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Jose Mourinho - SACKED

Bedfordspurs said:
Teams are not scoring against us with 60/70% possession. I’ve shown that in games before. They may have a brief spell with the ball
The way his tactics work before at other clubs worked because the defenders didn’t make basic errors consistently.
But their has to be a balance and we’re no where near that currently
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I would be surprised if Jose’s old teams didn’t tend to dominate possession by and large.
 
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Worth looking at when we concede goals abs how’s that’s changed since peak Poch when it was quite a flat line

we’re a one half team defensively it seems
I guess this season we have seen that more
 
Bedfordspurs said:
It’s not words. It’s my recollection of the many many games I went too
We had poor games vs teams like Burnley because we couldn’t break them down
We always struggled to get over the line at palace despite getting the wins by the odd goals because we struggled to break them downs and relied on worldly strikes
It’s hard to beat teams who dig in if they don’t make mistakes. We have shown that ourselves this season when we have done just that
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There is always going to be the odd game. But I’m pretty sure that overall our record against the smaller teams was good until his last season when, as I say, we became the pressed as opposed to the presser.
 
Finney Is Back said:
I would be surprised if Jose’s old teams didn’t tend to dominate possession by and large.
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Pass
I know they’re didn’t make the errors we have done though
I mean when you look at the 5-3 win vs his league title winning side we scored 4 great goals and a penalty
None were from a keeper or CB not taking charge or a silly full back being out of position
We had Kane’s brilliant long range strike. Roses goal after a great pass and move from Eriksen and Chadli. The penalty. Then Kane and Chadli with similar very good goals. There were errors in the defending but not letting people have taps in like we have been doing lately
 
Finney Is Back said:
There is always going to be the odd game. But I’m pretty sure that overall our record against the smaller teams was good until his last season when, as I say, we became the pressed as opposed to the presser.
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Yeah we definitely changed styles
The players looked lost and didn’t know what to do
 
Bedfordspurs said:
View attachment 10847 View attachment 10848 View attachment 10849

Worth looking at when we concede goals abs how’s that’s changed since peak Poch when it was quite a flat line

we’re a one half team defensively it seems
I guess this season we have seen that more
Click to expand...
So we’ve gone from an expected goal difference of +31 in 2016-17 to an expected goal difference of +2 (so equate to +4 for the full season)? Wow.... that really does show how bad Jose has us playing.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Pass
I know they’re didn’t make the errors we have done though
I mean when you look at the 5-3 win vs his league title winning side we scored 4 great goals and a pelanty
None were from a keeper or CB not taking charge or a silly full back being out of position
We had Kane’s brilliant long range strike. Roses goal after a great pass and move from Eriksen and Chadli. The pelanty. Then Kane and Chadli with similar very good goals. There were errors in the defending but not letting people have taps in like we have been doing lately
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I’m not really sure what point you are arguing to be honest Bedford?
 
Finney Is Back said:
I’m not really sure what point you are arguing to be honest Bedford?
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You were talking about his old teams having possession. I said I couldn’t comment as I didn’t know
What I do know is his old teams didn’t concede goals as meekly and as weakly as us. Even when we pummelled them 5-3 we still scored 4. Very good goals
Hence my view he has never had a team that defends as bad as ours yet... but we like to be the first
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Yeah we definitely changed styles
The players looked lost and didn’t know what to do
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a) The players were tired from overuse due to the lack of investment in the squad.
b) There were players still there that wanted out but Poch had to keep in the squad due to it being so small. Never good to keep players that want out.
c) There were players still there that Poch wanted out that he had to keep in the squad due to it being so small. Never good to keep players that want out.
d) We let good players who were absolutely key to our gameplan go/decline without replacing them (e.g. Dembele and Wanyama).
e) Several, very good, completely gettable players were not secured by the chairman allowing the squad to stagnate/dwindle in quality (I.e. Mane, Wjinaldum, Grealish, Bruno Fernandes).
e) (I think) Poch was trying to convert to a diamond formation and the players he signed/wanted were all a good fit for that (Ndombele and Lo Celso as the right/left of the diamond and Sess as the attacking left back for example). He didn’t really get the time to develop this as the players were signed late/injured. The chairman panicked and got rid of him before we had a chance to see Poch’s new vision with the new players in and adapted to the PL.
 
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Bedfordspurs said:
You were talking about his old teams having possession. I said I couldn’t comment as I didn’t know
What I do know is his old teams didn’t concede goals as meekly and as weakly as us. Even when we pummelled them 5-3 we still scored 4. Very good goals
Hence my view he has never had a team that defends as bad as ours yet... but we like to be the first
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We don’t really know as we didn’t watch those teams week in, week out like we do Spurs. I bet his teams all had much higher XG and scored more goals than we are right now though....
 
Finney Is Back said:
So we’ve gone from an expected goal difference of +31 in 2016-17 to an expected goal difference of +2 (so equate to +4 for the full season)? Wow.... that really does show how bad Jose has us playing.
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Yep
But compared to 2017/2018 Poch it’s plus 10 ish so a steady decline as last season was -2 ish
 
Finney Is Back said:
We don’t really know as we didn’t watch those teams week in, week out like we do Spurs. I bet his teams all had much higher XG and scored more goals than we are right now though....
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Well they were better teams than our team. They won the league. We didn’t so it’s a natural difference isn’t it
 
DeanoAustin said:
He's improved Hugo, Aurier, Dier, Davies, Ndombele for me. Without question. He's also developed Harry and Sonny's games.
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Hugo was injured and recovered.

All of them are of a good footballing standard but are very up and down performance-wise, it's all very normal. Mourinho has improved them but it looks to be very short term, look where we are now.
All manager should "improve" players "performance-wise" on a day to day period, these players were excellent 'at times' under Poch, yes but not all the time, I agree.
There are very few managers that "improve" players in the long term. Klopp ATM would be top IMHO with the likes of Salah etc

Bottom line if they are all improved why do they all look so poor?

As an aside, Ndombele looked like a very troubled and agitated young man before he got "injured" and headed off at Brighton.
 
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Finney Is Back said:
Sorry, again I am at a loss to what you are arguing?
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Your saying their stats will be better
No surprise as they were a better team
They won the league
I mean if you win the league your better than the other teams
By the way Chelsea had 55.8% average possession when they won the league in 2015, so 7% more than us currently and on par with peak Poch from what I can see
 
harr1984 said:
Must be my imagination the amount of ex players I’ve seen credit him with improving them:D A quick google search and you could see for yourself. I’m all for criticising the guy for legitimate tactical errors etc but let’s not make things up....
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Players always say things like that about the Mourihos of this world. It just PR.

e.g. Makelele was always a good player.
 
StephenH said:
Please excuse any grammar roosterups.
Hugo was injured and recovered.

All of them are of a good footballing standard but are very up and down performance-wise, it's all very normal. Mourinho has improved them but looks to be very short term, look where we are now.
All manager should "improve" players "performance-wise" on a day to day period, these players were excellent 'at times' under Poch, yes but not all the time, I agree.
There are very few managers that "improve" players in the long term. Klopp ATM would be top IMHO with the likes of Salad etc

Bottom line if they are all improved why do they all look so poor?

As an aside, Ndombele looked like a very troubled and agitated young man before he got "injured" and headed off at Brighton.
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He looked angry because he was getting takes down his Achilles three times
Nothing to do with anything else IMO
I do agree with your comment about the players being improved though
Out of the old bunch only Aurier has got better, than he was before Jose. The rest have stagnated at best
Can’t realign compare Gio as he never played under Poch and Tanguy has got better as Poch said he would.
The rest have been average at best having some good to great games and some shockers
 
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