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Sick sick world what is wrong with people

Robspur12 said:
Also as much as I would prefer a Labour government to the current shambles, wtf was Starmer thinking by saying it was ok for Israel to withhold water and power in Gaza? I don't understand, you can show that you are not antisemitic while also showing compassion for innocent Palestinians. It doesn't have to be the all or nothing viewpoint that this conflict seems to engender.
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Corbyn made almost any position impossible.
Thankfully David Lammy will be the key voice.
Starmer will be back to cabinet level by the time the second term is contested.
 
The hamas attacks were truly barbaric and unforgivable. If there was a way to only punish the perpetrators I would say anything goes, and that they had forfeited their human rights by their inhumane actions.

the trouble is you can’t equate the actions of these scumbags with the entire population of Gaza.

Bombing and using white phosphorus in civilian areas is also inhumane and unacceptable. Not only is it inhumane and illegal, it actually gives the perpetrators of the Hamas terror attacks exactly what they wanted I.e disruption of the.normalisation of relations with Saudi Arabia and it will be a primary driver of recruitment to hamas or other terrorist organisations that may succeed it.

the people that benefit are the leadership of Hamas who apparently are mostly based overseas.

equally it’s hard to believe that the isaraeli government had no knowledge that such an attack was incoming. It’s quite plausible that Netanyahu was aware of an incoming attack and was prepared to allow it to happen in order to consolidate his power and dampen democratic protest against his increasingly corrupt and authoritarian/dictatorial regime. It’s probably just the scale of the attack which he did not anticipate, and which might just precipitate his downfall.

Once again innocent Israelis and Palestinians suffer as a result of the actions of a minority in power and the cycle of violence will continue unabated. It’s truly tragic.
 
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Crab.C.Nesbitt said:
The hamas attacks were truly barbaric and unforgivable. If there was a way to only punish the perpetrators I would say anything goes, and that they had forfeited their human rights by their inhumane actions.

the trouble is you can’t equate the actions of these scumbags with the entire population of Gaza.

Bombing and using white phosphorus in civilian areas is also inhumane and unacceptable. Not only is it inhumane and illegal, it actually gives the perpetrators of the Hamas terror attacks exactly what they wanted I.e disruption of the.normalisation of relations with Saudi Arabia and it will be a primary driver of recruitment to hamas or other terrorist organisations that may succeed it.

the people that benefit are the leadership of Hamas who apparently are mostly based overseas.

equally it’s hard to believe that the isaraeli government had no knowledge that such an attack was incoming. It’s quite plausible that Netanyahu was aware of an incoming attack and was prepared to allow it to happen in order to consolidate his power and dampen democratic protest against his increasingly corrupt and authoritarian/dictatorial regime. It’s probably just the scale of the attack which he did not anticipate, and which might just precipitate his downfall.

Once again innocent Israelis and Palestinians suffer as a result of the actions of a minority in power and the cycle of violence will continue unabated. It’s truly tragic.
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Some conspiracy theory there! o_O
 
Crab.C.Nesbitt said:
The hamas attacks were truly barbaric and unforgivable. If there was a way to only punish the perpetrators I would say anything goes, and that they had forfeited their human rights by their inhumane actions.

the trouble is you can’t equate the actions of these scumbags with the entire population of Gaza.

Bombing and using white phosphorus in civilian areas is also inhumane and unacceptable. Not only is it inhumane and illegal, it actually gives the perpetrators of the Hamas terror attacks exactly what they wanted I.e disruption of the.normalisation of relations with Saudi Arabia and it will be a primary driver of recruitment to hamas or other terrorist organisations that may succeed it.

the people that benefit are the leadership of Hamas who apparently are mostly based overseas.

equally it’s hard to believe that the isaraeli government had no knowledge that such an attack was incoming. It’s quite plausible that Netanyahu was aware of an incoming attack and was prepared to allow it to happen in order to consolidate his power and dampen democratic protest against his increasingly corrupt and authoritarian/dictatorial regime. It’s probably just the scale of the attack which he did not anticipate, and which might just precipitate his downfall.

Once again innocent Israelis and Palestinians suffer as a result of the actions of a minority in power and the cycle of violence will continue unabated. It’s truly tragic.
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Apparently Egypt warned them about it 4 days before it happened and there was an alarming lack of resistance when it first happened.
 
monkeybarry said:
Corbyn made almost any position impossible.
Thankfully David Lammy will be the key voice.
Starmer will be back to cabinet level by the time the second term is contested.
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Lammy was squirming in the interviews yesterday morning, given he and Starmer are both lawyers it's incredible neither can give a concrete opinion one way or the other.
 
monkeybarry said:
Now, yes. NOT before Israel dropped more bombs on the area that the US dropped in ONE YEAR in Afghanistan.
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I'd imagine there was a time sensitive element to taking out those areas. Given that Hamas doesn't have military bases and hides behind civilians, I suspect that intel is fairly short lived and strikes have to take place as soon as it's received.

Again, Hamas are hiding behind civilians, Hamas are bringing those civilians into the war.
 
The problem with the “hiding behind civilians” rhetoric is that Gaza is a small and incredibly densely populated area. I’m not sure that it’s possible for Hamas to exist in any part of Gaza and not have civilians in close proximity.
 
Crab.C.Nesbitt said:
The problem with the “hiding behind civilians” rhetoric is that Gaza is a small and incredibly densely populated area. I’m not sure that it’s possible for Hamas to exist in any part of Gaza and not have civilians in close proximity.
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Shouldn't hamas be advising their constituents to take shelter etc. Put themselves in front of their citizens and do all the can to protect them?
 
Grays_1890 said:
The issue is, unfortunately that very much like the "Hamas want all Jews dead" the western world believes there is more value to some lives than others, its the reason we so easily glean over Iraq and now are happy to see a frankly laughable reclassification of the word "defence" to justify killing hundred if not thousands of innocent people. Its really fine lines between the two now, if you consider its acceptable to slaughter innocent people its more than likely because its comes with equal prejudice against their religion or colour of their skin.
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It is the case that lives have more value in Western nations. (How is that?) Part of the sympathy for Palestine comes from the immediate contrast in living conditions. There is an onus on Israel to be the better side, and to act more responsibly because it has more resources. You could counter that many commentators based in the West, in their own relative comfort, don't compare themselves to impoverished peoples - because they are so geographically far away. Commentators are quick to say Isreal should do this and that. But there so many impoverished peoples and what are the righteous in the west doing to assist? Posting! :D Just part of the complexity.
 
SpurMeUp said:
It is the case that lives have more value in Western nations. (How is that?) Part of the sympathy for Palestine comes from the immediate contrast in living conditions. There is an onus on Israel to be the better side, and to act more responsibly because it has more resources. You could counter that many commentators based in the West, in their own relative comfort, don't compare themselves to impoverished peoples - because they are so geographically far away. Commentators are quick to say Isreal should do this and that. But there so many impoverished peoples and what are the righteous in the west doing to assist? Posting! :D Just part of the complexity.
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Its not that complex TBH. Sympathy comes from the same place, it a human nature reaction, well it is for anyone with any real sense of feeling and heart. The idea of having people having their throat slit for being a Jew is horrific, the idea of someone having a bomb dropped on their head for daring to live somewhere that might be close to where someone's hiding is equally horrific. That's nothing to do with living conditions.
 
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