Djed Spence

[braineclipse]

I think we forget sometimes that Udogie is only 22 and has yet to hit his peak, he should return when fit and Spence can move over to RB. As for Porro I think he can be a player who would look very good in M/F as his range of passing is very good.

Agreed on Udogie. And like quite a few of our players the lack of options, or lack of options the manager rates and trusts, probably has contributed to him looking worse.

We need all of Porro, Udogie and Spence at full back. Giving us the option of subs/rotation when we get back to two games a week.

Porro looks good "in midfield" when he inverts there, part of what makes him a really good full back for this system.

 

[spurspinter1]

Remember when Spence was another stone to throw at Levy? A “club signing” some fans used it as a criticism of Levy sticking his oar in.

That was probably inaccurate then. But I do t see any contrite fans praising Levy for his signing now.

That's because if we'd have bought the right players for Conte when needed, we could have been a serious team.

Spence has come good in a bad team that is unlikely to achieve much. We'll praise Levy if the formula of lurching one direction and then another without giving any of the managers needed what they need eventually pays off (beyond on the spreadsheets).

 

[billyiddo]

That's because if we'd have bought the right players for Conte when needed, we could have been a serious team.

Spence has come good in a bad team that is unlikely to achieve much. We'll praise Levy if the formula of lurching one direction and then another without giving any of the managers needed what they need eventually pays off (beyond on the spreadsheets).

I don't really see how Spence wasn't the type of player that Conte needed - considering he's a very good RWB and Conte needed a RWB

 

[harr1984]

That's because if we'd have bought the right players for Conte when needed, we could have been a serious team.

Spence has come good in a bad team that is unlikely to achieve much. We'll praise Levy if the formula of lurching one direction and then another without giving any of the managers needed what they need eventually pays off (beyond on the spreadsheets).

I like you was a big fan of Conte, but there are very few coaches in the world who get all the players they want and are instances where you have to make do with what you have especially when you are paid as handsomely as he is.

And looking at Spence's attributes there was no reason Conte couldn't have moulded him into a seriously good RWB, he did it with Victor Moses FFS He definitely cut off his nose to spite his face when it came to Spence....

 

[spurspinter1]

I don't really see how Spence wasn't the type of player that Conte needed - considering he's a very good RWB and Conte needed a RWB

If he keeps up the current form and the team he plays for achieves something, I bet Spence would be on a potential shopping list for Conte. But at the time he needed Porro a lot earlier, not a kid who had excelled in the championship. It's like if we bought Gray under Antonio, play to the crowd if the crowd is an intensively passionate and melodramatic true winner. He wants the Gray we'll hopefully be seeing in 4/5 years, if it is a fault on his part at least he wears it on his sleeve.

I like you was a big fan of Conte, but there are very few coaches in the world who get all the players they want and are instances where you have to make do with what you have especially when you are paid as handsomely as he is.

And looking at Spence's attributes there was no reason Conte couldn't have moulded him into a seriously good RWB, he did it with Victor Moses FFS He definitely cut off his nose to spite his face when it came to Spence....

I think my response to Bill probably covers my thoughts on it. He'll be a great RWB for Conte's system, no doubt, but he didn't want prospects to develop, he wanted men.

It's a weird time for "the Conte's a bastard man crowd" (obviously not you mate!) to be chirping, a good time to read the situation rather than the room atm. Taking Napoli this far in a title race is impressive, if he wins it it'll speak volumes, but there's a long way to go.

 

[SpurMeUp]

That's because if we'd have bought the right players for Conte when needed, we could have been a serious team.

Spence has come good in a bad team that is unlikely to achieve much. We'll praise Levy if the formula of lurching one direction and then another without giving any of the managers needed what they need eventually pays off (beyond on the spreadsheets).

So you also think we shouldn’t have singed Spence. Okay

 

[SpurMeUp]

No I didn't prefer we didn't sign Spence again you're making up brick and attributing it to me.

I preferred we didn't hire Conte in the first place. Why hire Conte if you're gonna buy a Spence, that's not the kind of player he would sign or play.

If you actually read my posts you would know I do want to sign Spence's I've complained for years that we don't.

This is black and white. The club shouldn't have signed Spence, or it was a well scouted signing that has come good? Which is it?

You can’t have it both ways where you’re criticising Levy for signing the player, saying we shouldn’t have, but also saying we should have signed him

 

[SpurMeUp]

We also do Postecoglou a bit of a disservice here. He’s brought through Spence where multiple other managers haven’t. Clearly it wasn’t a plug and play job. There were issues and it needed care and time. The idea that Conte had to play him is a bit naive too.

Personally I’m glad we signed him as he’s fuking awesome. Funny how people are so tied to their arguments they will tie themselves in all sorts of knots rather than hold their hands up and say: I’m glad the club signed this player, I was wrong.

 

[P.D.]

Wouldn't be surprised if Spence gets an England call up this year. We're not as stocked at FB as we were the last few years.

 

[markysimmo]

Wouldn't be surprised if Spence gets an England call up this year. We're not as stocked at FB as we were the last few years.

Totally agree
Lewis-Skelly and Hall/Livramento have all done well this year so England defo have more than in recent times
I would go for Lewis Skelly on the left and Spence on the right

 

[billyiddo]

If he keeps up the current form and the team he plays for achieves something, I bet Spence would be on a potential shopping list for Conte. But at the time he needed Porro a lot earlier, not a kid who had excelled in the championship. It's like if we bought Gray under Antonio, play to the crowd if the crowd is an intensively passionate and melodramatic true winner. He wants the Gray we'll hopefully be seeing in 4/5 years, if it is a fault on his part at least he wears it on his sleeve.



I think my response to Bill probably covers my thoughts on it. He'll be a great RWB for Conte's system, no doubt, but he didn't want prospects to develop, he wanted men.

It's a weird time for "the Conte's a bastard man crowd" (obviously not you mate!) to be chirping, a good time to read the situation rather than the room atm. Taking Napoli this far in a title race is impressive, if he wins it it'll speak volumes, but there's a long way to go.

I have little sympathy or tolerance for managers who are not prepared to adapt to the circumstances of the club they are managing at - as much as I agree with @Bishop that the club should have known what Conte was like ahead of time (literally moans and falls out about transfers everywhere) he himself also should know what he was walking in to joining THFC, i doubt Conte would have been given the impression ahead of joining us that he'll get his primary targets in every position - so to throw your toys out of the pram over an alternative signing that actually ticked the majority of boxes is poor form.

 

[Muttley]

It's interesting reading the Spence conversation and not really piecing together the entire RB story at Spurs. When you think back, Trips was bought before Walker left in 2017 and then Aurier was bought in 2017. So we had Trips / Aurier and the emerging KWP, plus we bought Foyth.

However it was in 2021 that things changed. Trips left in 2019, KWP left in 2020 and in the summer of 2021 we then sold Foyth as well. We then signed Emerson on the last day of the transfer window in 2021, and tore up Aurier's contract. Spence joined in summer 2022 and Porro didn't join until Jan 2023.

This is definitely why Spurs haven't won trophies. We finished the 16/17 season with the league's best RB and an able deputy. It has then taken us to now before we can stand behind the credibility of our 2 RBs. That is 7 or 8 years of messing about. RB has been about the most unstable position in our side, and that is saying something.

Let's hope we can go 5 years with some stability from these 2. Perhaps if we sign a fantastic LB, we'll have this stability on both sides.

 

[Lemonade Money]

Or maybe something with Spence has clicked? Why didn't Conte, Ange at first, Rennais, Leeds, or Genoa want to keep him either on loan or permanent?
First rule of management is you can't let one player get away with something (be it time keeping, attitude, discipline etc.) otherwise they all will and it undermines your authority, so maybe it was something like that? The fact that managers will do everything in their power to form a winning team, and Spence is obviously a weapon, means there was some sort of barrier, and the common denominator is Spence.

 

[Muttley]

Or maybe something with Spence has clicked? Why didn't Conte, Ange at first, Rennais, Leeds, or Genoa want to keep him either on loan or permanent?
First rule of management is you can't let one player get away with something (be it time keeping, attitude, discipline etc.) otherwise they all will and it undermines your authority, so maybe it was something like that? The fact that managers will do everything in their power to form a winning team, and Spence is obviously a weapon, means there was some sort of barrier, and the common denominator is Spence.

I've never seen any evidence for that narrative about Spence though. I saw some Warnock comments a few years prior, but nothing to stain Spence's reputation since he moved Boro. In reality what probably happened is that Spurs had no UEFA football and were left with Porro, Emerson and Spence. Ange may have even wanted Porro and Spence last season, but didn't upset the apple cart with Emerson who was a model pro himself.

 

[Lemonade Money]

I've never seen any evidence for that narrative about Spence though. I saw some Warnock comments a few years prior, but nothing to stain Spence's reputation since he moved Boro. In reality what probably happened is that Spurs had no UEFA football and were left with Porro, Emerson and Spence. Ange may have even wanted Porro and Spence last season, but didn't upset the apple cart with Emerson who was a model pro himself.

The evidence is all the teams that had a look and said no.
Then you come up with a conclusion with even less evidence.

 

[harr1984]

I've never seen any evidence for that narrative about Spence though. I saw some Warnock comments a few years prior, but nothing to stain Spence's reputation since he moved Boro. In reality what probably happened is that Spurs had no UEFA football and were left with Porro, Emerson and Spence. Ange may have even wanted Porro and Spence last season, but didn't upset the apple cart with Emerson who was a model pro himself.

There is rarely any concrete evidence about someones attitude, just talk obviously. Why do you think Leeds chose to terminate his loan early, and he to be loaned out instantly again?

 

[LutonSpurs]

Based on not knowing if the player has just buckled down and completely changed his attitude (would have to give credit for Ange and Djed for that) - Or, they ignored an absolute baller in a position we need depth (unlikely). I reckon nobody is really sure but more likely something good has happened (better late than never) and as Spurs fans we do not know how to enjoy it (trauma response)

 

[SpurMeUp]

There is rarely any concrete evidence about someones attitude, just talk obviously. Why do you think Leeds chose to terminate his loan early, and he to be loaned out instantly again?

If this isn't evidence, idk what is? That 4 or so managers didn't use him. Seems pretty cut and dry there was issues - as Warnock corroborated. No evidence at all!

 

[billyiddo]

]

The evidence is all the teams that had a look and said no.
Then you come up with a conclusion with even less evidence.

What do you mean said no? Did we loan him out with a view to selling him or was it to gain experience? If the latter then it's only Conte who cast him aside and that was politically motivated

 

[harr1984]

]

What do you mean said no? Did we loan him out with a view to selling him or was it to gain experience? If the latter then it's only Conte who cast him aside and that was politically motivated

Genoa apparently had an option to buy for 8.5m....