Richarlison

[Jurgen the German]

We should always look to upgrade. If we can find someone for the same money that we think is better, do it. If not, don't.

I agree. I just don’t think we should be actively looking to replace him at this stage. Can always reassess in January if he hasn’t tuned his form around by then.

 

[Baleforce]

You can keep downplaying the importance of goals but it is a forward’s primary function. It’s not the only thing they need to do but that’s ultimately what they are paid to do and why they are in the team. If they can’t score then at least create. He has worked hard but I can’t think of a single goal this season where he has been instrumental in the the build up, getting the assist etc. It’s not like we have struggled without his presence against Burnley or when he has been substituted.

If Ange goes with Richarlison over Solomon next Saturday then that’s fine with me but not down the centre, Son is clearly the better finisher and can do a better job for us in that position.

Every player on the pitch is paid to do what the coach tells them to do, it's pieces on the chessboard and the aim is to force the opponent into a mistake.

Son is a better finisher, no argument there, he's one of the top 5 forwards on the planet, there isn't a better one in the PL (although Haaland is just as good), not being as good as Son is something any other forward we sign would have to deal with. I think there is a place for both in our team. Sometimes grit is going to be more important than guile.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Every player on the pitch is paid to do what the coach tells them to do, it's pieces on the chessboard and the aim is to force the opponent into a mistake.

Son is a better finisher, no argument there, he's one of the top 5 forwards on the planet, there isn't a better one in the PL (although Haaland is just as good), not being as good as Son is something any other forward we sign would have to deal with. I think there is a place for both in our team. Sometimes grit is going to be more important than guile.

I highly doubt Ange is telling Richarlison he doesn’t have to score, or create. Nor do I think his role is to disrupt and create space and do nothing else but if that’s your view then fair enough. Time will tell if Ange is happy with his output judging by the starting lineup going forward. He got hauled off against United and Bournemouth, both games we were 1-0 up and won both games 2-0 so we’ve hardly struggled when he has been subbed.

 

[Baleforce]

I highly doubt Ange is telling Richarlison he doesn’t have to score, or create. Nor do I think his role is to disrupt and create space and do nothing else but if that’s your view then fair enough. Time will tell if Ange is happy with his output judging by the starting lineup going forward. He got hauled off against United and Bournemouth, both games we were 1-0 up and won both games 2-0 so we’ve hardly struggled when he has been subbed.

I don't think any coach tells players they "need" to score or create, they tell them to keep doing the right things, and the right things do involve disruption and space creation.

We've not really struggled at all this season, only when we've done stupid things, but we haven't played a competent team yet.

 

[Jurgen the German]

I don't think any coach tells players they "need" to score or create, they tell them to keep doing the right things, and the right things do involve disruption and space creation.

We've not really struggled at all this season, only when we've done stupid things, but we haven't played a competent team yet.

But it’s kind of implied in his position that he needs to contribute goals and to create. It’s not just about hard work. I agree there will be times his physicality will be important but I think you’re overestimating his importance at the same time. Completely separate from his goal output, one thing that drives me nuts about him is his tendency to spend so much time on the floor. He’s a big guy but he gets bullied by smaller defenders and tries to buy free kicks when it would make more sense to stay on his feet.

 

[Baleforce]

But it’s kind of implied in his position that he needs to contribute goals and to create. It’s not just about hard work. I agree there will be times his physicality will be important but I think you’re overestimating his importance at the same time. Completely separate from his goal output, one thing that drives me nuts about him is his tendency to spend so much time on the floor. He’s a big guy but he gets bullied by smaller defenders and tries to buy free kicks when it would make more sense to stay on his feet.

Is it implied?

How do you grade contribution, do you need to touch the ball to impact a move?

We don't know what the instructions are, we have many excellent FK takers, it's a scenario our transfer business made us much stronger at over the summer.

I don't think any PL manager worth their salt tells players to stay on their feet in and around the box. It might drive you crazy but it's pragmatic football.

 

[Lilbaz]

Is it implied?

How do you grade contribution, do you need to touch the ball to impact a move?

We don't know what the instructions are, we have many excellent FK takers, it's a scenario our transfer business made us much stronger at over the summer.

I don't think any PL manager worth their salt tells players to stay on their feet in and around the box. It might drive you crazy but it's pragmatic football.

Richarlison has had chances to score this season and fluffed them. It doesn't need to be implied that he should have done better with them. Even if he is doing good work off the ball.

Does that mean he is brick and useless? No ofcourse not. Does it mean he should do better? Yes.

And yes every player can do better. But it's getting to the point that he might not be first choice cf.

 

[Baleforce]

Richarlison has had chances to score this season and fluffed them. It doesn't need to be implied that he should have done better with them. Even if he is doing good work off the ball.

Does that mean he is brick and useless? No ofcourse not. Does it mean he should do better? Yes.

And yes every player can do better. But it's getting to the point that he might not be first choice cf.

That’s a different argument.

Is it implied, that players selected in certain positions in a formation, “have” to score goals, or they are not fulfilling the tactical remit they are given?

Agree with the statements in your post.

 

[Lilbaz]

That’s a different argument.

Is it implied, that players selected in certain positions in a formation, “have” to score goals, or they are not fulfilling the tactical remit they are given?

Agree with the statements in your post.

If the team are creating chances for that position then yes the player has to score some of them. He might have other duties aswell.

If you have a job with a number of different duties, but you are consistently not doing one of them. There is a problem.

 

[Kandi1977]

But it’s kind of implied in his position that he needs to contribute goals and to create. It’s not just about hard work. I agree there will be times his physicality will be important but I think you’re overestimating his importance at the same time. Completely separate from his goal output, one thing that drives me nuts about him is his tendency to spend so much time on the floor. He’s a big guy but he gets bullied by smaller defenders and tries to buy free kicks when it would make more sense to stay on his feet.

Jezuz christ.....

 

[Gazza]

Richarlison has had chances to score this season and fluffed them. It doesn't need to be implied that he should have done better with them. Even if he is doing good work off the ball.

Does that mean he is brick and useless? No ofcourse not. Does it mean he should do better? Yes.

And yes every player can do better. But it's getting to the point that he might not be first choice cf.

Is it strange to ask a question and answer it yourself? Yes

 

[Jurgen the German]

Is it implied?

How do you grade contribution, do you need to touch the ball to impact a move?

We don't know what the instructions are, we have many excellent FK takers, it's a scenario our transfer business made us much stronger at over the summer.

I don't think any PL manager worth their salt tells players to stay on their feet in and around the box. It might drive you crazy but it's pragmatic football.

Yes it’s implied that a forward is in the team primarily to score goals. Not sure why that has to be spelled out. Just like the goalkeeper’s main priority is to keep clean sheets.

 

[Kandi1977]

Yes it’s implied that a forward is in the team primarily to score goals. Not sure why that has to be spelled out. Just like the goalkeeper’s main priority is to keep clean sheets.

So in the same way, as you've spelled out here, we should be looking at replacing the goalkeeper when he concedes a goal or make a mistake?

 

[Jurgen the German]

So in the same way, as you've spelled out here, we should be looking at replacing the goalkeeper when he concedes a goal or make a mistake?

If you read my posts I’ve not said anything of the sort. I’ve said he needs time to come good and have pushed back against the view that we should sell him. But I’m not going to pretend he’s playing well when he isn’t. Granted he is working hard but forward play isn’t just about tiring out defences and hard work and I disagree with Baleforce’s view that a forward’s role is to do anything but score. He probably doesn’t even believe that himself, he’s just on one of his windups going over the top praising players who underperform and underplaying Son’s finishing last week saying they were tap ins.

 

[Baleforce]

If you read my posts I’ve not said anything of the sort. I’ve said he needs time to come good and have pushed back against the view that we should sell him. But I’m not going to pretend he’s playing well when he isn’t. Granted he is working hard but forward play isn’t just about tiring out defences and hard work and I disagree with Baleforce’s view that a forward’s role is to do anything but score. He probably doesn’t even believe that himself, he’s just on one of his windups going over the top praising players who underperform and underplaying Son’s finishing last week saying they were tap ins.

don’t remember saying that, what I have said,
is there is more to forward play than goals

 

[Jurgen the German]

don’t remember saying that, what I have said,
is there is more to forward play than goals

Of course there is but his overall play hasn’t even been as good as you are making out it has been. He hasn’t created chances or been involved in the buildup in any of our goals.

 

[Bishop]

So in the same way, as you've spelled out here, we should be looking at replacing the goalkeeper when he concedes a goal or make a mistake?

We had a keeper who wasn't saving bricks anymore, he was even just throwing them into his own net so we replaced him. That's how it works, put in substandard performances and fail to hit the minimum requirements and you will be surplus to requirements in the medium term.

don’t remember saying that, what I have said,
is there is more to forward play than goals

Let's not beat around the bush. A striker's primary responsibility is to score goals. If they're not scoring then it's creating. Having someone who presses the defenders, who creates space, who is just an all around nuisance are great additional attributes to have. But they in addition to the primary tasks of scoring first or creating.

I also wanted to make a point to you that your overstating Richy's nuisance factor vis a vis Son's. Son also tires defenders out, he just does it in a different way. He's constantly making runs, looking for space keeping the defenders on their toes because they know Son will always make a run even if he has fluffed the previous 5. Tiring defenders is not just about banging into them physically. Mental fatigue is much worse and harder to recover from than sheer physical exhaustion. Son doesn't even need to be having a good game to do this, he'll just keep making last line runs no matter how brick he's played, that keeps defenders on their toes.

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[SpurMeUp]

Allegedly the saudis tried to get richarlison after failing to get salah.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/ittihad-salah-saudi-transfer-alternative-30903196

Would be good to sell him in Jan for 70m.

 

[Bishop]

Would be good to sell him in Jan for 70m.

I'd be surprised if we could get that big a few for him. I suppose we'd want to break even at the least.

Also not sure if we can sell him in January especially if we don't have another striker option either starting to show promise (Veliz) or as a possible transfer.

In the meantime we should try as best we can to get it working for him, although admittedly I do think Son is the better striking option.

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[SpurMeUp]

I'd be surprised if we could get that big a few for him. I suppose we'd want to break even at the least.

Also not sure if we can sell him in January especially if we don't have another striker option either starting to show promise (Veliz) or as a possible transfer.

In the meantime we should try as best we can to get it working for him, although admittedly I do think Son is the better striking option.

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Saudi Arabia. They were offering 150m for Salah. Less than half the price for Brazil's striker?