Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
I could be wrong but that looked like an overhit pass to Perisic than happened to run through for Sessegnon.
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Eric Dier
- Thread starter Jordinho
- Start date
Bedfordspurs
Mark Falco
It was
But it was a ball into the danger zone whipped with pace
Exactly what we were missing as teams can’t defend it
I’m rewatching the second half over lunch and Dier played rwb form what I can see. Even Neville talks about it
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
Wasn’t the worst pass I’ve ever seen. Could have been better but the goal is on Dier.
Should've said the league, but yes, that was a bad mistake
Bedfordspurs
Mark Falco
Both to blame, Hugo too
Dier has the most though I’d agree
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
Lloris has also been shaky. That affects the team if they don’t have confidence in the GK. as a unit we’ve not been strong enough, too many individual mistakes too. I wouldn’t be against going after a new GK with the view to replace Lloris and let them fight it out for the spot. Same for Dier. One good season out of about 6 isn’t good enough.
Bedfordspurs
Mark Falco
Hugo twice yesterday went to run out and stopped
He isn’t instilling any confidence in the team as you say
Dier last season playing once a week we saw his peak not seeing that now playing every 3 days
90291Spur
Paul Walsh
Hugo also had his part in that particular comedy of errors. And wow, we have given up A LOT of super sloppy goals this season.
thfcsteff
George Hunt
If you are prepared to accept a 'potential'upgrade ( BTW I don't agree on Ndicka
) then fine. I am not. I understand the nuance of your comment (i.e. Levy not investing in top replacements) but if we want to keep Conte we must. Bastoni. Skriner. That calibre. Poch tried this several years ago thinking he had amassed enough currency in the 'bank'. He sadly found he hadn't until it was too late, and when he did partially get what he wanted, patience deserted everyone. We both know Conte won't stand for it. We go big or accept the consequences IMO.
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thfcsteff
George Hunt
You'll see that Wed night. Prayer hands will be needed in Nottingham. Be careful what you wish for...
thfcsteff
George Hunt
I have no issue criticizing a mistake. I have a great issue with people using a mistake as a defining characteristic. Try watching how many times Romero has been covered this season when making poor decisions or playing poor passes. There is no-one covering Dier because he is usually the cover/experience/marshaller back there. Again, yesterday's mistake was horrible. But saying he's had 'one good season in six' @Jurgen the German? Come on now...https://tbrfootball.com/cristian-ro...r-for-helping-him-settle-in-at-tottenham/?amp
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
2016/17 and 2021/22 were good seasons for him. The rest weren’t IMO. So 2 good seasons out of 6 then
inconsistent under Poch and poor under Jose, not great so far this season either. You rate him a lot higher than most and that’s fine, but we’ve all seen enough of him to make our minds up Steff. I like his desire and commitment but his limitations on the ball and his tendency to make mistakes will always prevent him being a top CB. If he wants to play CB every week he needs to move on and play for another club IMO. I’d upgrade him, Royal and Lloris in the next two windows as a priority along with someone like Maddison.
El Guepardo
Rafael Van Der Vaart
The frequency of his mistakes. His defensive technique and that his mistakes are often so costly is why he gets so heavily criticised.
He has history of being a watcher and too passive. He will stand there, not engage and watch. In some situations that’s a good thing if he’s covering rather than being the active defender but in others he needs to step up. He needs to be more aggressive with his defending. He needs to think like a defender. Against Saudi Sportswashing Machine, when he froze for Wilson’s goal, that is unacceptable for a centre back. With Lloris coming out, he needed to get himself back on the goal line to cover. Instead he froze when Lloris and Wilson met, as if he was expecting a freekick. He then half ran back and stopped on the penalty spot. He should have sprinted back. Then covered the line. So why did he not play to the whistle? Basic mistake that cost us.
He also cost us with the headed throughball to Salah at the weekend.
He was better second half against Liverpool playing more as a right back and carrying the ball forwards. If he plays there then his mistakes will generally be less costly and hr can distribute the ball better. He’s not a bad footballer, he’s just not a centre back.
Bishop
John Lacy
Tbh I don't really rate Dier or Sanchez so whomever is picked I don't expect much.
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thfcsteff
George Hunt
2016/17 and 2021/22 were good seasons for him. The rest weren’t IMO. So 2 good seasons out of 6 then
The only thing I'd reply to you mate, and @El Guepardo, is that in that 'minority' I sit with are Pochettino, Mourinho, Mason, Nuno, Conte, and Southgate.
If we sign James Maddison I do not believe it will be a Conte signing. He does not fit what Conte wants.
El Guepardo
Rafael Van Der Vaart
Conte plays Dier as we don’t have a better alternative. Hopefully he will look for an upgrade in the January transfer window.
Pochettino played Dier in defensive midfield or right back.
I don’t rate Nuno or Southgate as top level managers. Mourinho was a top level manager and I’m sure he spoke out about how weak our defence was and that we kept making basic defensive mistakes and Dier was part of that unit. He also had an even more defensive stance than Conte. We sat back almost all game towards the end of his tenure. All that coming from the collapse against West Ham due to defensive mistakes.
I appreciate that you stand and support all of our players @thfcsteff. You are a good man, a good supporter, but I can’t agree with you on the appraisal of Eric Dier here.
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
Yeah I mean all football fans trust managers when they happen to pick players that they rate.
Dier played in multiple positions under Poch and never made any of them his own, was replaced by Wanyama at DM which was his preferred position at the time. Struggled under Jose and Nuno. Did very well last season I have to say. The mistakes have started to creep back in this season under Conte and for England too. He’s fortunate that he can cover multiple positions but he doesn’t really excel in any of them.
Just had a look in to our transfers at CB since we left WHL
17/18 : Sanchez
18/19: N/A
19/20 : N/A
20/21 : Rodon
21/22 : Romero
Essentially there was no succession planning for the departures of Vertonghen & Alderweireld and we've still not addressed the position adequately.
Sanchez was an attempt to plan for life after them i suppose it's fair to say, but by the time they had moved on it was obvious he was not at the level required - and here we are still relying on 2 players that were back ups during our best years. Not Dier or Davies fault that the club haven't strengthened adequately over a number of years, but if we're going to move forwards we to start upgrading these positions across the team.
17/18 : Sanchez
18/19: N/A
19/20 : N/A
20/21 : Rodon
21/22 : Romero
Essentially there was no succession planning for the departures of Vertonghen & Alderweireld and we've still not addressed the position adequately.
Sanchez was an attempt to plan for life after them i suppose it's fair to say, but by the time they had moved on it was obvious he was not at the level required - and here we are still relying on 2 players that were back ups during our best years. Not Dier or Davies fault that the club haven't strengthened adequately over a number of years, but if we're going to move forwards we to start upgrading these positions across the team.
glasgowspur
Luka Modric
Jan and toby were always going to be a tough act to follow, our lack of effort there is baffling.
Junior19
Øyvind Leonhardsen
We all want upgrades! On most positions.
Ok, so we upgrade Dier with player X, who is fractionally better on some aspects, equal on other, and fractionally worse on others. That still leaves us with liabilities in the positions behind him. Main problem as I see it is the lack of quality in depth. It has several knock-on effects, mainly that our first string players _cannot_ be rested as much as they should, "rest" usually means they are already injured. Secondly, lack of _real_ competition is a weakness.
I'm certain that had Dier (and Romero, for that matter) had a genuine competition for the position it would do them good.
Replacing Dier now, without fixing that, only shifts the problem a notch instead of solving it.
So unless we can (by magic, hypnosis, or plain witchcraft from Conte) make Davinson Sanches a consistent, safe and thrustworthy player, we need to start the replacement process in that end, not the other way around.
Sure, there are better defenders than Dier out there.
However, strip away those who do not want/need to move (ie. already at so-called "bigger" clubs and are first choice/regulars there) and those who are first choice at our peers, and you're left with those few who are either a slight upgrade, a talent or a gamble. The rest are just same sh*t, different wrapping, in my opinion.
The potential to upgrade our second string to someone who can genuinely challenge our first choice players are much better. If Dier should find such a challenge to his position to much to handle, and wants to leave, thats a different matter.
Ok, so we upgrade Dier with player X, who is fractionally better on some aspects, equal on other, and fractionally worse on others. That still leaves us with liabilities in the positions behind him. Main problem as I see it is the lack of quality in depth. It has several knock-on effects, mainly that our first string players _cannot_ be rested as much as they should, "rest" usually means they are already injured. Secondly, lack of _real_ competition is a weakness.
I'm certain that had Dier (and Romero, for that matter) had a genuine competition for the position it would do them good.
Replacing Dier now, without fixing that, only shifts the problem a notch instead of solving it.
So unless we can (by magic, hypnosis, or plain witchcraft from Conte) make Davinson Sanches a consistent, safe and thrustworthy player, we need to start the replacement process in that end, not the other way around.
Sure, there are better defenders than Dier out there.
However, strip away those who do not want/need to move (ie. already at so-called "bigger" clubs and are first choice/regulars there) and those who are first choice at our peers, and you're left with those few who are either a slight upgrade, a talent or a gamble. The rest are just same sh*t, different wrapping, in my opinion.
The potential to upgrade our second string to someone who can genuinely challenge our first choice players are much better. If Dier should find such a challenge to his position to much to handle, and wants to leave, thats a different matter.