Fair play to the families hopefully they get their closure now
Good summary by PaulH is post #2982.
But is there anything in the new report that we didn't know?
We know the Sun invented stories. We know the police covered up their mistakes. We know the Leppings Lane end was a death-trap waiting to happen after previous incidents were ignored. We know that the fans were left to be crushed because police believed it was hooligans in the crowd (which was not an unreasonable assumption given the times) and that ambulances were delayed for similar reasons. Lots of people made mistakes that led of the accident: continued use of Hillsborough by the FA, opening the gate to relieve pressure outside, not directing people to other pens, not allowing fans on the pitch to escape the crushing, and so on. Most of these mistakes were people trying to react to the situation and making bad choices, not an evil plot.
We can have inquiry after inquiry and report after report and the basic facts about the tragedy will remain unchanged. Perhaps a few people can be prosecuted for the the cover up but what will it change? A lot of people went to a football match and didn't return and won't return whatever they do now.
Good summary by PaulH is post #2982.
But is there anything in the new report that we didn't know?
We know the Sun invented stories. We know the police covered up their mistakes. We know the Leppings Lane end was a death-trap waiting to happen after previous incidents were ignored. We know that the fans were left to be crushed because police believed it was hooligans in the crowd (which was not an unreasonable assumption given the times) and that ambulances were delayed for similar reasons. Lots of people made mistakes that led of the accident: continued use of Hillsborough by the FA, opening the gate to relieve pressure outside, not directing people to other pens, not allowing fans on the pitch to escape the crushing, and so on. Most of these mistakes were people trying to react to the situation and making bad choices, not an evil plot.
We can have inquiry after inquiry and report after report and the basic facts about the tragedy will remain unchanged. Perhaps a few people can be prosecuted for the the cover up but what will it change? A lot of people went to a football match and didn't return and won't return whatever they do now.
So Scara, the only reason that people have the perception that the fans robbed from the dead and tinkled on the police is because of the lies that the police spread to the press to cover their own arses. Absolutely disgraceful to think that it is true. I would have thought that you were old enough and wise enough not to read into the brick.
Of course, not everyone are angels in this however not one of those fans going into the ground today though "fudge this, we're going to kick off and cause death".
I am truly astounded by some reactions to this
Its good they have closure. However, it's hard to know the truth and we can all agree Liverpool are no angels. This tragedy happened in an era when hooliganism was at it's peak. Don't forget in 1984 they caused a mini riot in Rome, in 1985 they killed 39 Italian fans. Even, the then uefa president when he first heard about Hillsborough said 'oh it's Liverpool causing trouble again'. If this tragedy happened in a different era, more sympathy and less behind scenes so called fabrication, may not have occurred.
By the way, is their a plaque at Anfield for the 39 Juventus fans killed? Just asking as obviously justice is a very important issue
This.When is the Heysel enquiry due to release it's recommendations?
This.
and Athens 2007
there was no cover up at heysal and 14 people went to jail for manslaughter, obviously should have been more than 14 but some slipped the net
14 and 15 year old kids died at Hillsborough, you’d have to be a completely emotionally departed sociopath to not feel empathy.
For some reason, some people would rather bang out tired old clichés and generalisations rather than empathising when discussing Hillsborough - scousers are thieving scumbags, they were hooligans, they’re always playing the victim blah blah blah, maybe these xenophobic views can be attributed to the fact they don’t actually know any scousers or have never actually been to Liverpool? These types of generalised views do normally come from ignorance. I lived in liverpool for 4 years and the vast majority of scousers are normal people, unsurprisingly like the rest of country (apart from the silly accent), there might be a few thieves and scumbags but that’s the same everywhere isn’t it, check out the crime stats if you don’t believe me, there’s less crime in Liverpool than most big cities.
funny thing about this thread is that the people on the likes of RAWK etc. which seem to get people so riled up and fuel this hatred are probably ****ney reds! who I agree, are a despicable group. all the scousers I met in Liverpool actually had a bit of a soft spot for spurs and always used to say how much they enjoyed playing us and going to WHL etc.
As for heysal, obviously Liverpool fans were responsible but does that mean they were responsible for Hillsborough? was it the same people at both games? or are scousers all identikit human beings who share responsibility for every bad act committed by individuals who happen to live in the same city as them? were those 15 and 16 year old kids at heysal? are there deaths justifiable by the fact they supported the same football team as the scumbags at heysal?
I reckon if there had been a cover up into the cause of my childs death I would have kept fighting until those responsible admitted the truth, whether that be 20 years or more, maybe that’s not the most constructive approach but until you lose a child in such a circumstance I don’t really think you have much right to pass judgement on how others deal with such a horrible situation.
maybe these xenophobic views can be attributed to the fact they don’t actually know any scousers or have never actually been to Liverpool? These types of generalised views do normally come from ignorance.
I've been to Liverpool a couple of times, and it was fudging horrible.
14 and 15 year old kids died at Hillsborough, you’d have to be a completely emotionally departed sociopath to not feel empathy.
For some reason, some people would rather bang out tired old clichés and generalisations rather than empathising when discussing Hillsborough - scousers are thieving scumbags, they were hooligans, they’re always playing the victim blah blah blah, maybe these xenophobic views can be attributed to the fact they don’t actually know any scousers or have never actually been to Liverpool? These types of generalised views do normally come from ignorance. I lived in liverpool for 4 years and the vast majority of scousers are normal people, unsurprisingly like the rest of country (apart from the silly accent), there might be a few thieves and scumbags but that’s the same everywhere isn’t it, check out the crime stats if you don’t believe me, there’s less crime in Liverpool than most big cities.
funny thing about this thread is that the people on the likes of RAWK etc. which seem to get people so riled up and fuel this hatred are probably ****ney reds! who I agree, are a despicable group. all the scousers I met in Liverpool actually had a bit of a soft spot for spurs and always used to say how much they enjoyed playing us and going to WHL etc.
As for heysal, obviously Liverpool fans were responsible but does that mean they were responsible for Hillsborough? was it the same people at both games? or are scousers all identikit human beings who share responsibility for every bad act committed by individuals who happen to live in the same city as them? were those 15 and 16 year old kids at heysal? are there deaths justifiable by the fact they supported the same football team as the scumbags at heysal?
I reckon if there had been a cover up into the cause of my childs death I would have kept fighting until those responsible admitted the truth, whether that be 20 years or more, maybe that’s not the most constructive approach but until you lose a child in such a circumstance I don’t really think you have much right to pass judgement on how others deal with such a horrible situation.
14 and 15 year old kids died at Hillsborough, you’d have to be a completely emotionally departed sociopath to not feel empathy.
For some reason, some people would rather bang out tired old clichés and generalisations rather than empathising when discussing Hillsborough - scousers are thieving scumbags, they were hooligans, they’re always playing the victim blah blah blah, maybe these xenophobic views can be attributed to the fact they don’t actually know any scousers or have never actually been to Liverpool? These types of generalised views do normally come from ignorance. I lived in liverpool for 4 years and the vast majority of scousers are normal people, unsurprisingly like the rest of country (apart from the silly accent), there might be a few thieves and scumbags but that’s the same everywhere isn’t it, check out the crime stats if you don’t believe me, there’s less crime in Liverpool than most big cities.
funny thing about this thread is that the people on the likes of RAWK etc. which seem to get people so riled up and fuel this hatred are probably ****ney reds! who I agree, are a despicable group. all the scousers I met in Liverpool actually had a bit of a soft spot for spurs and always used to say how much they enjoyed playing us and going to WHL etc.
As for heysal, obviously Liverpool fans were responsible but does that mean they were responsible for Hillsborough? was it the same people at both games? or are scousers all identikit human beings who share responsibility for every bad act committed by individuals who happen to live in the same city as them? were those 15 and 16 year old kids at heysal? are there deaths justifiable by the fact they supported the same football team as the scumbags at heysal?
I reckon if there had been a cover up into the cause of my childs death I would have kept fighting until those responsible admitted the truth, whether that be 20 years or more, maybe that’s not the most constructive approach but until you lose a child in such a circumstance I don’t really think you have much right to pass judgement on how others deal with such a horrible situation.