Welcome Ange: To Dare is to Didgeridoo

[Mrs Vert]

That because our CB is nearly always out of position from a cross from the left
The ball always goes over him and he can’t see it
Either that or he hands the player off to his right back who doesn’t know
Palace
Today
Leicester
That’s off the top of my head

And why doesn't any of our 15 coaches sort that out??!

 

[Mrs Vert]

If we continue to not beat teams below us. We could end up losing 16 this season and still not win a cup

 

[thfcsteff]

The reason our full-backs are knackered is that we have a manager who doesn't care enough about clean sheets. I've said this since day 1 of Ange walking into the club.

Defending at football is a really easy concept. There is a GK who is protected by 2 or 3 centre halves as the first line of defence. There are 2 full-backs and 2 centre mid who are second line of defence protecting the centre halves who are protecting the keeper. It's a very simple system and how you plan your team tactics. The further you keep the opposition away from your keeper the less likely you are to concede.

If you keep a clean sheet then you draw or probably win. Why does Ange think so differently from the other managers?

He operates a different system. I mean, you know this. And in the system he plays -an especially demanding one for inverted attacking FBs- rotation is IMO necessary.

 

[braineclipse]

We just said this on the pod! 100%

The caveat is he must be properly supported across the board. I want to believe Daniel is stepping back and letting Munn/Lange do their thing, but a nagging part of me says that because he ultimately signs the checks, if fans get twitchy then Daniel could get twitchy too.

I think he was backed this summer and last summer.

Was it Levy insisting that we spend a rather significant portion of our transfer budget on teenagers? Or was that a footballing decision?

If it was Levy overruling Munn, Lange and Ange I could see an argument for saying that he wasn't backed. I don't think that was the case.

But when you back a manager focusing heavily on younger players imo part of that backing should be allowing for time to develop the squad over a bit of time, unless it goes horribly wrong in some way. Particularly when combined with being back in Europe. We obviously don't know what Levy, Munn and Lange think about that, we probably won't know unless they end up firing him.

And I still hold hope that some of our teenagers will have a bigger and better impact on the team in the second half of the season than the first.

One of the big issues we have right now is that Porro has played a ton of football and is knackered. Pod mate pointed out Udogie has played even more than Porro. Key positions for our style yet we have beaten those two into a fatigue hole. We really need to get Spence playing and fast, because he is the only natural alternate. When Destiny and Pedro are as overplayed as they currently are, the knock-on for Son and Johnson is massive.

Agreed. We're also asking an awful lot of Son (just back from injury too), Solanke and Johnson.

The injuries to Werner, Richarlison and Odobert have imo been just as impactful as the injury to Spence (and the lack of rotation from Dragusin's red and VdV's injury).

This is first season back in Europe syndrome. The players have to learn and adjust. That takes time. And some of the younger players will have to step up. That also takes time.

 

[Finney Is Back]

it does't have to be the LB, but the widest player in their attack is the one he should be tracking

if there is someone over at the back, as there seems to be every time a cross comes in, thats the winger at fault imo

He is clearly being asked to defend against the opponent’s left back (as Son/Werner are being asked to defend against the opposing right back).

 

[Kompakted]

Team are entertaining to watch for the most part, but horrendously inconsistent at this level and from that perspective we've probably even gone backwards from his first season. Our consistency this season in the league is almost laughable. I've seen nothing so far to suggest my analysis at the beginning of the season is wrong: that we are headed for our lowest points tally and league finish in about a quarter of a century. We are on course to finish about 10th given I expect Man Utd to pick up form.

I am just trying to enjoy the big wins when they come and hope Ange can nick us a cup.

I very much doubt another season of thus will be tolerated by the board however so I think unless he can start next season in a manner consistent enough to suggest a strong top 4 challenge he's toast.

 

[braineclipse]

Team are entertaining to watch for the most part, but horrendously inconsistent at this level and from that perspective we've probably even gone backwards from his first season. Our consistency this season in the league is almost laughable. I've seen nothing so far to suggest my analysis at the beginning of the season is wrong: that we are headed for our lowest points tally and league finish in about a quarter of a century. We are on course to finish about 10th given I expect Man Utd to pick up form.

I am just trying to enjoy the big wins when they come and hope Ange can nick us a cup.

I very much doubt another season of thus will be tolerated by the board however so I think unless he can start next season in a manner consistent enough to suggest a strong top 4 challenge he's toast.

I think we've improved on last season, but are also feeling the effects of more games quite a bit. Perhaps a low bar, but compared to the second half of last season I think we've improved on our performances quite a bit even just looking at the league and ignoring the first season back in Europe thing.

I still think we can find more consistency as the season progresses. If we don't I still hope he's given time.

 

[harr1984]

I think we've improved on last season, but are also feeling the effects of more games quite a bit. Perhaps a low bar, but compared to the second half of last season I think we've improved on our performances quite a bit even just looking at the league and ignoring the first season back in Europe thing.

I still think we can find more consistency as the season progresses. If we don't I still hope he's given time.

Agree. Keep seeing the 'We have gone backwards' comment but thats only if you are looking at the league table from this season vs last. We had no Europe and was already knocked out of the league cup by this stage, we are 3 wins out of 4 in Europe and still in the cup. Navigating all these extra games is always going to put us at a disadvantage in comparison to last season.....

 

[Baleforce]

Agree. Keep seeing the 'We have gone backwards' comment but thats only if you are looking at the league table from this season vs last. We had no Europe and was already knocked out of the league cup by this stage, we are 3 wins out of 4 in Europe and still in the cup. Navigating all these extra games is always going to put us at a disadvantage in comparison to last season.....

We’ve gone backwards with regard to the number of soft goals we concede imo.

 

[Mr Gogolak]

He is exceptional. I’m not his biggest fan. If think he causes us so many issue defensively that if we had a better out and out defender who can pass decently it would be bettee
But I think he is the best CB passer in the world. None get beat him here or Spain from what I’ve seen and in Italy CBs pass very differently
Just my opinion of course
But he jumps like he doesn’t want to win a header and I think he doesn’t realise that if he leaves his man he has to tell someone

I agree and I wonder why nobody ever tried him a little higher up the pitch, either as a the central element in a three-man defence or maybe as a plain old defensive midfielder, where his lapses in concentration would be less damaging.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I agree and I wonder why nobody ever tried him a little higher up the pitch, either as a the central element in a three-man defence or maybe as a plain old defensive midfielder, where his lapses in concentration would be less damaging.

He played in a 3 in Italy
So did dragsuin
The more I see lf cuti the more I see a DM there so I’m with you
I don’t think the player sees it that way though and Ange doesn’t for sure
3 cbs of VDV, Cuti and Dragusin sounds great but the structure of the team would change a lot

 

[Baleforce]

He played in a 3 in Italy
So did dragsuin
The more I see lf cuti the more I see a DM there so I’m with you
I don’t think the player sees it that way though and Ange doesn’t for sure
3 cbs of VDV, Cuti and Dragusin sounds great but the structure of the team would change a lot

Almost certainly for the better imo

 

[Jurgen the German]

Sons cross that game was outstanding and so was the desire of Johnson and solanke to attack the cross
He also was starting to play well at that point before being subbed. Bu5 the whole team upped their game that half
Today he was drifting again, showed his control issues again and shooting from range. He was trying for sure and may well still be unfit but were crying out for a player who will stay wide there and cross, cross, cross and hit the back post for the ball coming the other way
Sonny if we are counter attacking will still be a top threat. I could see him being a brilliant impact sub in games were ahead in
I personally dont care about taking your man on if you still deliver in the key metrics.
I fancy us in the cups. Said it from day one.

But do you not care if his overall play is poor? Like I said it’s great he’s getting more goals but don’t you want more from him considering you’re not happy with Son despite his goals and assists?

 

[Bedfordspurs]

But we do see evidence of repeated moves and set pieces, demonstrating that there is a plan. Is the plan not good enough, considering that Ange there is only one way to play, or has Ange coached the initiative out of the players? Maybe they have become uncreative as they try to stick to the script no matter what.

Sorry I’m talking about defending
And mainly defending crosses
It may be bad coaching but for me we have a guy who is a ball magnet and always seems to try to go to where the ball is
That leaves a space behind him every time where we have a full back is weak in the air and we genially don’t have additional winger cover
Lestah scored form it
Palace did
Ipswich did
Everyone of those we had our right CB heading to the left post. Yesterday was slightly different because he almost won the header

 

[Bedfordspurs]

And why doesn't any of our 15 coaches sort that out??!

Pass
Maybe we’re coaching it but the players natural game is chase the ball
It’s no coincidence that he always goes to the direction of where the ball is on crosses rather than wait to attack it
I was taught your better going forward to a ball rather than backwards

 

[P.D.]

The reason our full-backs are knackered is that we have a manager who doesn't care enough about clean sheets. I've said this since day 1 of Ange walking into the club.

Defending at football is a really easy concept. There is a GK who is protected by 2 or 3 centre halves as the first line of defence. There are 2 full-backs and 2 centre mid who are second line of defence protecting the centre halves who are protecting the keeper. It's a very simple system and how you plan your team tactics. The further you keep the opposition away from your keeper the less likely you are to concede.

If you keep a clean sheet then you draw or probably win. Why does Ange think so differently from the other managers?

Not sure it's that simple to just get a clean sheet but we should definitely be defending better, just read we've gone behind in 13 of 15 home league games this year. That's unacceptable really.

 

[Legohamster]

But do you not care if his overall play is poor? Like I said it’s great he’s getting more goals but don’t you want more from him considering you’re not happy with Son despite his goals and assists?

I was there yesterday and he was very poor, he was so selfish on the ball and seemed to lose the ball whenever he ran at someone

He had quite a few chances to cross the ball and just cut back, was predictable

 

[Legohamster]

Agree. Keep seeing the 'We have gone backwards' comment but thats only if you are looking at the league table from this season vs last. We had no Europe and was already knocked out of the league cup by this stage, we are 3 wins out of 4 in Europe and still in the cup. Navigating all these extra games is always going to put us at a disadvantage in comparison to last season.....

Personally I think at best we are treading water

You are correct about Europe and Cups, however our league form is poor for the squad we have.

Still playing in purple patches only for most games and the few games we don't are the exception.

The people around me where not happy with Ange at all and where talking about replacements - this is only one spot of the ground of course and I'm not suggesting it is the whole ground, but it's a big difference from the last time I was there.

 

[braineclipse]

Not sure it's that simple to just get a clean sheet but we should definitely be defending better, just read we've gone behind in 13 of 15 home league games this year. That's unacceptable really.

It is. It's also absolutely in large part variance.

 

[harr1984]

Personally think at best we are treading water

You are correct about Europe and Cups, however our league form is poor for the squad we have.

Still playing in patches only for most games and the few games we don't are the exception.

The people around me where not happy with Ange at all and where talking about replacements - this is only one spot of the ground of course and I'm not suggesting it is the whole ground, but it's a big difference from the last time I was there.

Agree about consistency/playing in patches, but I don't agree with the 'should be better with the squad we have' argument that gets bought up.

On here alone, different posters are saying we need to prioritise different areas of the team for upgrading - that in itself suggests our squad isn't that great. I've said a few times, I really don't think our squad is as good as many make out, we have a fair few younger players who could in the future be really good but right now? Hardly any you players you could hang your hat on for having consistently good performances, when your most senior player and captain is non existent for large parts of games that in itself is a worry. Looking at it individually:

Vicario - Decent shot stopper, but couldnt say he's that reliable
Porro - Great going forward but defensively suspect
Romero - Nowhere near WC, and nothing to do with Ange. He has been making these fudge ups well before Ange got here, on his day great but not consistent
VDV - We all love him, but defensively he has made plenty of errors. Yes his pace gets him out of trouble but he can't always count on that. Still young with amazing potential though
Udogie - Great potential but for a long time now he hasn't been particularly good.
Bissouma/Bentancur/Sarr - All the same problem, good at some things not good at others. None consistent enough and none at a level good enough for where we want to be. Although will say, Bentancur was close to being there pre injury
Maddison - Same as above really, on his day great quality but not consistent
Kulu - Has been our best performer, usually can rely on him to put in a good performance and high effort levels
Werner - Ideal Ange type winger, has pace and can beat his man. But of course can't finish so not the desired output
Son - Our captain, not inspirational and can't even lead by example on the pitch anymore having lost his burst of pace. Can't beat a man out wide, if only we could combine his finishing with Werner's other assets
Odobert - Looks to have good potential to me, but at this stage that's all it is
Solanke - Like him a lot, and he performs to a good standard now
Johnson - Still feel there could be more to come from him, and at least shows some decent numbers statistically. But we don't play to his strengths and doesn't impact games enough
Richi - I like him and would be great back up/rotation option but can't stay fit

Then we have a handful of young players who have really good potential, but require experience meaning there are going to be lots of bumps in the road for them and us.

So at least to me when I look at our squad I'm not sure why anyone would expect us to be anything more than challenging around the top 6, especially with having Europe aswell? I don't see us with any real top stars to drag us across the line in games we are poor, we have some good players and some really talented ones who arent there yet but I do think some people are overestimating where we are with this squad right now. And that is not me suggesting Ange doesn't have areas he can improve on, but I believe this is a journey where we still have a way to go with a clear long term vision in terms of our recruitment and this will be the case regardless of who is in charge......