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Putin & Russia

braineclipse said:
Most people agree with this.

The point about Godwin's law is perfectly aligned with that.

It's more a comment on the general level of discourse, particularly online.

Comparisons to Hitler when it isn't warranted isn't learning from history. It's using a part of history as a rhetorical device and sometimes antithetical to learning from history.

But of course "Godwin's law", like all types of discourse gets misused and abused.
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I do not think Putin is like Hitler in one sense. In another, we cannot ignore the fact that once again, a powerful dictatorial man has spent years softening up various people in power around the globe and is now looking to exercise such 'favours' by sliding in and slowly turning a screw which could see more incursions take place. I am not naive; there are many sides to the subplot here, but the main one is that everyone knew what Putin could be/become/was yet somehow, here we are. We never learn. And I think this is a dangerous situation.
 
Still no EU ban on Gazbank.....

Stil no no-fly zone........

This really isn't good enough.

Still, at least Biden's doing his bit to help the people of Iran.
 
Rorschach said:
FSB tipoff? Um.. what?
https://twitter.com/x/status/1498801996681428999
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Read a take on this.

Makes sense as false information, make the FSB question themselves and go on a mole hunt. Can't make it easier to do their job during the war.

Superficially at least, why announce it if it's true? Would be better to keep it a secret. If they trust that the source cannot be identified though it makes for a good power play narrative. See, even some of your own are against this war.

Who knows though?
 
scaramanga said:
Still no EU ban on Gazbank.....

Stil no no-fly zone........

This really isn't good enough.

Still, at least Biden's doing his bit to help the people of Iran.
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Can understand a no fly zone being a difficult one. Could mean direct conflict between Russian and NATO planes. I know you're less concerned about escalation than some, but the concern should at least be obvious from a viewpoint that escalating should be avoided.
 
braineclipse said:
Can understand a no fly zone being a difficult one. Could mean direct conflict between Russian and NATO planes. I know you're less concerned about escalation than some, but the concern should at least be obvious from a viewpoint that escalating should be avoided.
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It's not an easy decision, I get that.

The sanctions are clearly hurting Russian people, but not nearly as much as Ukranian ones are suffering. Russian troops are on the doorsteps of some very large cities and these sanctions aren't yet turning them around.

There has to come a point very soon where those able to do something (who, therefore have a responsibility to do something IMO) have to do what it takes to stop them.

I'd say escalation should be avoided but that has to include actions in Ukraine too. If military action is the only way to stop that then it must be taken.
 
scaramanga said:
It's not an easy decision, I get that.

The sanctions are clearly hurting Russian people, but not nearly as much as Ukranian ones are suffering. Russian troops are on the doorsteps of some very large cities and these sanctions aren't yet turning them around.

There has to come a point very soon where those able to do something (who, therefore have a responsibility to do something IMO) have to do what it takes to stop them.

I'd say escalation should be avoided but that has to include actions in Ukraine too. If military action is the only way to stop that then it must be taken.
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Sanctions won't turn them around any time soon. That's not on the table, won't happen imo. Longer term sanctions will have an effect I believe.

We see the escalation thing differently. I just ask that you try to also see it from the viewpoint of someone more concerned than you about that.
 
braineclipse said:
Sanctions won't turn them around any time soon. That's not on the table, won't happen imo. Longer term sanctions will have an effect I believe.

We see the escalation thing differently. I just ask that you try to also see it from the viewpoint of someone more concerned than you about that.
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I do see how others might prioritise their own comfort over the security of Ukranian people - after all, the EU, UK and US have all made that public policy.

I don't think Putin would break a no-fly zone if NATO set one up. A quick and complete destruction of any aircraft in that area would be an embarrassing loss for him and only serve to make a war with any NATO country less palatable to non-Putin Russians.
 
Germany is apparently "Prepared in case Russia stops supplying them gas"

How about you put your money where your mouth is and stop buying it? You know, do something that will likely have an actual effect.
 
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