get It Right This Time Edition)

[Robspur12]

Wasn’t we actually playing quite brick in the league that season and wasn’t it the start of our down fall?

We won 23 out of 38 games with a win percentage of over 60%. At different times we lost Kane, Dele and Eriksen was a shadow of himself in previous seasons (one wonders if that was the beginning of his heart issues due to the high intensity of the games), we had a midfield of Winks and Sissoko yet we finished 4th on 71 points one point less than AVB achieved in his stand out season and the same as Harry, reached the semi final of the League Cup and the Champions League final. And yet the juxtaposition of the posts above with some saying how it was a brick season while others claiming things are not too bad now, you simply can't make up. It's comedy gold.

Edit: to those saying "things are not too bad" we've just lost to relegation fighting Bournemouth at home, failed to beat another relegation threatened team in Southampton, fluked a win against Brighton despite having our arses handed back to us. We have no permanent manager, our DoF is on gardening leave and our best player and record goalscorer is likely to leave at the end of this season. Oh yeah and Arsenal could still rub our noses in further by winning the league. Literally the only thing that is keeping me watching football is arsenal bottling the league. Now I call that a real fudging mess not Poch's last full season.

 

[Raziel]

We won 23 out of 38 games with a win percentage of over 60%. At different times we lost Kane, Dele and Eriksen was a shadow of himself in previous seasons (one wonders if that was the beginning of his heart issues due to the high intensity of the games), we had a midfield of Winks and Sissoko yet we finished 4th on 71 points one point less than AVB achieved in his stand out season and the same as Harry, reached the semi final of the League Cup and the Champions League final. And yet the juxtaposition of the posts above with some saying how it was a brick season while others claiming things are not too bad now, you simply can't make up this brick. It's comedy gold.

Edit: to those saying "things are not too bad" we've just lost to relegation fighting Bournemouth at home, failed to beat another relegation threatened team in Southampton, fluked a win against Brighton despite having our arses handed back to us. We have no permanent manager, our DoF is on gardening leave and our best player and record goalscorer is likely to leave at the end of this season. Oh yeah and Arsenal could still rub our noses in further by winning the league. Literally the only thing that is keeping me watching football is arsenal bottling the league. Now I call that a real fudging mess not Poch's last full season.

Cherry picking is easy, the final 10 months were a mess - here's the BBC article when he got fired (and that's why people remember it being brick)

During his time at the club, only Arsenal (51) have picked up fewer points against fellow "big-six" teams than Tottenham (60). And since August 2014, Spurs have lost more Premier League games against those sides than any of those other teams (23).

It is not much of a stretch to suggest that their form during this calendar year has been that of relegation battlers. In fact, no Premier League side has lost more matches in all competitions than Pochettino's side (18).

With 25 points from their last 24 games, Tottenham have been in relegation-battling form for the last nine months. Only three ever-present sides have taken fewer points in that time, while under-fire managers Marco Silva and Unai Emery have both taken at least 10 points more. Spurs last lost more games in a calendar year in 2008, when they suffered 19 defeats during spells under Juande Ramos and Harry Redknapp.

At the heart of it all has been a dismal away record - their last away league win came in January when they scraped an injury-time victory against a Fulham side destined for relegation. They have also lost more points from winning positions than any other Premier League side this season (12), bringing into question whether the players had the motivation to fight on their manager's behalf. And, for a club with Champions League aspirations and one now settled into a world-class stadium, it is perhaps this final statistic that sealed Pochettino's fate. Tottenham's tally of 14 points is their lowest after 12 games of a Premier League season in 11 years.

 

[Robspur12]

Cherry picking is easy, the final 10 months were a mess - here's the BBC article when he got fired (and that's why people remember it being brick)

During his time at the club, only Arsenal (51) have picked up fewer points against fellow "big-six" teams than Tottenham (60). And since August 2014, Spurs have lost more Premier League games against those sides than any of those other teams (23).

It is not much of a stretch to suggest that their form during this calendar year has been that of relegation battlers. In fact, no Premier League side has lost more matches in all competitions than Pochettino's side (18).

With 25 points from their last 24 games, Tottenham have been in relegation-battling form for the last nine months. Only three ever-present sides have taken fewer points in that time, while under-fire managers Marco Silva and Unai Emery have both taken at least 10 points more. Spurs last lost more games in a calendar year in 2008, when they suffered 19 defeats during spells under Juande Ramos and Harry Redknapp.

At the heart of it all has been a dismal away record - their last away league win came in January when they scraped an injury-time victory against a Fulham side destined for relegation. They have also lost more points from winning positions than any other Premier League side this season (12), bringing into question whether the players had the motivation to fight on their manager's behalf. And, for a club with Champions League aspirations and one now settled into a world-class stadium, it is perhaps this final statistic that sealed Pochettino's fate. Tottenham's tally of 14 points is their lowest after 12 games of a Premier League season in 11 years.

Who's Cherry picking? You pick out one negative article and completely ignore the stats that matter. You include his last season post champions league by which time we were in transition and the team was out on its arse.

All the things in my post are true and in reality are the only stats that matter. The points total only beaten by AVB with Uber Bale, (and by Poch himself) the Champions League final, league cup semi, no Kane( imagine Mourinho or Conte with no Kane!) No Dele, fighting on 3 fronts. I thought about this over and over again and given what has happened since has just strengthened my view. Based on the results of that season, unless you are willfully ignoring the context and just looking at stats that in the end didn't mean anything, there is no reasonable case to say that season was poor.

Look where we are now with posters seriously claiming that 1 season Vincent Kompany or Arnie Slot might be the answer. Honestly you cannot make this up.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Yea we got completely taken apart by them in the 2nd half.

i remember saying to mates around Christmas that year when we were a couple of points off top and we’d not even remotely played well, if we could start hitting some form again we could have a push for the title. Unfortunately the opposite happened and results started to match the performances and we limped to 4th. Champions League run was amazing though, made it to the final on heart alone.

Burnley game was the one where we could have gone joint top IIRC

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Who's Cherry picking? You pick out one negative article and completely ignore the stats that matter. You include his last season post champions league by which time we were in transition and the team was out on its arse.

All the things in my post are true and in reality are the only stats that matter. The points total only beaten by AVB with Uber Bale, the Champions League final, league cup semi, no Kane( imagine Mourinho or Conte with no Kane!) No Dele, fighting on 3 fronts. I thought about this over and over again and given what has happened since has just strengthened my view. Based on the results of that season, unless you are willfully ignoring the context and just looking at stats that in the end didn't mean anything, there is no reasonable case to say that season was poor.

Look where we are now with posters seriously claiming that 1 season Vincent Kompany or Arnie Slot might be the answer. Honestly you cannot make this up.

It’s not 1 season for either though
Slot has done more than Poch had done before joining us for example

 

[Raziel]

Who's Cherry picking? You pick out one negative article and completely ignore the stats that matter. You include his last season post champions league by which time we were in transition and the team was out on its arse.

All the things in my post are true and in reality are the only stats that matter. The points total only beaten by AVB with Uber Bale, the Champions League final, league cup semi, no Kane( imagine Mourinho or Conte with no Kane!) No Dele, fighting on 3 fronts. I thought about this over and over again and given what has happened since has just strengthened my view. Based on the results of that season, unless you are willfully ignoring the context and just looking at stats that in the end didn't mean anything, there is no reasonable case to say that season was poor.

Look where we are now with posters seriously claiming that 1 season Vincent Kompany or Arnie Slot might be the answer. Honestly you cannot make this up.

you are pretending that season had no context

- We fell off a cliff post December, 1 away win in 10 months
- The fall continued post CL final
- 25 points in 24 games, read that again

Poch at his best was great, but the end was a mess, this pretense that we were flying high and Levy was just a prick and totally unjustifiably fired the guy is so revisionist.

25 points in 24 games, 18 losses in a calendar year, no one survives that ...

 

[Robspur12]

It’s not 1 season for either though
Slot has done more than Poch had done before joining us for example

But nothing in the PL which would not matter if he had the experience and CV of Ten Haag. And Slot has won nothing of note in the Erividisie either unless I'm mistaken.

 

[Robspur12]

you are pretending that season had no context

- We fell off a cliff post December, 1 away win in 10 months
- The fall continued post CL final
- 25 points in 24 games, read that again

Poch at his best was great, but the end was a mess, this pretense that we were flying high and Levy was just a prick and totally unjustifiably fired the guy is so revisionist.

25 points in 24 games, 18 losses in a calendar year, no one survives that ...

As I say without the full context of what was actually going on and what was achieved, there was no reasonable football case for his sacking unless he had said to Levy I've had enough. Or Levy looked him in the eye and saw he was going to breakdown.

But even if I humour you and say yes it was the correct decision. Why not appoint someone like Ten Haag who could have completed the rebuild that Poch said then and now in hindsight is so clear was needed.

 

[billyiddo]

Don't waste your time mate

 

[Bedfordspurs]

But nothing in the PL which would not matter if he had the experience and CV of Ten Haag. And Slot has won nothing of note in the Erividisie either unless I'm mistaken.

Slot got his team to a European final last season
He could have won the Dutch league with as before it got called off
And his team are winning the league this season
The guy has a much better CV than Poch arguably now because he will have won things the hardest way, by toppling a much richer, bigger club
It would have been the equivalent of Poch winning the league with us
And I’d love Poch to come back but we shouldn’t write off other options

 

[Finney Is Back]

you are pretending that season had no context

- We fell off a cliff post December, 1 away win in 10 months
- The fall continued post CL final
- 25 points in 24 games, read that again

Poch at his best was great, but the end was a mess, this pretense that we were flying high and Levy was just a prick and totally unjustifiably fired the guy is so revisionist.

25 points in 24 games, 18 losses in a calendar year, no one survives that ...

You’re the one ignoring the context….

We were the first ever PL team not to add a single player to the squad in a summer transfer window. The team (many of which had also gone to the last game of the World Cup) were running on fumes in the second half of that season.

 

[billyiddo]

Slot probably does have a better CV at comparable points in time, however we appointed Poch off the back of his PL performance with Saints and in that respect Slot hasn't yet been able to show he/his ideas can work here - we were also a less attractive club at the time.

It's a funny old business when you think about it - after a short, unremarkable stint at Espanol to his name what was it that gave SCBC the idea to appoint Poch in the first place?

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Slot probably does have a better CV at comparable points in time, however we appointed Poch off the back of his PL performance with Saints and in that respect Slot hasn't yet been able to show he/his ideas can work here - we were also a less attractive club at the time.

It's a funny old business when you think about it - after a short, unremarkable stint at Espanol to his name what was it that gave SCBC the idea to appoint Poch in the first place?

Do you not know the story?
The Southampton DOF went to Espanyol to look at a player and was more impressed with the coach
Once he was sacked he waited until the Southampton role came up and he brought him in
He always came across as a smart DOF (Cortese)
And Poch was not a popular call there as Adkins was turning things around they thought

 

[Yiddo]

We won 23 out of 38 games with a win percentage of over 60%. At different times we lost Kane, Dele and Eriksen was a shadow of himself in previous seasons (one wonders if that was the beginning of his heart issues due to the high intensity of the games), we had a midfield of Winks and Sissoko yet we finished 4th on 71 points one point less than AVB achieved in his stand out season and the same as Harry, reached the semi final of the League Cup and the Champions League final. And yet the juxtaposition of the posts above with some saying how it was a brick season while others claiming things are not too bad now, you simply can't make up. It's comedy gold.

Edit: to those saying "things are not too bad" we've just lost to relegation fighting Bournemouth at home, failed to beat another relegation threatened team in Southampton, fluked a win against Brighton despite having our arses handed back to us. We have no permanent manager, our DoF is on gardening leave and our best player and record goalscorer is likely to leave at the end of this season. Oh yeah and Arsenal could still rub our noses in further by winning the league. Literally the only thing that is keeping me watching football is arsenal bottling the league. Now I call that a real fudging mess not Poch's last full season.

But we also lost 13 games.

 

[Baleforce]

Do you not know the story?
The Southampton DOF went to Espanyol to look at a player and was more impressed with the coach
Once he was sacked he waited until the Southampton role came up and he brought him in
He always came across as a smart DOF (Cortese)
And Poch was not a popular call there as Adkins was turning things around they thought

I remember the negativity about firing Adkins at the time, for “some bloke that can’t even speak English”.

I thought it was odd at the time to be fair, Adkins was seemingly doing alright.

 

[totalspurs]

you are pretending that season had no context

- We fell off a cliff post December, 1 away win in 10 months
- The fall continued post CL final
- 25 points in 24 games, read that again

Poch at his best was great, but the end was a mess, this pretense that we were flying high and Levy was just a prick and totally unjustifiably fired the guy is so revisionist.

25 points in 24 games, 18 losses in a calendar year, no one survives that ...

Levy (the boss) completely failed to provide any backing or support to his Senior long serving Foreman or the Machine. Despite this Poch got us to the ridiculous position of the CL Final.
When all the cogs on machine were worn out.

Then Levy blame Poch for the poor performance of the machine and sacked him for not maintaining the same quality of output.

The stakeholders (fans) accepted the decision as they looked forward to the promise of a new superior Foreman and a better machine in shinny new factory.

The new Foreman didn't understand the product and thought he new what was needed more than everyone else....he didn't last long...and a new machine never materialize...

So the Boss hired another big name Foreman....he had a look around and blamed everyone for being incompetent and began shouting at the Boss and waited to be asked to leave with his severance pay.

Now the Boss is all alone in his shiny new factory wondering what to do.

The Stakeholders are not happy and are beginning to ask for answers....

 

[Gazza]

Levy (the boss) completely failed to provide any backing or support to his Senior long serving Foreman or the Machine. Despite this Poch got us to the ridiculous position of the CL Final.
When all the cogs on machine were worn out.

Then Levy blame Poch for the poor performance of the machine and sacked him for not maintaining the same quality of output.

The stakeholders (fans) accepted the decision as they looked forward to the promise of a new superior Foreman and a better machine in shinny new factory.

The new Foreman didn't understand the product and thought he new what was needed more than everyone else....he didn't last long...and a new machine never materialize...

So the Boss hired another big name Foreman....he had a look around and blamed everyone for being incompetent and began shouting at the Boss and waited to be asked to leave with his severance pay.

Now the Boss is all alone in his shiny new factory wondering what to do.

The Stakeholders are not happy and are beginning to ask for answers....

Then Sonny jumped out of the cabinet, much to Levys shock, as sonny screamed out "Supplies!" ...

I'm a fan this year is the year ....

 

[Raziel]

As I say without the full context of what was actually going on and what was achieved, there was no reasonable football case for his sacking unless he had said to Levy I've had enough. Or Levy looked him in the eye and saw he was going to breakdown.

But even if I humour you and say yes it was the correct decision. Why not appoint someone like Ten Haag who could have completed the rebuild that Poch said then and now in hindsight is so clear was needed.

Different question, only logical answer (none of us know) is we felt stadium money with immediate manager could give a short term result (and we tried it twice)

I'm assuming we are going back into a build something mode

p.s. still not convinced by ETH, got a lot of backing and his team setup is still very naïve (they are way too open), as it was at Ajax, not sure it works in the PL in the long run

 

[Robspur12]

Slot got his team to a European final last season
He could have won the Dutch league with as before it got called off
And his team are winning the league this season
The guy has a much better CV than Poch arguably now because he will have won things the hardest way, by toppling a much richer, bigger club
It would have been the equivalent of Poch winning the league with us
And I’d love Poch to come back but we shouldn’t write off other options

just to qualify that it was the Europa Conference League final (ok better than Conte did for us) but very much the minor tournament of Europe. I'd say his CV at the moment is weaker than Jol's was when he took over at Spurs. I am sorry mate I just don't feel he has done enough to yet warrant taking over at Spurs challenging at the top end of the PL Table. I mean of course I could be completely wrong. For the record I think Unai Emery would have been a brilliant shout too had he not gone to Aston Villa. They have pulled off quite a coup imho.

 

[Mcfee]

just to qualify that it was the Europa Conference League final (ok better than Conte did for us) but very much the minor tournament of Europe. I'd say his CV at the moment is weaker than Jol's was when he took over at Spurs. I am sorry mate I just don't feel he has done enough to yet warrant taking over at Spurs challenging at the top end of the PL Table. I mean of course I could be completely wrong. For the record I think Unai Emery would have been a brilliant shout too had he not gone to Aston Villa. They have pulled off quite a coup imho.

Give Slot another week or 2 then he’ll have taken Feyenoord to a league title. Slightly better than anything Jol had done I would say.
Also about Emery, it’s easy to be wise in hindsight (and also to jump to conclusions too quickly) but if we’d hired Emery I doubt if it would’ve gone down too well with a lot of our supporters.