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Putin & Russia

Mr_B said:
is Putin sick, does he have cancer/parkinsons etc, is this propaganda from "us"?
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It is nothing but conjecture at this point really. The evidence being presented is thin enough - the long tables, the interview where he was clutching the arm of his chair, and a vid where his hand started shaking. And supposedly one of the oligarchs has confirmed he has blood cancer, though they are not an unbiased source either. No one knows.
 
Robbo said:
This thread will be "The WW3 thread" before long.
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Its inevitable that it will happen. Sides are being formed. Talk of Russia striking back against countries who dare to support Ukraine. Talk of Russia wanting to move on after Ukraine to other countries. Economic crisis with food and fuel largely affected. Its likely that WW3 has already started its just that it hasn’t been labelled as such yet.
 
Military Escalation. Stray missile into Russian territory could have severe consequences.
The US the main instigator without any responsibility or accountability....does Nato actually want this?

I believe Russia will now want to hold out until winter to see what happens. if extreme weather conditions persist, it might lead to domestic unrest across Europe.

Lol who knows maybe the US and Putin are independently hoping for a destabilised Europe to cement their superpower status.


https://twitter.com/x/status/1531838952801550342




Sent from my SM-T865 using Fapatalk
 
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/busines...g-cowardice-ukraine-has-given-new-life-putin/

Europe’s appalling cowardice over Ukraine has given new life to Putin

Half hearted Russian oil ban highlights EU’s difficulty in imposing effective sanctions

JEREMY WARNER 31 May 2022 • 6:43pm

The tables seem to have turned once again. Slowly but surely, Putin is regaining the initiative in his murderous assault on Ukraine. That’s partly down to a more competent, if extraordinarily destructive, military campaign.

But it is also because the Western alliance assembled against him is quite plainly fracturing, particularly within the European Union, where — predictably — it is proving virtually impossible to agree the common, hardline approach required to help Ukraine defeat Vladimir Putin’s ambitions. Volodymyr Zelensky sense of outraged grievance is entirely justified. He is being badly let down.

As it is, Europe continues, through its purchases of Russian oil and gas, to finance the Kremlin’s rampage to the tune of nearly $1bn (£790m) a day. That it should do this while coincidentally promising to supply the military hardware Ukraine needs to defend itself would be laughable were not the consequences so calamitous.

The initial bravado of uncompromising sanctions against Russia has given way to messy half measures, and the pursuit of unconditional Russian defeat has softened to include some sort of a peace deal that would see Ukraine give up large tracts of its territory.

Arms shipments are meanwhile falling short, while the intended EU ban on Russian oil has been watered down so as to exclude Hungary. Even as the European Commission demands that everyone holds the line, Italy has explicitly called for peace talks that would cede ground to Putin.

The suspicion that even France and Germany are preparing to sell Zelensky down the river has been heightened by a recent joint telephone call from France’s Emmanuel Macron and Germany’s Olaf Scholz to Putin’s Kremlin.

It is as if Europe’s heart isn’t really in Ukraine’s struggle. Economic self interest is taking priority over principled defence of democracy.

In any case, the gap between the hardline rhetoric and the seeming reality of willingness to compromise grows by the day.

Putin must be laughing all the way to the bank, because the most palpable consequence so far of the EU’s half hearted oil embargo has been to further turbocharge the oil price.

The higher it goes, the more Putin makes, even at the discounted prices he is forced to accept as Europe scales back its purchases. Be it China or India, there will always be willing alternative buyers.

It all looked so different a month ago. Thanks to the bravery of the Ukrainian people, Putin’s efforts to overrun the county had been thwarted. European leaders spoke boldly of willingness to bear the economic hardship of banning imports of Russian oil and gas.

In a speech to the European Parliament, Ursula Von der Leyen, the European Commission President, confidently predicted a European-wide ban on Russian oil “within days”.

In the event, it has taken her four weeks to hammer out a deal, and even then it has come at the price of giving Hungary’s Putin sympathising Viktor Orban an exemption.

Orban has used his veto over any embargo to maximum effect, once again highlighting the difficulty Europe faces in imposing effective punishment on Russia for its growing litany of war crimes, and indeed more broadly the tortuous process of getting almost anything done in Europe when the approval of 27 different nations is first required.

Quite where all this leaves the “integrity” of Europe’s single market, defended to the last in negotiations with the UK over Brexit and Irish Protocol, is anyone’s guess. It plainly means nothing in the case of Hungary.

With the world bifurcating into effectively two separate oil markets — cheap Russian product and the more expensively priced output from elsewhere that the EU has committed itself to — the Hungarian carve out gives a natural and unfair competitive advantage over all others in the EU. Hungary’s industries and refineries will continue to enjoy the fruits of heavily discounted Russian energy, while everyone else has to pay through the nose at an ever inflating market price for alternatives.

The whole sorry mess raises serious questions about whether an oil embargo is an effective form of sanction in the first place. Russia is the world’s largest exporter of gas, and one of the largest of oil.

Excluding it from European and American markets is, through higher prices, doing untold damage to the economies of the West while failing to deny Putin the funding he needs to finance his war.

In its hunt for alternative buyers, the Kremlin is being forced to offer bargain basement prices, but will still be in the money, such has been the inflationary effect on overarching international oil prices.

It is increasingly questionable who is damaged most by the embargo — Putin or the West. Still, Europe’s suggested ban is I suppose progress of sorts.
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I don't know what the fudge Hungary is still doing in the EU anyway. An institution with anything resembling morals or integrity would have kicked them out by now.
 
The sooner we can use renewables for our energy needs the better. If we had a war-like footing to become energy independent within 18-24 months, we could probably do it. If we absolutely had to.

Yet again the west has fueled war without being decisive and effective. We've increased the destruction and loss of life, and we're now in a similar position to Russia, in that we can't reverse our course. We can only put in more arms now to sustain a stalemate and more war. It is a horrendous situation. Rather than hit Russia with an economic war we'd win and was a logical plan, we've been sucked into a real war, while still paying Putin billions anyway. A fiasco that was sadly so predictable.
 
El Guepardo said:
Its inevitable that it will happen. Sides are being formed. Talk of Russia striking back against countries who dare to support Ukraine. Talk of Russia wanting to move on after Ukraine to other countries. Economic crisis with food and fuel largely affected. Its likely that WW3 has already started its just that it hasn’t been labelled as such yet.
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It's almost as if a financial crisis just over a decade before followed by divisive self serving politics and rising inequality creates a platform for despots to use the situation to empower themselves for their tyrannical ways and get the backing of the people that lose out to economic and social models that don't serve them.

Who knew......
 
scaramanga said:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/busines...g-cowardice-ukraine-has-given-new-life-putin/



I don't know what the fudge Hungary is still doing in the EU anyway. An institution with anything resembling morals or integrity would have kicked them out by now.
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Literally to stop Russia having an easy central European outpost.

Hungary is the perfect example of the good and bad of unfettered immigration and a country growing since the fall of communism.
Hungary, certainly in its bigger cities, is very western. As are the generations since the fall of communism (think people 40/45 and under). However, enough of those no longer live in Hungary to keep the impact and influence of the older generations on Hungary.

So whilst most Hungarians are very western looking, the ones that are resident/have political influence are still aligned to an ideology where "everyone had a job", "everyone had somewhere to live", "there was no poverty" (relative of course).
It's easy to overlook the torture and the massacres and romantice the time.

It creates a really interesting discussion re; the role and purpose of the EU and it's values too.
Values wise, as you've raised, Hungary shouldn't be in the EU. But to do that would
I. Turn "our" backs on the forward thinking Hungarians. (Hungary is a fascinating country - it's not dissimilar to Scotland in the brilliant things it's citizens has invented. And whilst it's considered a lesser nation now, let's not forget it's only just over a century since it was leader of the world's largest empire)
II. Gives Hungary to Russia in a heartbeat and puts Russia bang in the middle of the EU. And almost certainly war.

That, of course, brings a very interesting angle to the argument of many leavers re: the over politicisation of the EU and it's sphere of influence.
 
SpurMeUp said:
The sooner we can use renewables for our energy needs the better. If we had a war-like footing to become energy independent within 18-24 months, we could probably do it. If we absolutely had to.

Yet again the west has fueled war without being decisive and effective. We've increased the destruction and loss of life, and we're now in a similar position to Russia, in that we can't reverse our course. We can only put in more arms now to sustain a stalemate and more war. It is a horrendous situation. Rather than hit Russia with an economic war we'd win and was a logical plan, we've been sucked into a real war, while still paying Putin billions anyway. A fiasco that was sadly so predictable.
Click to expand...

We could be energy independent in a few days, but it would mean reverting back to coal. Neo-liberalism also led us to cheaper Russian oil and gas than exploiting our own North Sea reserves. But I don't think that's the right path for obvious ecological reasons.

I agree with the war footing though. We should accelerate offshore wind and solar (mandatory on every roof, except heritage ones) massively. And put an immediate ban on the sale of all new non-EVs. Try and get to where Norway and Uruguay are (basically 95% green energy) within 2-3 years.
 
monkeybarry said:
Literally to stop Russia having an easy central European outpost.

Hungary is the perfect example of the good and bad of unfettered immigration and a country growing since the fall of communism.
Hungary, certainly in its bigger cities, is very western. As are the generations since the fall of communism (think people 40/45 and under). However, enough of those no longer live in Hungary to keep the impact and influence of the older generations on Hungary.

So whilst most Hungarians are very western looking, the ones that are resident/have political influence are still aligned to an ideology where "everyone had a job", "everyone had somewhere to live", "there was no poverty" (relative of course).
It's easy to overlook the torture and the massacres and romantice the time.

It creates a really interesting discussion re; the role and purpose of the EU and it's values too.
Values wise, as you've raised, Hungary shouldn't be in the EU. But to do that would
I. Turn "our" backs on the forward thinking Hungarians. (Hungary is a fascinating country - it's not dissimilar to Scotland in the brilliant things it's citizens has invented. And whilst it's considered a lesser nation now, let's not forget it's only just over a century since it was leader of the world's largest empire)
II. Gives Hungary to Russia in a heartbeat and puts Russia bang in the middle of the EU. And almost certainly war.

That, of course, brings a very interesting angle to the argument of many leavers re: the over politicisation of the EU and it's sphere of influence.
Click to expand...
Some excellent points.

I think a good balance would have been to make acceptable values in their legal and political system a prerequisite to membership.
 
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