American politics

[spurspinter1]

I mean we're nearing WW3 at the moment, Biden hasn't done much in the middle east for example yet has the ultimate leverage in weapons - that cost them hugely I think.

I'm still surprised but Harris had a terrible campaign, didn't do any interviews for ages then when she did said she wouldn't change anything about the last 4 years and couldn't give a straight answer about anything. Seems a bit out of touch having every rally packed with celebrities as well.

Out of touch like Hulk Hogan, Kid Rock and Tucker Carlson?

And were you impressed by Trump's interviews? It literally didn't matter what he said, he has the best policies / solutions / words, he said so himself...

This does all feel a bit nightmare-ish, how many people there are that are comfortable voting for a convicted felon, sex offender and all round general vile person. If these are the characteristics to be rewarded what kind of example does it set to young people? Be a clam and you'll go far in life. At least it not Boris Johnson and Donald Trump levels of fudgery but it's still an embarrassing day for humanity.

 

[johnola]

I hope Spurs do as well under Trump this time round as they did last time.

 

[Grays_1890]

I suppose we've learned that people are still susceptible to demagogues, and to having spacegoats on which to blame all of their ills; to being told that there are simple answers to highly complex problems; and that we are now in a world in which one or two highly wealthy individuals can hugely influence the outcome of elections by controlling the media - in particular social media.

It's worrying when it come to Farage and Reform.

"You have it bad, you know why, not because we let your once thriving industries decline......nope its because of that brown bloke over there"

Being played by Musk and his cronies for sure, people can't see past it all to accept they are being played. Its worrying we have such a thick society on both sides of the pond

 

[SpurMeUp]

His way of ending the war will be to cut off funding so Ukraine can’t fight back.

Ukraine is slowly losing the war currently. Are you advocating throwing more lives away, to slow down what is occurring now, and to line the pockets of arms companies? There should be a more nuanced way forward than just stopping funding. Shouldn't we aspire to talk? Finding a solution. Ukrainians themselves don't want to throw more innocent lives and destruction of the country. For what? Sovereignty. Or to serve Natos empire-like aims against Putin? Ukraine is run by its own Oligarchs - that should be the fight to transform the country.

Note: I am putting this side of things forward, because the other side of the argument you know. There are complexities, there are other considerations than the dominant western narrative - which is valid too.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

"You have it bad, you know why, not because we left your once thriving industries decline......nope its because of that brown bloke over there"

Being played by Musk and his cronies for sure, people can't see past it all to accept they are being played. Its worrying we have such a thick society on both sides of the pond

Yep
So fudging scary
Almost as of the rich tell the poor to look at people poorer than them and see what they will do to them
Meanwhile moline the poor for more and more
What a shambles

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Had a few calls already with my teams in Poland
I fly out to Krakow next week
They are all quite distraught today
They know what’s on their doorstep and they also know better than most what can happen when a nutter takes over

 

[SpurMeUp]

If someone invades your country would you not fight back? And let's be clear it is Putin throwing his young men into the meatgrinder of war too. That is his main tactic. Appeasing Putin will only expand the war to somewhere else.

You seem fine with Russian lives lost? I am against war. You seem engaged by it, and support it. If you are unable to see the other side, and to look at ways forward, there is just ongoing war. The whole premise of us using Ukraine as a buffer to Putin is hugely flawed in itself.

I believe that everyone who instigates war should have to send one of their family to the front to fight. If that was the case for you, would you be so shy in suing for peace?

 

[Baleforce]

Ukraine is slowly losing the war currently. Are you advocating throwing more lives away, to slow down what is occuring now, and to line the pockets of arms companies? There should be a more nuanced way forward that just stopping funding. Shouldn't we aspire to talk? Finding a solution. Ukrainians themselves don't want to throw more innocent lives and destruction of the country. For what? Sovereignty. Or to serve Natos empire-like aims against Putin? Ukraine is run by its own Oligarchs - that should be the fight to transform the country.

Note: I am putthing this side of things forward, because the other side of the argument you know. There are complexities, there are other considerations than the dominant western narrative - which is valid too.

I’m advocating Ukraine winning it and taking all of their land back, you can’t appease Putin, if he’s not stopped in Ukraine he’ll keep rolling west.

 

[SpurMeUp]

I mean we're nearing WW3 at the moment, Biden hasn't done much in the middle east for example yet has the ultimate leverage in weapons - that cost them hugely I think.

I'm still surprised but Harris had a terrible campaign, didn't do any interviews for ages then when she did said she wouldn't change anything about the last 4 years and couldn't give a straight answer about anything. Seems a bit out of touch having every rally packed with celebrities as well.

Yes. We should not necessarily accept the status quo. Isreal is killing innocent people using US democrat support. The US is also funding a forlorn war in Ukraine. And because of political affiliations, we should just do the same thing? Because its Trump we should put our own biases first, and not pursue peace? Crazy how people's biases override sense and compassion.

 

[SpurMeUp]

I’m advocating Ukraine winning it and taking all of their land back, you can’t appease Putin, if he’s not stopped in Ukraine he’ll keep rolling west.

Advocate away. But it is more deluded than Trump. Which is damning is it not? Thou8sands of young lives being lost, you want to double down. Throw more in the mix? If your kids were fighting and your nations infrastructure was on the line, you'd feel the same?

 

[Baleforce]

Advocate away. But it is more deluded than Trump. Which is damning is it not? Thou8sands of young lives being lost, you want to double down. Throw more in the mix? If your kids were fighting and your nations infrastructure was on the line, you'd feel the same?

I think not fighting will lead to more dead long term.

 

[Craig_J]

I thought Trump would win this for very similar reasons to why he beat Clinton

But I didn’t expect him to get the popular vote as it appears he has done convincingly.

 

[SpurMeUp]

I think not fighting will lead to more dead long term.

So we are using Ukrainian lives 'just in case'. We don't know that Putin would keep going and threaten Poland etc. That seems unlikely. Ukraine is a nation that isn't a million miles from Scotland and its relationship with England.

There is also disregard for the history of the cold war and the break up of the soviet block.

 

[DubSpur]

You seem fine with Russian lives lost? I am against war. You seem engaged by it, and support it. If you are unable to see the other side, and to look at ways forward, there is just ongoing war. The whole premise of us using Ukraine as a buffer to Putin is hugely flawed in itself.

I believe that everyone who instigates war should have to send one of their family to the front to fight. If that was the case for you, would you be so shy in suing for peace?

I doubt anyone on here wants to see more lives lost. But appeasing Putin will just make him bolder. There are ex-Russian and ex-Soviet states that he wants to make part of Russia again. IF he gets away with it in Ukraine there's just going to be another war with one of these countries. Somewhere like Molodova that has a large Russian minority will be accused of oppressing Russians and he'll send in troops there to claim that he is only protecting Russians.
If NATO and Biden had called Putins bluff and given Ukraine what they need to win this would be over already.

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

Advocate away. But it is more deluded than Trump. Which is damning is it not? Thou8sands of young lives being lost, you want to double down. Throw more in the mix? If your kids were fighting and your nations infrastructure was on the line, you'd feel the same?

No one likes loss of life, especially those close to them.
Sometimes humanity has to double down for the sake of just that....humanity.

At Munich, Chamberlain got an international agreement that Hitler should have the Sudetenland in exchange for Germany making no further demands for land in Europe. Chamberlain said it was 'Peace for our time'. Hitler said he had 'No more territorial demands to make in Europe

 

[Grays_1890]

Advocate away. But it is more deluded than Trump. Which is damning is it not? Thou8sands of young lives being lost, you want to double down. Throw more in the mix? If your kids were fighting and your nations infrastructure was on the line, you'd feel the same?

So playing devils advocate, what are you suggesting as part of your peace process? Allow Putin to have Ukraine and take it back into his control against the will of every Ukrainian? Or just ask him very nicely to stop?

I get you are anti war, I am myself, but I struggle to understand what you are expecting to happen that not only stops the war but is also fair

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

The market seems happy with the result unless they had already priced in his victory.

Main thing is my personal wealth, my crypto is up, though I worry for ripple after they donated to Harris. Trump is a vindictive cnut. He will probably go after them.

Rest of my crypto bag is looking pretty.

 

[Rorschach]

You seem fine with Russian lives lost? I am against war. You seem engaged by it, and support it. If you are unable to see the other side, and to look at ways forward, there is just ongoing war. The whole premise of us using Ukraine as a buffer to Putin is hugely flawed in itself.

I believe that everyone who instigates war should have to send one of their family to the front to fight. If that was the case for you, would you be so shy in suing for peace?

You are putting words in my mouth again mate. We're done here.

 

[SpurMeUp]

So playing devils advocate, what are you suggesting as part of your peace process? Allow Putin to have Ukraine and take it back into his control against the will of every Ukrainian?

Where are you getting this from? If Trump made such a sweeping statement it would be lambasted. I just mentioned two Ukrainians who are hoping Trump will end the war. I don't think you appreciate the desperation and fatigue that Ukrainian people feel now.

Or just ask him very nicely to stop?

You're suggesting we should not talk and try to find a peaceful solution?

I get you are anti war, I am myself, but I struggle to understand what you are expecting to happen that not only stops the war but is also fair

We were looking at Trumps approach vs the current Democrat approach. The auto "Trump is a loon" narrative is more important to liberal observers than people's lives and the stark reality - that is my point.

 

[Muttley]

So playing devils advocate, what are you suggesting as part of your peace process? Allow Putin to have Ukraine and take it back into his control against the will of every Ukrainian? Or just ask him very nicely to stop?

I get you are anti war, I am myself, but I struggle to understand what you are expecting to happen that not only stops the war but is also fair

Even if Russia takes that territory in the east of Ukraine, it will be a hybrid of civil war and guerilla warfare for years and years. There will never be peace there and the Russian rulers will just keep getting attacked and attacked. The citizens will also get treated very harshly by their new rulers and there will be humanitarian issues everywhere. The bodycount will never end.