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Steven Bergwijn

Baleforce said:
A lot of games next season, in a compressed first half to the season. I’d like to see some premeditated rotation of the forward players, equalise their minutes before the World Cup.
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Good idea in theory and one I’m not against, but in practice it’s not that easy as 99% of our goals come from the front three and no one else and the options on the bench are a big drop off from the starters. If Conte rests them and we drop points then he knows questions would come his way.
 
I'm with the group that thinks we would be making a mistake selling Stevie. The only reason I can think of that he is not getting more playing time and gets subbed in in injury time, even if we're leading 3-0 since the 60th minute, is because of attitude. Not so much not training hard, but probably being upset and showing it at the lack of his playing time. I go back to that first home win against Leeds where Antonio went wild and all the players were hugging and high-fiving and then you see Stevie with a "whatever" look on his face. That might have been his "Ndombele sub vs Morecambe" moment and not particularly endeared him to Conte.

At the same time, it's not like we had a congested fixture list requiring we rotate a lot. Pretty much a game a week in the last 5 months and the side picked itself. But even with more games, Bergwijn would still be getting more limited playing time than his talent would secure in another team. So it's probably for the best that he leaves. If he does, however, first I would look at a loan to another Prem team. If that's not an option and Ajax really want him, but don't want to pony up the fee we're asking, then just swap him with an Ajax player whose value is closer to the fee we'd want. You get Stevie and give us Gravenberch or Antony plus we'll throw in an extra 5-10 million. And, by the way, I don't understand why Ajax are such penny-pinchers. They sell tens of millions worth of players every year. I'm sure they can afford 25 million for Bergwijn.
 
Come to think of it, we should probably hold on to him until at least the Jan window. He'll get games with the fixture congestion we'll have and, if he tears it up for Holland in the WC, his value is going to rise significantly. If Conte still doesn't want him come January, we can sell him for £35+ million easily. That would be an extra £15m for us just by waiting 6 months. And even if he doesn't have a stormer of a WC, his value still isn't going to drop below £20m.

Now that I'm thinking about it, this might be the way to go with Lo Celso too. Extend his loan to Villareal and sell him after the WC. Obviously some clauses will need to be inserted, but I'm sure Levy can work those out.
 
Jurgen the German said:
Good idea in theory and one I’m not against, but in practice it’s not that easy as 99% of our goals come from the front three and no one else and the options on the bench are a big drop off from the starters. If Conte rests them and we drop points then he knows questions would come his way.
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Maybe we drop points if our main starters are playing every single game with no rest? Or maybe they get injured from the increased stress on their bodies?
I wouldn't advocate for a 50/50 split but maybe like 70/30 or 80/20. I expect Conte to fully utilize the 5-sub rule for next season, so even if it's not Bergwijn sharing minutes with Son, it might be Perisic.
 
alekaras said:
I'm with the group that thinks we would be making a mistake selling Stevie. The only reason I can think of that he is not getting more playing time and gets subbed in in injury time, even if we're leading 3-0 since the 60th minute, is because of attitude. Not so much not training hard, but probably being upset and showing it at the lack of his playing time. I go back to that first home win against Leeds where Antonio went wild and all the players were hugging and high-fiving and then you see Stevie with a "whatever" look on his face. That might have been his "Ndombele sub vs Morecambe" moment and not particularly endeared him to Conte.

At the same time, it's not like we had a congested fixture list requiring we rotate a lot. Pretty much a game a week in the last 5 months and the side picked itself. But even with more games, Bergwijn would still be getting more limited playing time than his talent would secure in another team. So it's probably for the best that he leaves. If he does, however, first I would look at a loan to another Prem team. If that's not an option and Ajax really want him, but don't want to pony up the fee we're asking, then just swap him with an Ajax player whose value is closer to the fee we'd want. You get Stevie and give us Gravenberch or Antony plus we'll throw in an extra 5-10 million. And, by the way, I don't understand why Ajax are such penny-pinchers. They sell tens of millions worth of players every year. I'm sure they can afford 25 million for Bergwijn.
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He doesn't get playing time because of a positional issue

- He plays best on the left and through the center (where Conte actually sees him)
- Means he's effectively competing with Son/Kane who are better than him in every way.
- With only 3 subs, Conte typically looks at WB's/one of CM/Decki
- Lucas gets game time because he's a switch with Decki, can play right and offers a bit of a change

I don't see him really getting more game time, because while 5 subs will help, I just don't see him starting much games.
 
thfcsteff said:
Conte needs to trust his players. IMO he does not trust Bergwijn. In general. The talent is unquestioned.
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Conte sees Bergwjin in training.... JM had him on the pitch a lot and we were losing games. Scores vital goals but seems to get lost in the game from what I've seen of him.

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papaspur said:
Maybe we drop points if our main starters are playing every single game with no rest? Or maybe they get injured from the increased stress on their bodies?
I wouldn't advocate for a 50/50 split but maybe like 70/30 or 80/20. I expect Conte to fully utilize the 5-sub rule for next season, so even if it's not Bergwijn sharing minutes with Son, it might be Perisic.
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I’d like to think he would use the bench more if we had better players.
 
Jurgen the German said:
I’d like to think he would use the bench more if we had better players.
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Midfield was a bit threadbare, with Ndombele, GLC, Dele pushed out and Skipp had a big injury. I do feel bad for Winks at times but he is a fringe player so he won't get a lot of minutes even if other players need a rest.
I get not wanting to experiment with Bergwijn at RWB or LWB. It is hard to give any judgment to players who only are given 5-minute cameos though. I do agree with metalgear though, Bergwijn did play a lot under JM and he wasn't always tearing it up but he is still 24 years old.
 
papaspur said:
Midfield was a bit threadbare, with Ndombele, GLC, Dele pushed out and Skipp had a big injury. I do feel bad for Winks at times but he is a fringe player so he won't get a lot of minutes even if other players need a rest.
I get not wanting to experiment with Bergwijn at RWB or LWB. It is hard to give any judgment to players who only are given 5-minute cameos though. I do agree with metalgear though, Bergwijn did play a lot under JM and he wasn't always tearing it up but he is still 24 years old.
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Tbf to Bergwijn, under Mourinho he was having to be a second right-back, defensive wing-back and right wing forward all at the same time...must've been exhausting tbh...
 
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